Am I the only one disappointed in DCS World Multiplayer?

First off, let me start out by saying I have 2,000+ hours in DCS World (400 of that in the Steam version) with the A-10, UH-1H, KA-50, AV-8B, and the F/A-18. The majority of those hours are in the A-10 and the Huey. So needless to say, I absolutely love the sim. It's the best combat sim out there...period. I play it nearly daily.

 

 

 

However, that said, I feel multiplayer is lacking seriously. I grew up on Falcon BMS and the ability to hop into a server, chit-chat with a stranger deciding on what you both want to go out and strike and then having the ability to hop into that dynamic mission never got old. But the graphics and content did.

 

 

 

DCS World's multiplayer I don't see there's an ability to do anything close to this. Once you're in a server main menu, there's essentially no communication to others on someone joining your flight. People are usually already buddied up using Discord or flying solo. But otherwise, meeting strangers is almost impossible for me because of this. This makes the majority of multiplayer servers near impossible/non-existent for fun air-to-ground missions. You either have to have some buddies with you to take out the ridiculous amount of SAMs/AAA server admin's put out or hop in one of the ranges that become boring in a short while.

 

 

 

This really only leaves air-to-air PVP and PVC servers.

 

 

 

I don't know anyone that plays DCS, so this leaves me playing single player 99.99% of the time.

 

 

 

Am I missing something?

If I wanted to run a sortie to take out some ground units/structures to help my team out (without having to break through 500 AAA/SAM sites) does that exist out in multiplayer? If so, where do I find it?

 

 

This sort of runs along my complaint of DCS not having a dynamic campaign, leaving the user to have to download preset missions or create their own. It sucks, but there's enough there to let your imagination run wild. So I know some of the limitations of single player leak over to multiplayer, I just wish Eagle Dynamics would address this issue.

 

 

 

In my opinion, it's the biggest draw-back to the sim.

Why dont you enter into a Virtual Squadron? Why do team work with a complete stranger?

Why dont you enter into a Virtual Squadron? Why do team work with a complete stranger?

 

 

VS vary too wildly on rules and regulations. Most require monthly activity, active participation, and/or other various rules that just feels like I've gotta be HR complaint and abide by standards that dictates my ability to fly with others rather than just getting up in the air and have fun. I want to fly and have fun with someone, not hold down a 2nd job.

 

 

 

I know there's some out there that are a bit more relaxed, but I've never been interested in VS for reasons above. I flew with strangers for 5+ years in BMS and almost never encountered a bad experience due to the complexity and market of the sim. Many of those strangers became friends and we flew semi-regularly.

I've been in your situation as well.... Spudknocker suggested I check out Wingman Finder on Discord. It's a good group of people, varying skill levels and attitudes. There are several organized missions every week, plus you can always drop by and see if anyone wants to fly anytime.

 

I'd check out Wingman finder, you might find something fun to do.

 

https://discord.gg/3jT2zE

VS vary too wildly on rules and regulations. Most require monthly activity, active participation, and/or other various rules that just feels like I've gotta be HR complaint and abide by standards that dictates my ability to fly with others rather than just getting up in the air and have fun. I want to fly and have fun with someone, not hold down a 2nd job.

 

 

 

I know there's some out there that are a bit more relaxed, but I've never been interested in VS for reasons above. I flew with strangers for 5+ years in BMS and almost never encountered a bad experience due to the complexity and market of the sim. Many of those strangers became friends and we flew semi-regularly.

 

Then why don’t you start a VS that operates in the manner you prefer?

Virtual squadron flying is some of the most rewarding. Consider checking some out.

 

Some public servers, like Blue Flag, are well suited for forming up with others on the fly due to its structure.

 

Checkout this newsletter from the 11th, if you haven't already. Some of the things you're looking for might not be that far away.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3735513&postcount=178

Then why don’t you start a VS that operates in the manner you prefer?

 

 

I'm not interested in using my time and resources to create and manage applications for everyone to come together (i.e. being a Discord admin). While it's a great option to someone who is willing, I just want to casually fly multiplayer when able.

 

 

 

I don't believe DCS does a good job at the multiplayer aspect. You essentially have to know someone to fly on multiplayer and it essentially lacks the ability to meet someone at random in their online multiplayer mode. That initial meeting or flying with a stranger typically later develops to a casual friendship of flying together, which is non-existent in DCS.

 

 

 

I realize VS work for some, but I'm not looking into getting into something serious.

