Litening for Hornet

Seriously, LITENING was asked about countless times since the Hornet was first announced.

Always no no no.

Makes me think ATFLIR and the new infrared rendering development are not going well at all. LITENING is clearly plan B, hopefully a relatively painless plug and play for the dev team.

No, this does not lead to the conclusion that things are not going well. It only shows that they are complex and take more time. We can't have them in a short time, and we need to target the pod badly. By copying A10C's TGP code, we can greatly reduce the time required, and we will get a targeting pod faster to solve the problem of "yes" and "no". After we had the AGM88 missile, we soon had the TGP.

Which of those two pods is better or more advanced?

 

LITENING or ATFLIR?

In the game, ATFLIR is more advanced than LITENING. ATFLIR allows us to have the forward-looking infrared needed for night flights and even the same hot spot tracking capabilities as AV8B. At the same time, ATFLIR does not need to occupy heavy hanging points, we can use them to mount more sub-tanks, LITENING often needs to occupy a heavy hanging point, which will reduce our external fuel consumption.

Is it centerline ONLY? That would be not be an ideal situation because the Hornet already has kinda short legs if you ask me, I use the center liner mostly for a bag. Anyway, nice to see that we get a TGP earlier then expected! I think its fairly pointless to argue why they did not do it sooner, they probably had their reasons for it.

I think it's great news, and the right thing to do especially if there are things that are delaying the ATFLIR. It will be up to us to maintain the level of realism we want.

Just because a jet is 'designed' so that it can be smashed into the deck doesn't mean, in the real world, you would want to force that wear on hardware or wetware (people)... but this is OUR sim and if one wants to flare, they can flare.. and if one wants to smash, they can smash.. we don't have to pay for maintenance or feel the results.. so except for technical details, let's leave that discussion to just "to each their own (sim)"

Back to the pod, i hope the work on the IR rendering continues with a decent priority. I am not sure how portable the code will be, but there are a lot of aircraft that would benefit from improved IR camera views, something that has been a topic of discussion for many years.

interesting as back when features were announced it was not planned, wags and CO seemed adamant that " no litening" as this was a USN simulated lot 20 hornet. ( AFAIK lot 20s based on the known BUNO #s were in use by the USN specifically)

, the more features the merrier, and if it means getting any kind of TGP sooner ( probably just a copy paste job from A10C?) i really cant complain.

I agree on the timing prospect. Integration into the hornet is another thing to factor in.

I would like to get any material that highlights difference between the AA/AQ-28 ALTFLIR targeting pod and the AN/AAQ-28 litening targeting pod.

doesn't appear there is a substantial difference. both are closely matched in terms in capabilities

ATFLIR is a bit lighter, , however is more costly in price to the litening. Unlike the ATFLIR it appears the Lightening pod is carried on the Centerline Pylon

in the US, only the USMC uses Litening but only when operating from land ( 3/4ths of the time) . On carriers, they operate the ATFLIR largely for the sake of commonality with USN legacy hornets ( 1/4th of the time) . US navy only operates the ATFLIR irregardless if from carrier or from land.

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a498288.pdf

.... Flew with the lpod on the cheek exclusively.

EDIT: as this has been a conversation that has raged on, i need to make a correction. I tend to use "lpod" to mean all "pods" in the same way i use the word "coke" to refer to all sodas, my mistake.

The AT pod is what i should have specifically said here. For further clarification you can find me on discord.

Why “review” the LITENING in the A-10C? The only commonality will be the physical capabilities of the pod (ie magnification, the fact is has LSS and a designation capability etc.) and the pod generated symbology (crosshairs, yardstick, laser status).

Most of the display symbology and all the control functions are aircraft dependent as so vary from platform to platform. And given the significant avionics interface differences between the Hog and Hornet it’s not likely to be that similar.

Not gonna happen.

I agree. The integration will take time. My personal expectations are that if Litening is made a priority maaaaaybe we’ll get it in March. ATFLIR and the new IR graphics...hopefully by the end of the year.

interesting as back when features were announced it was not planned, wags and CO seemed adamant that " no litening" as this was a USN simulated lot 20 hornet. ( AFAIK lot 20s based on the known BUNO #s were in use by the USN specifically)

 

, the more features the merrier, and if it means getting any kind of TGP sooner ( probably just a copy paste job from A10C?) i really cant complain.

USMC Squadrons, specifically VMFA-323 and possibly VMFA-232 have taken ownership of Lot 20’s handed over from USN squadrons transitioning to the Super Hornet.

Thanks Lex for claryfying.

But you used the ATFLIR pod, right?

How far to the side could look in level flight with a centerline tank?

Do you remember how much bank you used to circle when you stayed in an area and looked for an target?

