Essay, PART 2: Getting the tail up... - Page 2 - ED Forums
 


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Old 12-19-2016, 09:56 PM   #11
Friedrich-4/B
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Thanks once again Chief, for a great, easy to understand essay. A couple of questions:

Watching this clip, the pilot started lifting the tail very early in the take-off (from c. 2:25 on) - is this about right, or would a more heavily loaded wartime Spitfire need more time before lifting the tail?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_iEpnl5g-s8

How much of an effect does the airfield surface have on the take-off?

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Old 12-19-2016, 10:07 PM   #12
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Great reading, and again so easily and plainly explained. Worth the reading people, don't miss it.


Thank you!
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:23 PM   #13
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Great job enjoyed the read, really looking forward to your essay on landing, Thanks!
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:27 PM   #14
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Solidly written and very instructional, thank you very much. This is just what we need, so please let's have more of it.

These essays are very helpful indeed.
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:28 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Friedrich-4/B View Post
Thanks once again Chief, for a great, easy to understand essay. A couple of questions:

Watching this clip, the pilot started lifting the tail very early in the take-off (from c. 2:25 on) - is this about right, or would a more heavily loaded wartime Spitfire need more time before lifting the tail?



How much of an effect does the airfield surface have on the take-off?
Hi Friedrich-4/B,

Your video link isn't working for me but... There is no right or wrong time to lift the tail. My advice is to lift it as soon as you have enough stabiliser authority to do so. If you can raise the tail, then that's a good time! There's a trick you can do in some high performance aerobatic tail draggers such as an Extra or Edge where you can hold the aircraft stationary on the brakes and lift the tail with the prop slipstream alone. Not very useful but a good demonstration of how the propwash affects the authority of the tail surfaces!

Ground surface has a big effect on controlability. Smooth grass tends to be the easiest because the main wheels can slip a little, allowing greater forgiveness when it comes to lateral interactions between the gear and the ground. Dry tarmac is the trickiest because higher grip levels translate every sideways force back to the airframe. Having said that, the high grip surfaces allow for much more accurate control, provided you know what you're doing. Training new pilots is often best done on the grass to build confidence, then progressing to hard surfaces once they have the right picture and feel. Does that answer your questions?

Best wishes,

CFI
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Last edited by Chief Instructor; 12-19-2016 at 10:34 PM.
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:59 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Instructor View Post
Hi Friedrich-4/B,

Your video link isn't working for me but... There is no right or wrong time to lift the tail. My advice is to lift it as soon as you have enough stabiliser authority to do so. If you can raise the tail, then that's a good time! There's a trick you can do in some high performance aerobatic tail draggers such as an Extra or Edge where you can hold the aircraft stationary on the brakes and lift the tail with the prop slipstream alone. Not very useful but a good demonstration of how the propwash affects the authority of the tail surfaces!

Ground surface has a big effect on controlability. Smooth grass tends to be the easiest because the main wheels can slip a little, allowing greater forgiveness when it comes to lateral interactions between the gear and the ground. Dry tarmac is the trickiest because higher grip levels translate every sideways force back to the airframe. Having said that, the high grip surfaces allow for much more accurate control, provided you know what you're doing. Training new pilots is often best done on the grass to build confidence, then progressing to hard surfaces once they have the right picture and feel. Does that answer your questions?

Best wishes,

CFI
Cheers! You gotta respect the wartime pilots who flew from all sorts of surfaces, often in adverse weather conditions, carrying all sorts of loads.

(Meantime, I'm struggling to get a simple youtube link working...*sigh*)
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Old 12-20-2016, 02:36 AM   #17
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More excellent info.
Thank you Chief Instructor
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Old 12-20-2016, 03:34 AM   #18
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Great, now I gotta relearn my takeoff procedure. Thank you for the information!
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Old 12-20-2016, 05:46 AM   #19
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If i get the tail up during the take off run i hit the prop i try to trim the nose heavy but i just can't get over the rocking wings.
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Old 12-20-2016, 06:28 AM   #20
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I could not find something like a trolley to prop the tail up onto.
Had to improvise a little.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S983pkvMdyE
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