Silvern Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Will AIM-9L have increased rocket motor smoke compared to AIM-9M? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mig Fulcrum Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 AIM-9L will be more smoky and flare will be more efficient against it. Howerver, do i miss something? Because i didn't know we are going to have AIM-9L. Can you please link where you found that information? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badusername Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 Here: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3362067&postcount=28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mig Fulcrum Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 Ok thanks, so they will be added with the Hornet right? Not with the 2.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven (Elysian Angel) Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3285514&postcount=13 Spoiler Ryzen 9 5900X | 64GB G.Skill TridentZ 3600 | Gigabyte RX6900XT | ASUS ROG Strix X570-E GAMING | Samsung 990Pro 2TB + 960Pro 1TB NMVe | HP Reverb G2 Pro Flight Trainer Puma | VIRPIL MT-50CM2+3 base / CM2 x2 grip with 200 mm S-curve extension + CM3 throttle + CP2/3 + FSSB R3L + VPC Rotor TCS Plus base with SharKa-50 grip mounted on Monstertech MFC-1 | TPR rudder pedals OpenXR | PD 1.0 | 100% render resolution | DCS "HIGH" preset Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvern Posted January 28, 2018 Author Share Posted January 28, 2018 AIM-9L will be more smoky and flare will be more efficient against it. I know AIM-9L is more smoky IRL, but I'd like to know if this will be accurately represented in DCS. Some official info would be appreicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano87 Posted January 30, 2018 Share Posted January 30, 2018 I know AIM-9L is more smoky IRL, but I'd like to know if this will be accurately represented in DCS. Some official info would be appreicated. why would that not be modeled if its a feature of the weapon irl?:noexpression: Proud owner of: PointCTRL VR : Finger Trackers for VR -- Real Simulator : FSSB R3L Force Sensing Stick. -- Deltasim : Force Sensor WH Slew Upgrade -- Mach3Ti Ring : Real Flown Mach 3 SR-71 Titanium, made into an amazing ring. My Fathers Aviation Memoirs: 50 Years of Flying Fun - From Hunter to Spitfire and back again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvern Posted February 7, 2018 Author Share Posted February 7, 2018 why would that not be modeled if its a feature of the weapon irl?:noexpression: I don't know why they don't model it already. Because in-game RB-74 (Swedish name for AIM-9L) on Viggen has the same amount of rocket-smoke as AIM-9M, which should not be the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieuie Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 I don't know why they don't model it already. Because in-game RB-74 (Swedish name for AIM-9L) on Viggen has the same amount of rocket-smoke as AIM-9M, which should not be the case. Maybe when the AIM-9L is released that will change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 AIM-9L uses the same reduced smoke motor as the AIM-9M. Or rather, the AIM-9M inherited that motor, and so did the AIM-9X after that. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrei Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 According to Chizh, the 9L will be bit more smoky in DCS and will be more susceptible to flares. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3377803&postcount=2649 1 AMD R7 5800X3D | Aorus B550 Pro | 32GB DDR4-3600 | RTX 4080 | VKB MGC Pro Gunfighter Mk III + Thustmaster TWCS + VKB T-Rudder Mk4 | HP Reverb G2 FC3 | A-10C II | Ка-50 | P-51 | UH-1 | Ми-8 | F-86F | МиГ-21 | FW-190 | МиГ-15 | Л-39 | Bf 109 | M-2000C | F-5 | Spitfire | AJS-37 | AV-8B | F/A-18C | Як-52 | F-14 | F-16 | Ми-24 | AH-64 NTTR | Normandy | Gulf | Syria | Supercarrier | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvern Posted February 9, 2018 Author Share Posted February 9, 2018 According to Chizh, the 9L will be bit more smoky in DCS and will be more susceptible to flares. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3377803&postcount=2649 That's good to hear! Thank you for the link. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 I'll get that corrected when the time comes (or I'll be proven wrong, but whatever :) ) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrei Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Well, time will show. Don't know how this is for source, but it clearly indicates that the AIM-9M had a different power unit from 9L. http://www.ausairpower.net/TE-Sidewinder-94.html AMD R7 5800X3D | Aorus B550 Pro | 32GB DDR4-3600 | RTX 4080 | VKB MGC Pro Gunfighter Mk III + Thustmaster TWCS + VKB T-Rudder Mk4 | HP Reverb G2 FC3 | A-10C II | Ка-50 | P-51 | UH-1 | Ми-8 | F-86F | МиГ-21 | FW-190 | МиГ-15 | Л-39 | Bf 109 | M-2000C | F-5 | Spitfire | AJS-37 | AV-8B | F/A-18C | Як-52 | F-14 | F-16 | Ми-24 | AH-64 NTTR | Normandy | Gulf | Syria | Supercarrier | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 No, it's the same. Mk36 - the very earliest version, mod7, may have been smokey but 8 and up is reduced smoke and the majority of 9Ls used that motor IIRC. My source was the rocket motor manufacturer - unfortunately none of them provide a time line. I may be able to put one together later but it's a lot of research. In any case, finding a smokey 9L on a block 20 hornet would be rather 'just no' IMHO - those rocket motors would have been replaced due to shelf life IF there had been any smokey motors left at all past 1980. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmidtfire Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 I think you are wrong about that. There is plenty of smokey Aim-9L's still being used! Source: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MxVbZEWTd4I etc. There are plenty of newer videos on youtube featuring Aim-9L launches. I have also already modded in and tried EDs Aim-9L, and it also produces smoke. Smokeless is Aim-9M / X territory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 What about this one? Are you sure it's not just a contrail in the launches you're looking at? We all 'know' that 120s are reduced smoke: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmidtfire Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 I'll be happy proven wrong. But look at this video (also by RDAF): You can clearly see the difference. Aim-120 and Aim-9X produces no smoke. Aim-9L is like a chimney. I have never seen any video or picture of a smokeless Aim-9L. But the Aim-9P5 (another export variant) has a reduced smoke motor I think. This might be wrong but from what I have read the Aim-9L is actually based on the Aim-9H (that was basicly an updated variant of the G but with different fuzing) There might be smokeless variants of the Lima, but I have never seen or heard of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 (edited) You have seen one, I linked it for you above :) Again, I think what you're seeing in contrails, which is also produced by other smokeless missiles - again, as shown in the links above. I'm going by the manufacturer's brochure - oldest 9Ls use Mk36 mod 7 which was smokey (maybe even mod 8?) but certainly as of Mod 9 it's reduced smoke. You might make an argument that they don't do this for export missiles but in light of the P5 that doesn't make much sense either. To make the point differently: The rocket motors used there have a 10 year shelf life (IIRC, don't quote me on it). Smokey sidewinder motors were no longer manufactured as of the early 80's, with the possible exception of Chapparal ... at least the evidence very strongly leans in that direction. Of course, another possibility is that 'reduced smoke' goes further - there may be a version of this rocket motor that doesn't produce much smoke, but still leaves enough particles in its wake to produce a lot of nucleation, thus making it easier to produce contrails, and newer or different rocket motors ... might not do that. See here: http://www.diehl.com/fileadmin/diehl-defence/user_upload/flyer/Flyer_DRM_1.pdf There's more stuff like this but I don't want to google any more :P PS: Actually I may have proven myself wrong, it looks like mod 9 was the first reduced smoke motor. Edited February 10, 2018 by GGTharos [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmidtfire Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 As I wrote I'd be happy proven wrong and learn something new :) Found this info: First developed was the 9L Tactical, which is an upgraded version of the basic 9L missile. Next was the 9L Genetic, which has increased infra-red counter counter measures (IRCCM); this upgrade consisted of a removable module in the Guidance Control Section (GCS) which provided flare-rejection capability. Next came the 9L(I), which had its IRCCM module hardwired into the GCS, providing improved countermeasures as well as an upgraded seeker system. Diehl BGT also markets the AIM-9L(I)-1 which again upgrades the 9L(I)GCS and is considered an operational equivalent to the initially "US only" AIM-9M. But It certanly was not smokeless when the Aim-9M turned up in 1982 and those Lima versions manufactured then were probably still being used well into the 1990's or even later for training purposes. Maybe the US had smokeless variants but kept selling the 9L's with older motors to export customers? The Lima comes in so many variants, don't know if there are any budget options and buy them with cheaper "smokey" rocket motors for training etc. Where is @mattebubben in this discussion? He is usually well read on missile variants :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 Most manufacturers right now use the Mk36 mod 9 and up. That's reduced smoke. But it looks like there are still a lot of mod 8 refits. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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