Thanks for sharing your knowledge,

Best Regards from Austria

USMC Squadrons, specifically VMFA-323 and possibly VMFA-232 have taken ownership of Lot 20’s handed over from USN squadrons transitioning to the Super Hornet.

no need to copy paste a reply from another thread based on a different response from a wishlist thread back from time when Litening pod was not confirmed or planned :

but two can play at this game:

Yes and the last operational squadron to use lot 20's was VMA 34, which retired from that specific USN squadron only recently in late 2018. Second last USN squadron to use Lot 20, was the VMA 131 ( exact BUNO # 165407 as we have F/A18 hornet in game was assigned to that specific SQN) which flew them until September 2017

 

 

the Hornet in DCS is aimed to be a "mid 2000s" Hornet. Back then all LOT20's were still being used only by the USN based on the BUNO #'s. and allotted time frame, therefore this Lot 20 would not be in USMC hand me down service plane until 12-13 years later, this would have been the situation during the ED's development and prior to F18 EA launch

At least this was aimed at a mid 2000s, and this certainly would have been the case based on at the time of the Hornet development and prior to EA launch of the Lot 20 being in use only with US Navy known to ED.

No, this does not lead to the conclusion that things are not going well. It only shows that they are complex and take more time. We can't have them in a short time, and we need to target the pod badly. By copying A10C's TGP code, we can greatly reduce the time required, and we will get a targeting pod faster to solve the problem of "yes" and "no". After we had the AGM88 missile, we soon had the TGP.

Yes, it seems we’re in agreement but you just didn’t care for my use of the words “not going well”. It’s pretty clear their internal timeframes have slid by quite a bit. We’re repeatedly told for last three-ish years no LITENING, told for last eight months ATFLIR coming soon, and then surprisingly LITENING coming soon and later ATFLIR. I’d say it’s quite obvious that development of ATFLIR, or IR rendering, or both, has not gone as expected (if those words are more preferable for you).

Notice please I do not pass any negative judgement on ED, I’ve been around long enough to know how things work here. Im happy we’re getting LITENING and as far as I’m concerned we’ll get the new toys when they’re ready. I know it’s hard work, the guys making this stuff are modern wizards.

If Lex is this Lex: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPqnAPcQSxyCqJ0CZu9qMmg

I would just listen to him.

Yes, it seems we’re in agreement but you just didn’t care for my use of the words “not going well”. It’s pretty clear their internal timeframes have slid by quite a bit. We’re repeatedly told for last three-ish years no LITENING, told for last eight months ATFLIR coming soon, and then surprisingly LITENING coming soon and later ATFLIR. I’d say it’s quite obvious that development of ATFLIR, or IR rendering, or both, has not gone as expected (if those words are more preferable for you).

Notice please I do not pass any negative judgement on ED, I’ve been around long enough to know how things work here. Im happy we’re getting LITENING and as far as I’m concerned we’ll get the new toys when they’re ready. I know it’s hard work, the guys making this stuff are modern wizards.

I misunderstood you. I'm sorry.

I love the Litening in the Hawg. Glad it's coming to the Hornet

If they couldn't just slap Mavs from the A-10 to the Hornet, it's extremely unlikely they'll be able to just slap a targeting pod. I'd give it a month or so, or more. Awesome news though.

Thanks Lex for claryfying.

 

 

But you used the ATFLIR pod, right?

 

 

How far to the side could look in level flight with a centerline tank?

 

 

Do you remember how much bank you used to circle when you stayed in an area and looked for an target?

 

 

Thanks for sharing your knowledge,

 

 

Best Regards from Austria

Yes. My apologies for the "l" in front of the "pod" . My phone auto populated "lpod" from previous txts and i didnt catch it. The harriers had the lpods (IIs i believe) before us . And then the hornets aquired the IIls (again, i believe) after i left the fleet.. There were software/hardware issues with what ver could interface with what jet. And even then, the pilot interface was unique between the platforms used. No two jet platform pilot interfaces were quite the same. As far as navy/marine corps specific 18s, at that time, the jets had been passed arround so much, navy trapped out Ds went to marine non carrier squadrons, some had what was called a "center barrel mod" which was a mod that gave more flight time to an already cycled airframe, then possible rotate back to the navy. In short, i dont think a "navy only" or "marine only" hornet was such a thing anymore .

Every aircraft can be flared when landing. You don't have to bump it on the runway, if you don't have to catch a wire on the boat.

Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk

https://nara.getarchive.net/media/aerial-of-a-us-marine-corps-usmc-fa-18-hornet-marine-fighter-attack-squadron-de977f

VMFA-115 Hornet from the Harry S. Truman carrying the LITENING on the cheek station, to back up Mr Yaeger.

That is great news! Super stoked that we are getting it!

Brilliant news, this made my day! Looking forward to having the Litening on my jet.

https://nara.getarchive.net/media/aerial-of-a-us-marine-corps-usmc-fa-18-hornet-marine-fighter-attack-squadron-de977f

 

VMFA-115 Hornet from the Harry S. Truman carrying the LITENING on the cheek station, to back up Mr Yaeger.

If you zoom in close enough you can make out an ATFLIR pod

CF18 landing at an airport with ils and note the decent rate at touchdown.

CF18 landing at an airport with ils and note the decent rate at touchdown.

Having watched several HUD view no flare landings it seems that, for whatever reason, even with a constant ~700fpm descent rate in the approach, the VSI jumps to 1000fpm+ during touchdown as per that image. As such I would be careful as using a still image like that as it may well not be representative of how hard the jet was really put down on the deck.