I've been in your situation as well.... Spudknocker suggested I check out Wingman Finder on Discord. It's a good group of people, varying skill levels and attitudes. There are several organized missions every week, plus you can always drop by and see if anyone wants to fly anytime.

 

I'd check out Wingman finder, you might find something fun to do.

 

https://discord.gg/3jT2zE

 

 

 

 

Thank you!!! This is something I wasn't aware existed. I'll check this out! :megalol:

Most popular multiplayer servers either have a teamspeak server or a Simple Radio server (or both) that you can hop onto to get in contact with the other players and coordinate.

I especially recommend the Blue Flag servers, which are running dynamic campaigns that require a lot of teamwork to suceed: http://gadget.buddyspike.net/

Edited January 23, 2019 by QuiGon

I pretty much agree with the original poster and have a lot of empathy with the point about not wanting it to feel like a 2nd job, which it can.

 

I used to fly BMS and drop back into it for the odd flight but soon give up because VR has really been a big game changer for me. I have flown very rarely online with a few really nice people and these were great experiences but the sessions are just far too long for me to commit to because of family, jobs and all the other life stuff.

 

It still remains a big hole that I can't seem to fill with something I really love doing and have been doing for over 20 years.

 

I agree with the other point that the answer is a dynamic campaign both for single player and multiplayer respectively.

+1

 

I couldn't agree more with the main post here!

 

 

I persoanlly know a couple of guys I could always fly with. But what if they're offline? Exactly! I end up flying solo. And I've been flying on DCS for years. One major reason is becasue we have various communications' methods as in TeamSpeak, Discord, Mumble, etc. So Players end up communicating with only a few if at all. Imagine ED had something of their own. Players would mostly stick with only that! That'd solve the addressed problem here.

This is so frustrating to the extent that I include quite enough target areas in the missions I design for my server, where one striker is able to cause enough damage to the enemy. The only reason is to encourage players to fly strike missions, even if solo.

 

 

Thank you for posting the issue :thumbup:

Completely agree.

 

I think this will be largely resolved when ED implement VOIP, which is something I'm sure Wags mentioned as a 2019 goal. SRS is a fantastic tool but unless you're on blue flag and on GCI frequency the airwaves are dead - most people just don't bother.

Agree 100% with the OP’s primary points, this sim is great in some respects but really lacks in others — one of which is a lack of a solid, engaging multiplayer engine. OP, be warned that people will refer to Blue Flag, DDCS, and other servers as “running Dynamic campaigns,” but know that they aren’t true DC’s. Not even close to it. Don’t set yourself up for a letdown. They are fun but they are very limited by the mission editor and DCS engine, they aren’t DC’s as you know them.

 

As someone else said above, a recent newsletter provided a bit more of a preview into the future but most of that still seems a ways off from release. In due time hopefully we will see what the sim has been so sorely missing for a long time.

 

 

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I know some will say it has nothing to do with it, but when you play World of Warcraft you have the ability to create a player group for a specific mission, automatically, once connected and entered the game.

In the game you choose the event you want to finish or create with a very simple menu. In the mission search your event will appear and those who want to join can do it automatically by clicking a button.

Why not implement this system in DCS?

A menu with the missions in progress and a button to join the one wanted. I mean the missions proposed by the servers. For this you need free access to the servers.

Currently the servers are restrictive and even password-protected, this is due to the fact that the missions are easy to recover without even participating. This facility to steal missions, prevents the creation of public servers.

DCS is willingly or not in the paradox, to let everyone steal the missions and protect it with passwords, forcing players to lock themselves into small groups.

The creation of fast missions exists in DCS, and is never used.This could be used in the way described above.

The quick missions created appear in the list of servers in an additional tab with the mention free access.

In this way there would be no more interest to steal the missions and no more need of password.

The multiplayer would become more accessible.

Edited January 23, 2019 by cromhunt

However, that said, I feel multiplayer is lacking seriously. I grew up on Falcon BMS and the ability to hop into a server, chit-chat with a stranger deciding on what you both want to go out and strike and then having the ability to hop into that dynamic mission never got old. But the graphics and content did.

 

 

I think we all tend to remember the good and distort the bad. I had a lot of fun back then, but connecting online was never easy. Multivipers was my spot, we had a lot of fun but a typical night was 35 minutes of BS with everyone, 15 minutes trying to figure out what version we all want to fly ( but that one looks better, but other one has better avionics, etc). Then you spend an hour trying top figure out why the new guy can see the server ( what modem you have? did he forward his ports?) By now a third of the people have left because they where to drunk or got to go work early.

