Bad cockpit design?

This argument is flawed as well. Seizures, loss of consciousness with the pilot slumping into the yoke, one guy intentionally overpowering the other etc., happen more frequently.

 

In all theses cases it's much more favourable to be able to disable the other guys controls.

I would curious to see your data on how frequently that kind of thing happens (I'm being serious, not smarty pants). I get what you are saying and it makes sense, but i would like to know how often things like that happen.

There is obviously trade-offs to any design, but it seems very counter intuitive to have controls that can work independently of each other, even if you can take control, there is still room for confusion.

About the AF447, that's just speculation, as the crew has entered stall condition that they failed to recognize, and there were many more things going wrong in there.

Like I said, contributed.

I think a much bigger problem is most airline pilots lack of currency in actually flying the plane instead of just managing computer systems 95% of the time.

(Wait, were you saying that the control issue happening at all is speculation?)

And why exactly can a pilot with a side stick not limp home to ditch by a carrier? I fly side stick style and it's much more comfortable and not particularly hard to 'fly' using the off hand with the sort of accuracy needed simply to get near a carrier group to bail. Landing on a carrier wouldn't be an option if you flew center stick anyway so I'm not really seeing your argument from a redundancy standpoint.

It’s hard to describe if you haven’t flown something with a real, full-sized stick in it. Because the center-stick has a longer arm and more throw, it allows the pilot to input smaller deflections and simultaneously receive more feedback for those inputs. The pilot receives feedback in the form of force and displacement, whereas with a side-stick the pilot receives less feedback from displacement, if any. In non-fly-by-wire aircraft, a center-stick also reflects the “stick-free neutral point” very well, meaning the stick centers where it is trimmed. This allows the pilot to quickly find trimmed condition by muscle memory.

Additionally, a center-mounted stick allows a pilot to fly with either hand in a cramped cockpit wearing restrictive gear, and use two hands to overcome high control forces (not necessarily a thing anymore.)

You can see by these descriptions how the value of a center-stick has decreased with time, as fly-by-wire (and HOTAS) aircraft have proliferated. This is why you’ll see the F-35 become the Navy’s first side-stick controlled carrier jet. It’s a big departure for the service, which has historically mandated the center-stick for fine control behind the boat.

It’s hard to describe if you haven’t flown something with a real, full-sized stick in it. Because the center-stick has a longer arm and more throw, it allows the pilot to input smaller deflections and simultaneously receive more feedback for those inputs. The pilot receives feedback in the form of force and displacement, whereas with a side-stick the pilot receives less feedback from displacement, if any. In non-fly-by-wire aircraft, a center-stick also reflects the “stick-free neutral point” very well, meaning the stick centers where it is trimmed. This allows the pilot to quickly find trimmed condition by muscle memory.

 

Additionally, a center-mounted stick allows a pilot to fly with either hand in a cramped cockpit wearing restrictive gear, and use two hands to overcome high control forces (not necessarily a thing anymore.)

 

You can see by these descriptions how the value of a center-stick has decreased with time, as fly-by-wire (and HOTAS) aircraft have proliferated. This is why you’ll see the F-35 become the Navy’s first side-stick controlled carrier jet. It’s a big departure for the service, which has historically mandated the center-stick for fine control behind the boat.

+1!

About the AF447, that's just speculation, as the crew has entered stall condition that they failed to recognize, and there were many more things going wrong in there.

Except that the AF447 CVR tells the tale. If the other crewmembers realized that Bonin (most junior crewmember who was on the controls) had been pulling the stick full aft the whole time, they might have recovered. Unfortunately they didn't understand he was keeping them in the stall until it was too late. You can read the moment of realization in the transcript, it's absolutely chilling.

Bonin (PF CM2): Mais je suis à fond à cabrer depuis tout à l’heure! (But I've been at full pitch up the whole time!)

Dubois (PNF): Non non non ne remonte pas! (No no no don't pull back!)

Had the sticks been linked, things may have gone differently. He was the reason the airplane was not responding in an understandable way for the rest of the crew. In my opinion, un-linked dual controls is a serious design flaw. I've got nothing serious against side-sticks, but unlinked controls is a bad idea.

This argument is flawed as well. Seizures, loss of consciousness with the pilot slumping into the yoke, one guy intentionally overpowering the other etc., happen more frequently.

 

In all theses cases it's much more favourable to be able to disable the other guys controls.

Which one has killed more people? The upper body of a pilot against a yoke is easily managable. Someone could lean into a stick by the same logic, and it would be even harder to manage. Sure, add a disconnect for binding flight controls (some already do,) but definitely don't build the airplane without dual feedback.

Except that the AF447 CVR tells the tale. If the other crewmembers realized that Bonin (most junior crewmember who was on the controls) had been pulling the stick full aft the whole time, they might have recovered. Unfortunately they didn't understand he was keeping them in the stall until it was too late. You can read the moment of realization in the transcript, it's absolutely chilling.

 

Had the sticks been linked, things may have gone differently. He was the reason the airplane was not responding in an understandable way for the rest of the crew. In my opinion, un-linked dual controls is a serious design flaw. I've got nothing serious against side-sticks, but unlinked controls is a bad idea.

 

 

 

Which one has killed more people? The upper body of a pilot against a yoke is easily managable. Someone could lean into a stick by the same logic, and it would be even harder to manage. Sure, add a disconnect for binding flight controls (some already do,) but definitely don't build the airplane without dual feedback.

I agree 100%!

I prefer a center stick. Also easier to take over with your left hand if you need to use your right hand for something (such as the mouse in the sim world).