What monitor/resolution should I be looking at?

And I tell it again - you are in no way restricted in your monitors refresh rate by TrackIR. You can repeat it as many times as you want - there is NO WAY that TrackIR can interfere to a monitors refresh rate. It is a hoax.

It is one thing to argue with me , but Bitmaster happens to be the star pc Guru on these forums . He has been a professional in this field for many years . Your attitude inhibits your ability to learn sir .

I know of so many star forum gurus you can't count of. There is a million ppl telling me the earth is flat. Today.

But maybe I am an idiot and you or this guru can help me.

What is TrackIR's 120FPS sample rate. What does this numbers refers to, what parameter does it describe.

If you can answer this, then plz elaborate. Then plz, explain the connection to the monitors refresh rate.

Plz explain, when I was using TrackIR with my tube monitor, why was I able to use it.

Copied from a Natural Point forum post :

What you are observing is a fundamental issue with devices having different update frequencies. To obtain a smooth motion you need all devices and software, in particular TIR, the game, and your monitor to update at a more-or-less same frequency. Otherwise you will get eg. two TIR updates within a single game frame and monitor refresh. Half a second later you could get 1 TIR update per frame, then 3, and so on. This leads to a stuttering motion, especially if the game frame rate is irregular as well. TrackIR 5 updates at 120 Hz. This means you will need to set your game and monitor to update at either 60 or 120 Hz to get the best motion you can get, but 60 is probably the safer bet since it is easier to maintain.

All good :)

And the Guru part for this wisdom doesnt come from me but Goa, he's the man who spent countless hours researching this and convincing me to give it a fair test too as I had the same assumption as Hekktor has or had. I gave it a try, looked left and right, panned my head and ever since Goa spoiled my Mega FPS hunt, baaahh, because he was and is right. There is a destinct micro stutter when you look 45-90° left or right and even worse when you pan left&right while looking at either side. You wont notice it looking 0-30° forward or aft, top or bottom I havent checked tbh. With helicopters it is less pronounced as you tend to fly slower anyways but with an airplane there is a BIG difference once you looked closely at the effect.

What the actual root cause is ? I dont know, we assume a hardware limitation inside TiR that locks it at 60Hz. They should release either a new device, like TiR-6/240fps to please the crowd

or fix it if it is software/firmware only.

And NO, I amno Computer Guru...LoL...I know how little I know and are satisfied with my 0.0001% of what there is. I still learn every day as IT changes so quickly, no one knows it all

and the best you can do, once you grabbed a foot and know how to set up systems, is stay with the wave. There are basics that one should know when he manages his PC, but this specific issue we discussed is far from trivial.

Thank Goa for 1 year of hunting down this issue and explaining the nature of it and how to cure it, with a payoff at the fps side.

All good :pilotfly:

You are far too modest sir :) The number of people you have helped on this forum , and the stellar advice given belie your protestations :)

I observed exactly the symptoms you describe , in the manner in which you described them , adding only that the effect is easiest-observed flying low . It may well have been in Goa's thread that i read of the solution , and the difference was indeed profound upon its application .

Copied from a Natural Point forum post :

 

What you are observing is a fundamental issue with devices having different update frequencies. To obtain a smooth motion you need all devices and software, in particular TIR, the game, and your monitor to update at a more-or-less same frequency. Otherwise you will get eg. two TIR updates within a single game frame and monitor refresh. Half a second later you could get 1 TIR update per frame, then 3, and so on. This leads to a stuttering motion, especially if the game frame rate is irregular as well. TrackIR 5 updates at 120 Hz. This means you will need to set your game and monitor to update at either 60 or 120 Hz to get the best motion you can get, but 60 is probably the safer bet since it is easier to maintain.

Hekktor is not wrong. And you're not wrong either. There is nothing that limits the monitors refresh rate as far as TrackIR is concerned. TiR cannot tell the monitor you must step down to xx Hz.

And as Hekktor mentioned, movies are typically shot in 24FPS and we don't seem to have complaints. Peter Jackson made news because he shot it in 48 FPS as I recall.

However, have you guys seen the videos of helicopter blades that don't seem to spin because of the sync between the camera and the blade movement?

If you want a smooth experience, everything has to play nicely. But TiR can't force the monitor to a lower Hz since it's not in control of the monitor's Hz.

so again, technically you're both correct. But svsmokey's advice is more practical if one wants a smoother experience. And Hekktor is technically correct, but may lead to choppy experience.

In the interest of accuracy , l never posited that TIR controls the monitor's refresh rate . My position is that a fixed 60hz (or 30 , or 120) is necessary for a stutter-free experience using TIR .

Having reviewed this thread , however , i do find that i was over-aggressive with some of my responses to Hekktor's posts . Please consider this post an apology extended .

I have spent 3h in Discord and DCS with Hekktor last night, 9pm till midnight, trying to explain the problem to him, doing the tests back and forth etc.

A: There are many different types of stutter, the one you have might not be the one we talk about.

B: Your machine needs to be able to push +60fps to make the test(s). If you cannot run DCS fluently above 60 fps you cannot see a difference as it stutters anyway, due to CPU, GPU or any other shortcoming in your PC.

C: You need to be able to recognize it visually if it is there. I myself had the symptom but never recognized it until Goa put my nose into the sh!t pile. Ever since I cannot not see it anymore, aaahhh LoL.

D: It has zero do to with Gsync, Vsync etc.. .