 

Ok, you finally get on the server, guy one will say: "Oh man all the missions are CAPs". Guy two: "Can we create one?" guy three:" All the target are up north, I don't fly that long" ...

 

Its been 3 hours, the flight is ready, everyone set on their role and well and drunk, we hit fly....and the server crash :doh:

 

In DCS, we are all 1 click away from a list of server full of possibilities. I don't fly much online. Some server are frustrating. There are many problems with some aspects of multiplayer. But is way easier to fly online now that what it used to be.

Put simply, in multiplayer you get out of it what you are prepared to put in plus a lot more.

 

You need to network to get wingmen. Or to get the most out of things, get involved with a virtual squadron. There are strict rule abiding groups and relaxed casual ones plus all shades in between.

 

Get to know the squadrons, and more importantly, get to know your fellow pilots. Invest. You’ll get out far more than you put in if you do so.

Completely agree with you,"mvsgas",

But why not improve the trick to avoid what makes it uncomfortable and frustrating at the moment?

out of interest the only way that I think i can improve is to fly with other humans are there any VS's that accept rookies ?

I fully agree with the OP, but it's not a problem specific to DCS, it's the same in every sims, basically everybody playing useless furballs in the middle of the map without any kind of objectives or minimal military tactics. It was the same 15 years ago with IL2, it will stay the same unless some automatic events generator is implemented in the game, forcing the players to play in a clever way.

To "Neilwillis"

Invest in a group, but why?

playing it is not an investment, everyone has the right to have fun in his own way without having to answer to a group, a squadron or any community. You do not believe?

Being part of one of these squadrons is an inadequate constraint with the desire to play.A unless to be masochistic and to accept to be rolled or mocked and to obey to self-proclaimed leaders.The Role playing game goes very well with MMOs, because you do not ask for anything difficult to do, and the means are reduced to a mouse and a keyboard on an average PC.

With the players on simulators it is completely different because they need devices very often very expensive and powerful machines.

This is the real investment.

But we do not pay all that to support the whims of a pseudo leader of any squadron turned more to the dictatorship of idiots than the desire to have fun

To "Christophe"

And you think that the automatic mission generation system could not be useful for this purpose?

...However, that said, I feel multiplayer is lacking seriously. I grew up on Falcon BMS and the ability to hop into a server, chit-chat with a stranger deciding on what you both want to go out and strike and then having the ability to hop into that dynamic mission never got old. But the graphics and content did.

Falcon dynamic campaign engine was something really unique, adding a lot of replay-ability to the sim. Just recently ED announced to work on their own DC engine for DCS. We'll probably not going to see it in 2019. If done correctly however (which we shouldn't have any doubt ED will manage to do) it can really bring DCS to another level of content availability.

I'm not able to find a reference but I remember reading somewhere that building the dynamic campaign engine was such an ambitious task that it almost brought Microprose to a bankruptcy. So, lets keep our fingers crossed and wish ED a good luck!

 

 

...DCS World's multiplayer I don't see there's an ability to do anything close to this. Once you're in a server main menu, there's essentially no communication to others on someone joining your flight. People are usually already buddied up using Discord or flying solo. But otherwise, meeting strangers is almost impossible for me because of this. This makes the majority of multiplayer servers near impossible/non-existent for fun air-to-ground missions. You either have to have some buddies with you to take out the ridiculous amount of SAMs/AAA server admin's put out or hop in one of the ranges that become boring in a short while.

Its simply because DCS hasn't been designed this way. It's hard to explain but the way how mission editor works makes a mission to be focused on a single task. It allows to micro manage every single details of a single mission allowing to create a detailed engagement scenario. Creating multiple sequential missions allows to create a campaign. Every of those single missions have their briefing which can be really detailed - though their is no briefing room for players to gather and prepare in MP.

What happens on most MP servers is that a single mission is used to represent a whole campaign/conflict. That is why it ends up to be an environment with flights spawning in/de-spawning without specific briefings, tasks and flight plans.

The issue is generally two-fold - first is that, DCS lacks a good features to promote people getting together and organizing them self. On top of that the mission engine doesn't seem to be used by mission designers as per its design.

 

 

Am I missing something?

If I wanted to run a sortie to take out some ground units/structures to help my team out (without having to break through 500 AAA/SAM sites) does that exist out in multiplayer? If so, where do I find it?

I think you got a correct point. Most of the servers just run a generic missions and unfortunately there are many generic, air quake like servers. Quite often with the same air frames available on both sides. Just with blue and red team starting each from one, two airfields in close vicinity and an constantly going air fight on the way between them. Look for servers that have a mission rotation and more granular, task oriented missions. I think Cold War server is a good example to consider.

