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[REPORTED] Spitfire - strange engine failure


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I've been flying long missions with drop tanks, and from time to time I'm getting these strange engine failures. The engine cuts, the prop keeps windmilling, and there are flames coming from the exhaust pipes. I don't think it's due to the drop tank being empty, because it happens a bit too early for that. Problem is I can't restart the engine, even if I disconnect the drop tanks.

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I'm thinking maybe it was due to overcooling? I was cruising at 25,000 feet at zero boost and 2,200 RPM. In another thread someone confirmed that coolant is much more effective now. If so, how to avoid this? Should I regularly dilute the oil?

 

Has anyone ran out of external fuel? What happens, and how do you restart the engine? Does it automatically pick up when you switch to the internal tank?

 

Thanks

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Has anyone ran out of external fuel? What happens, and how do you restart the engine? Does it automatically pick up when you switch to the internal tank?

Thanks

Yellow light will come On and engine starts running irregularly.

I opened main fuel valve, but engine did not start running regularly.

I had to swich On booster pump to restore fuel pressure, switch Off yellow light.

I tried use the wobble pump to restore fuel pressure, but it was not sufficient, may be if engine runs at lower setting it is.

F-15E | F-14A/B

P-51D | P-47D | Mosquito FB Mk VI |Spitfire | Fw 190D | Fw 190A | Bf 109K |  WWII Assets Pack

Normandy 2 | The Channel | Sinai | Syria | PG | NTTR | South Atlantic 

F/A-18 | F-86 | F-16C | A-10C | FC-3 | CA | SC |

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What do you mean by the main fuel valve? The fuel cock behind the stick?
Yes

 

do you have to switch that off when the right hand selector is set to the external tank? Thanks!

If You want to take fuel from external fuel tank first, You have to do. If is in "On" position, engine will take fuel from maint and external fuel tanks simultaneously.

 

"Right hand selector" function "On/Off" (or Close/Open valve) is not simulated yet, if it is in Off position, still engine takes fuel from external fuel tank.

If it is in "On" position, You will not be able to release external tank, it is correct.

F-15E | F-14A/B

P-51D | P-47D | Mosquito FB Mk VI |Spitfire | Fw 190D | Fw 190A | Bf 109K |  WWII Assets Pack

Normandy 2 | The Channel | Sinai | Syria | PG | NTTR | South Atlantic 

F/A-18 | F-86 | F-16C | A-10C | FC-3 | CA | SC |

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I dilute regularly as well and did throughout this mission. Oil pressure always hovered around 90. I turned up the temp to 30c for the mission as well.

CW version tested thoroughly today over 8 hrs (again lol)

The problem is the Fuel Pressure valve is not actually supplying any pressure.

I just finished an hour and a half flight (cut short by a rude mountain).

I set the temp for mission at 30c.

At cruising at 19000 ft the pressure light came on. It took a while at that altitude 4 psi and 2650.

Turning the vale on did not cure it. The valve moves but it does not cure the problem. Only losing altitude until atmospheric pressure is sufficient again does it appear to want to run again. I wobbled the snot out of the pump as it sank in altitude and it finally recovered at 17,000 feet. I had the filter in operation since I had forgotten it. Wasn't that.

I also had the Supercharger in M.S. for maximum fuel economy. tested and not that.

I tried it filter open. same.

I tried it with the Supercharger in F.S. same.

I dropped the empty drop tank (and sadly my bombs with it) to try that. No change.

Main fuel valve was on the whole time and the drop tank fuel tank was off since I wanted to save my bombs for the mountain.

 

It falters and the low fuel pressure light comes on in every case. It takes a half a minute or so before the light comes on after you notice something is off.

 

Finally I just kept taking runs at the top of the mountain and then diving to get fuel pressure again and then running for the roof again.

I did record it all. 27 gig worth. I am not going to upload it. One is not supposed to turn the fuel pressure on unless it is a lit light due to the fact that it negates the pressure sealing capability of there "self sealing" tanks so I don't unless I see the light. The light definitely comes on.

 

None of this happened yesterday in a similar mission on the same mountain but with the temp set to 20c. as the only real change.

 

I actually did a repair just before the mission as well. It did say it removed some obsolete files and did it's thing.

 

That is a critical bug and needs to be fleshed out. That is enough flight time for me today.

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"Everyone should fly a Spitfire at least once" John S. Blyth

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I seem to recall the pressure valve was always somewhat puzzling/wonky since the early release, so I stopped bothering with it at all and just flew with booster pump on instead, that seemed to be the bulletproof way of avoiding any pressure problems at any altitude. Haven't tested if it still is in current version, however...

 

It's nice they're doing something with fuel system in this module after a year at last, though I'm not happy the mixture lever still cannot be operated during startup as per real manual. Well, on the other hand, it's impossible now to start and run the engine with main fuel cock off as it was a few versions ago, so I'm glad that peculiarity was fixed :D.

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  • 2 weeks later...
I seem to recall the pressure valve was always somewhat puzzling/wonky since the early release, so I stopped bothering with it at all and just flew with booster pump on instead, that seemed to be the bulletproof way of avoiding any pressure problems at any altitude. Haven't tested if it still is in current version, however...