3h later and still 60 fps

For a butter-smooth experience in DCS , check Vsync (60 hz monitor) and adjust your graphics settings so you don't break vsync in your own worst-case scenario . For example , I test my settings (very) low over Vegas , monitoring via Afterburner , and have my graphics settings adjusted to leave 12-15 % headroom on CPU & GPU .

This is the best advice I would give to Noobs. Keep it simple. Obviously, the issues around V-sync, G-sync, Freesync, tearing, stutter, etc. are very confusing for people. Not to mention the variability between our builds, modules, maps, etc.

In my testing on my G-sync monitor with TrackIR, stutter is noticeable around 75-95 fps and more frequent when panning over your shoulder in jet aircraft, less so in props. Turning down heat blur settings can mitigate somewhat. A little below or above I perceived as smooth. At 120+ butter.

With decent hardware you can hit 166Hz at 1440p, over the desert or water, at high altitude, with just a wingman, in clear weather. That gets old quick.

I was able to run at 1080p pretty consistently at 150fps+. Pretty rare use case though. I'd just play at a higher resolution. Even with my new build (9900K/2080 Ti) and custom loop I don't think I'd be able to hit 166 at 1440p at low altitude in complex scenarios. We'll see. Haven't had time to finish it yet.

I usually play DCS on my big screen and use the monitor for shooters and CC. Much better experience at 4K60. Think of it this way. If you were flying a real plane and you saw a stutter, you should probably land right away and have a medical check up. When it happens on a PC simulator it's a complete immersion killer. Ruins the suspension of disbelief and reminds you that you are playing a computer game. Even 1440p at 65" looks pretty good with Anti-aliasing if you are having trouble pushing 4K with your respective specs. The smoothness is key, even if it means sacrificing some eye candy.

Even with the many technical people that are attracted to flight sims on this board there's a lot of speculation unfortunately. People should stick to reporting experiences with specific hardware under controlled conditions. I tested a lot of AAA game benchmarks with 2080 Ti's over the holiday along with DCS. The DCS engine is its own animal. Even in comparison to other DX11 games. The variability, new builds every 2 weeks, possibility of a Vulkan build in 2019, etc. It was hard for me to even come up with valid benchmarks without just brute force testing every combination of module and map.

Also, something to keep in mind for the really high frame rates. You start to hit physical limitations of what the hardware can actually do. Processors have gotten much better at doing more things at the same time rather than just brute force speed in a Moore's Law sense. Hope this helps.

Just found that nice video, I think is quit well made on vsync.

My actual monitor does not have but my next WILL have g- or freesync.

And frame-time. The very much reason for stuttering even on 60+ fps.

OK, got that UW 1600p thing. Not as big as expected, in total. Few inches higher than my former 1440p. Much more screen real estate. The curviness is a bit strange atm, but I get used to it more and more.

Position in cockpit locks a bit closer(!) than it used to be. Think i have to figure to tune the standard view angle to a wider aspect.

It's a new free sync LG monitor - but I don't get it g-synced atm.

From what I read with the new 417.71 driver I had installed freesync should be compatible but for what ever reason I don't get it to run as of yet (dp 1.2, driver, set it to ON on the monitor, yadayada, already talked to nvidia support, the want to email me if the figure out what might be the reason).

The thing runs super smooth on my gtx1080. The better peripheral view is amazing for the all over immersion.

Glad you got happy ;)

Ok.

MSI Afterburner with Riva tuner statistic server.

Framerate and

Frametime

If you don't get frametime to a steady reading low of 20ms (got it down to 17.5 ms) the whole stuttering starts to happen. Worst thing is, if the frametime jumps up and down...

With the RTSS I set the frame rate limit to 57, not 55, not 60. Only that get's me to that rock steady 17.5ms frame time and it

also gets the whole thing into sync with my monitor!

No tearing, no stutter, just freaking smooth regardless if I go down to 30ft or up to FL300.

I was about to send this monitor back, for no matter what reason I didn't get it's free sync to run on my gtx1080.

Just turns out that I don't need the damn stuff.

That was a long run. Each and every game setting tested, what does it do eye candy wise, what impact on cpu/gpu, each and every nVidia inspector setting (worst documented pice of software ever in my live), even after I got to learn that setting with the riva tuner frame limiter - tried to do it with profile inspector doesn't work. I do not have any clue why...

Uninstalled nvidia driver with ddu, reinstalled (mostly to get that !§$% freesync/g-sync to run - whole thing is obsolete to me!)

Happy I am, now, 12h later ;)

edit:

Just reread that former posting about g-sync / freesync - as of now I would say - forget it...

cpu i2500k sandy bridge @4.2, aircooled, 16Gb ram, gtx 1080, trackIr, uw screen

I just found this interesting post. I heard some people say that high performance hardware can help you spot enemy aircraft in distance. If that's true, what kinda hardware performance should I go after:

1. High resolution?

2. High performance graphics card?

3. High computing performance (larger ram and faster cpu etc).

Which one would help me see distance target better?

none of the above

lower resolution if at all, but best is a good Mark-I Eyeball

none of the above

 

 

lower resolution if at all, but best is a good Mark-I Eyeball

This ^^

Lower resolutions make it easier to spot the blurs in the distance, but there's still a bit of training the eyeball for what you're looking for. Black specs at higher resolutions in the air can be hard to see, but they're there. You can also see afterburners glowing at a distance.. they stand out especially at night, but are generally visible in the day as well.

Spotting contrails always helps. Hoping some day ED makes it so they aren't attached to view distance or whatever it is that causes them to disappear from time to time.

Also have an Axis or HOTAS key bind handy for zooming in and view reset for searching for targets.

Targets