 

 

This sort of runs along my complaint of DCS not having a dynamic campaign, leaving the user to have to download preset missions or create their own. It sucks, but there's enough there to let your imagination run wild. So I know some of the limitations of single player leak over to multiplayer, I just wish Eagle Dynamics would address this issue.

The issue is that no matter how interesting SP mission you design, flying own missions is not that great as it takes out all of the element of surprise. There are some ways to randomize the mission but still it's not the same as flying a mission designed by someone else. On top of that, again due to the way how DCS missions and campaign work there is generally a lack of feeling of that our performance actually matters in a grand scale and that our results are transferred to another mission (for instance having to re-attack a target if we failed in the first mission).

On the other hand what DCS missions do really great is that they allow to setup a really detailed scenarios and even allow to create an interesting narration. DCS focuses on micro-managing the missions while DC engine requires a macro management approach. Think however that most of the DLC campaigns with their added great story telling wouldn't be possible in rather generic dynamic campaign approach.

Edited January 23, 2019 by firmek
Typos

Hey guys, I've been reading these posts and they sound like me a year ago. About a year ago I asked in these forums about a squadron to join and received a very kind response from a member of AG-51. I accepted his invitation to fly with them and very soon after I joined them officially because it was so much fun and they are such a good bunch of guys.

 

 

We have official "squad nights" on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays at 9 PM CST, USA time. We fly as long or as short as everyone feels like flying with the average time being 3 hours or so. But guys come and go as they please. We have no attendance or flight time requirements. You only show up and fly when you want to, real life always comes first. We are a mature group, with ages ranging from early 30's to late 60's. We probably have 15 or so regulars with an average squad night attendance of 7-10 guys. We have some very good mission builders in our group so we always have some fresh missions to fly. We also have 2 real life pilots in our group, so there is lots of real life knowledge that is shared in our group.

 

We are always looking for pilots who just want to have fun while trying at least a little bit to keep it real life.

 

We are a carrier based squadron concentrating on the Hornet and the Harrier right now, but all planes and levels of experience are welcome and you can fly any aircraft you like on any given night as long as it's included in our mission. When I joined I only had the free SU-25T and could just barely land it and they taught me how to get better quickly in a very friendly manner. If someone messes up we tease and make fun of them and then move on, and we all mess up so there's plenty to go around!

 

We use TeamSpeak to communicate in game so you would need to have that, and we're an English speaking group. We have members in all 4 U.S. time zones and we have a Canadian, an Aussie from Queensland Australia and a member in Japan. So obviously no one is excluded.

 

Anyway, if anyone is looking for a fun group to fly with in a low (no) pressure atmosphere while still trying to do proper carrier ops and so on, or if you're just curious and would like to ask a question, just shoot me a PM. And afterwards, if you like, we will get you set up to fly with us and you can see if we're a good fit for you or not.

Edited February 11, 2019 by Sparky1b09

I just wanted to say that the OP of this thread has started flying with our group and is really liking flying with us and we're liking flying with him, he's a pretty cool guy. So if anyone else is interested just drop a PM. We're always looking to add pilots top our group.

To "Neilwillis"

Invest in a group, but why?

playing it is not an investment, everyone has the right to have fun in his own way without having to answer to a group, a squadron or any community. You do not believe?

Being part of one of these squadrons is an inadequate constraint with the desire to play.A unless to be masochistic and to accept to be rolled or mocked and to obey to self-proclaimed leaders.The Role playing game goes very well with MMOs, because you do not ask for anything difficult to do, and the means are reduced to a mouse and a keyboard on an average PC.

With the players on simulators it is completely different because they need devices very often very expensive and powerful machines.

This is the real investment.

But we do not pay all that to support the whims of a pseudo leader of any squadron turned more to the dictatorship of idiots than the desire to have fun

If you join a group and you don't believe in their values then you can just leave.

You're view on how squadrons are run is absurd, a large number of squadrons skirt around regimental structure because we are all in this for fun and nobody wants to spend all day in work just to go back to work in DCS. Most squadrons are set up to create a teamwork environment and to help members integrate in to the squadrons chosen way to fly, the biggest investment going on here is by the guys running the squadron taking their time to develop and train keen members. If they invest so much time in creating SOP's and training missions, arrange trainings and events then surely they reserve the right to dictate how things go. It is not a place for egos and show offs but for team players, those who enjoy improving themselves through teamwork and having fun.