 

It's nice they're doing something with fuel system in this module after a year at last, though I'm not happy the mixture lever still cannot be operated during startup as per real manual. Well, on the other hand, it's impossible now to start and run the engine with main fuel cock off as it was a few versions ago, so I'm glad that peculiarity was fixed :D.

 

I see. It's a bit of a letdown after an hour of flight to get to that point. Especially since I know it has worked before.

I fly with the fuel pump on just after startup as is proper. I wonder if I had my throttle on a different layer. Ahhh I won't give it another thought. Bug reported. I have done my duty.

edit: If the bug still exists after the next stable release, I will report it again if it occurs. When there are no more bugs, I will shut up.

Win 10 pro 64 bit. Intel i7 4790 4 Ghz running at 4.6. Asus z97 pro wifi main board, 32 gig 2400 ddr3 gold ram, 50 inch 4K UHD and HDR TV for monitor. H80 cpu cooler. 8 other cooling fans in full tower server case. Soundblaster ZX sound card. EVGA 1080 TI FTW3. TM Hotas Wartog. TM T.16000M MFG Crosswinds Pedals. Trackir 5.

"Everyone should fly a Spitfire at least once" John S. Blyth

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  • 2 weeks later...

I found the problem! It has nothing to do with fuel. If the temperature is below 10 degrees, you climb up to 22,000 feet or above and cruise at economic settings (+2 boost 2,300 RPM), the oil pressure will sky rocket and the engine will overcool and die. Recently the cooling model of the Spit has been adjusted. now it doesn't overheat that easily, but it overcools when it shouldn't.

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=191284&stc=1&d=1533295039

28566976_DesktopScreenshot2018_08.03-12_43_23_100.thumb.png.9306edae8a4ced6f74dba9157f59cb9f.png

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  • ED Team
I found the problem! It has nothing to do with fuel. If the temperature is below 10 degrees, you climb up to 22,000 feet or above and cruise at economic settings (+2 boost 2,300 RPM), the oil pressure will sky rocket and the engine will overcool and die. Recently the cooling model of the Spit has been adjusted. now it doesn't overheat that easily, but it overcools when it shouldn't.

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=191284&stc=1&d=1533295039

 

Will give that a go and ask Yo-Yo about it as well.

 

At that height should you be flying 2,650 rpm?


Edited by NineLine

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2650 RPM and 7lb boost is max continuous; if you were escorting bombers at that height your cruise setting would be significantly reduced from that for fuel economy, reduced RPM settings being critical in this regard. The pilot notes make no mention of any altitude restrictions or recommendations regards minimum revs.

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Indeed, because there were none I suppose. Max continuous is hardly enough to keep it warm and the oil pressure low enough. Nobody cruised at those settings in order to save fuel. Check the fuel consumption rate chart in the manual...

 

Therefore I must conclude that something is very off with the engine temp modelling. +2 boost and 2,300 RPM kills your engine in minutes. You should be able to cruise at 0 boost and 2,000 RPM at even higher altitudes than 22,000 feet.

 

Nine Line, try 2300 RPM, +2/0 boost at 23,000 feet which is not at all that high. 10 degrees celsius at sea level, which is not at all that low either.

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  • ED Team
2650 RPM and 7lb boost is max continuous; if you were escorting bombers at that height your cruise setting would be significantly reduced from that for fuel economy, reduced RPM settings being critical in this regard. The pilot notes make no mention of any altitude restrictions or recommendations regards minimum revs.

 

The Spitfire we have isn't really an ideal escort aircraft either though. But I have pointed this thread out to Yo-Yo.

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  • ED Team

The LF was more of an interceptor as I understood it, and more low to medium altitudes, the HF was better suited for higher altitudes with the Merlin 70 though. The LF could get high fast though with excellent climb rate, but I am not sure it was the go-to aircraft for escorts, especially in 1944, the Mustang was preferred among others.

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Sorry NL, but that's a spurious conjecture and not born out by the facts.

 

The LF was never developed as an interceptor version; the Merlin 66 was simply created in order to narrow the performance gaps between the Merlin 61 series F Mk.IX and the Fw 190 at some altitudes.

 

In 1943 LF.IX units were escorting 8th Air Force raids to French targets or providing withdrawal support for the longer range missions by picking up the bomber stream on the way out. 9th Air Force B-26 units regularly received escorts from Spitfire units equipped with LF.IXs. ADGB units with LF.IXs were escorting daylight Bomber Command Raids to the Ruhr in August/September of 1944 and both ADGB and 2nd TAF provided Ramrod escort to 2 Group A-20s and B-25s.

 

All the RAF P-51 units were attached to 2nd TAF during the invasion (Charnwood campaign....) and to some extent were not used to their strengths, i.e. as fighter bombers rather than long range escorts. In the Autumn this was realised and then we see the RAF using their Ponies for long range escort for the Coastal Command Mossies attacking Norwegian targets and providing cover for the 2 Group Mossies over Denmark etc.


Edited by DD_Fenrir
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  • ED Team

However you want to read it, the 70 performed better at altitude, and the IX was never the best escort available, all that said, I know the Spit was used for many things. And even studies done to increase its range. But all that being said, most of what I see is higher rpm at higher altitude, if the current results are right or wrong is more for Yo-Yo to speak about.

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