JDAM precicion Bombing in Bad Weather

Hey,

im trying to learn the A-10C. Well it works quite good so far. I can drop every Bomb and Missile, still need training but at least i know how to use them.

But i have one Problem using the JDAM. The Description says its perfect for Bad weather.

But since i use the Target Pod for pointing it to a target i need good weather.

you can drop the Bomb on a waypoint but im missing the option to set a precicion waypoint like i can do it in BMS where i would plan such an Strike in Advance.

And since the A-10 also has no A-G Radar i dont know how to get any Target Coordinates for dropping them in Bad Weather.

Any Suggestions on this?

This per chance?

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3609001/how-to-enter-coordinates-into-your-cdu

partially yes, that describes very well how to enter the coordinates into the CDU but where did i get these coordinates from?

Lets say i want to bomb a bridge, where did i get the coordinates of that bridge?

A JTAC, your mission briefing or mission planner. JTAC is the only one you'll be able to use on multiplayer.

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If you don't happen to have a JTAC there still is one option, which is rather risky and certainly doesn't guarantee a hit: you can fly low, below the cloud cover, mark your target(s), break off, then come back at a safer altitude and just release your bombs on your previously marked points. JTAC certainly is preferable.

....where did i get the coordinates of that bridge?

A buddy in a Kamov is another option.

Well i think getting coordinates from Missionplaner is currently the only really viable option for that kind of operation. You cant open Missionplanner in Multiplayer?

Going below the Cloud wont help if weather is bad enough. A few clouds and rain is not really bad weather, im talking about night and heavy fog or something like that, you wouldnt go low level in such type of weather because if weather is good enough to go that low, its good enough to use TGP. I dont think thats a real option to put yourself into danger while heavily loaded when you are carrying GPS Guided Bombs which just needs some GPS Coordinates. Even a Kamov in Multiplayer is no option because im talking about a weather where you wouldnt take of in a helicopter.

What im searching for is a method to plan upfront. Bombing a Bridge or other Buildings isnt a type of Mission you would do without precice planning. Its just not a "oh theres a Target lets bomb it" type of Mission

Its a shame that you cant do precicion waypoints as easy as in BMS.

Seems to me that in this case DCS is a bit behind BMS. That i need something like a JTAC to get Coordinates for enemy troups is absolutely ok but the position of buildings, bridges and so on should be possible to get upfront even in multiplayer.

Well i think getting coordinates from Missionplaner is currently the only really viable option for that kind of operation. You cant open Missionplanner in Multiplayer?

 

Going below the Cloud wont help if weather is bad enough. A few clouds and rain is not really bad weather, im talking about night and heavy fog or something like that, you wouldnt go low level in such type of weather because if weather is good enough to go that low, its good enough to use TGP. I dont think thats a real option to put yourself into danger while heavily loaded when you are carrying GPS Guided Bombs which just needs some GPS Coordinates. Even a Kamov in Multiplayer is no option because im talking about a weather where you wouldnt take of in a helicopter.

 

What im searching for is a method to plan upfront. Bombing a Bridge or other Buildings isnt a type of Mission you would do without precice planning. Its just not a "oh theres a Target lets bomb it" type of Mission

 

Its a shame that you cant do precicion waypoints as easy as in BMS.

 

Seems to me that in this case DCS is a bit behind BMS. That i need something like a JTAC to get Coordinates for enemy troups is absolutely ok but the position of buildings, bridges and so on should be possible to get upfront even in multiplayer.

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When I bomb a bridge over the clouds with GBU-38, I usually get the precise cordinates from the map. At the beginning I try to use the six digit number, but the bomb always missing, and I don't know why. But when I type the whole digit number in the scratchpad, i.e. ten numbers+ two letters before, the bomb hit exactly. I simulated that I had get the numbers of a sattelite recon, Before I get in the mission.

Exactly how you do it, is in the A-10C manual, at page 459 in the pdf folder, and named: Entering UTM Data as New Waypoint. But don't forget that it is ten, instead of six digits to hit the target exactly.

Well i think getting coordinates from Missionplaner is currently the only really viable option for that kind of operation. You cant open Missionplanner in Multiplayer?

[...]

It really depends on the mission.

If the mission designer gives you a target and provides exact coords, then you just have to note these down and punch them into the navigation/targeting system.

Somehow, it seems like you'd like to note coords of stuff you see on the F10 map. That's not wrong at all, just be aware that there's no such map IRL. Well, okay, there is, that's what the TAD and datalink are all about, but someone has to mark targets on it, and in DCS, only JTACs will do that for you. ;)

But don't forget that it is ten, instead of six digits to hit the target exactly.

Good point. For a Bombs On Coordinates attack, there can't be too much precision, and a 10 digit grid is the most precise MGRS has to offer (1 by 1 meter).

Dont forget your elevation data. Whether your using 2,4,6,8 or 10 figure grids to drop GPS/INS guided weapons if you dont input the true elevation of your target the hits will not be accurate and will drop at where the grid meets 0 MSL.

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Does DCS have JDAM approach azimuth setting? This could help to hit a bring to come along the road direction instead of sideways to the bridge. The designated point may be a hole in the air but all that matters is the bomb hits the bridge on the way to the target!

DCS does not have this capability.

I dont even understand how pilots do it in real life. When using JDAM in the remarks of the CAS 9 line you can give an aircraft a final attack wedge i.e. Final attach heading betwee 220 and 250.

With JDAM there are practices of i.e. Weapon attack heading 235 for example. The aircraft can be on a different axis when releasing the weapon but after speaking with B-1 and F-15E pilots at length I have gotten wildly different answers. AC-130W will pretty much release a GBU39 on its heading but I suspect its because it flies at the speed of sadness.

I think when a B1 or Eagle release these weapons at speed and altitude the weapon follows the axis "roughly".

I understand what your requesting with regards to the bridge. I think its a sound decision and I would request a Weapon attack heading the bridge is on.

Remember the JDAM could just land off the bridge. Laser guided will most likely land short or on its designation and dumb bombs In my opinion fall to pilot proficiency.

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Attack headings/windows might be particularly useful when the attack aircraft are using coordinate-dependent weapons, as it is possible for the weapon’s FAH to differ significantly from the aircraft’s heading. If the JTAC/FAC(A) requires a specific attack heading for the weapon (but not the aircraft), that restriction must be stated clearly when the FAH is passed.

But also

Note: For off-axis weapons, weapons final attack heading may differ from aircraft heading at the time of release. Aircrew should inform JTAC when this occurs, and ensure that weapons FAHs comply with restrictions given.

FAH is a platform restriction. Weapon restriction is inherited from platform restriction. Restrictions on the weapon but not the platform should be clearly stated. If weapon terminal heading will be outside platform restrictions aircrew should inform the controller. If it is critical that the restriction applies to the weapon or the platform would depend on the reason for the restriction (laser acquisition, tall buildings, etc.).

That's how I read it.

Bridges are probably best attacked at their supports if the goal is complete destruction or the road deck if not (deny use but long term fixable). I think this quickly becomes a demolition engineering problem which varies by the method goal, bridge design, political situation, effects on miss, etc.

Thanks for that follow up Frederf.

I never got a clear picture regarding those releases from a host of pilots. I suspect as JDAM keeps evolving and CLOSE AIR SUPPORT this is an early development issue for lack of better words. Its not long ago GBU-39 were doing loops in the sky before deciding its time to go hit their target.

Best.

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