How to Land the Dora

Practice.. practice..practice..

If it´s still too hard for You.. practice.

I never had problems landing the FW-190D9, but I also had alot of flying ours in the P-51D and A-10C among flying time in other sims.

It is definitly true that landing in a sim is harder than in real life, but You probably don´t like helpers to make it easier and less realistic.

FinnJ

Never had a problem landing the Dora, it's actually a lot easier than the Mustang.

It is extremely difficult to land the FW 190, and I believe it is actually more difficult in DCS than the actual plane.

 

I've watched the landing video and I stay in the 190 range with descent between 2 and 5, but it still will not sit down on the runway after a lot of attempts. It is almost to the point of unplayable.

 

I understand that you need to make it difficult, but I think it has gone beyond the extreme.

Posting a bashing post after a frustrating day isn't going to make you succeed.

You probably need some advises.

as much as im looking forward to the K4 release, im definitely not looking forward to similar complaints like this which will certainly arise with its release.

first i think you have to keep in mind, that its still labeled as beta...so there might come some changes in the near future.

also, if you have problems landing her, then i can only suggest what others have done already,...practice practice practice.i dont think the dora is hard to land at all.never had a problem with her, not even on first take off and landing.but i have 2years experience with the p51 already.

and especially after the latest adjustments, the dora is now way more stable than on its release.

what i would hate to see is the devs adjusting the flight models only to make it easier for players.i definitely want them to adjust flight models only to what they think is realistic, and not easy or convinient for players.at least for the realistic flight models.

for people who like it easy, there is the option for the simple flight model with every module, if you really cant enjoy it with the realistic one.what i dont believe though, as i think with a little practice, everyone is able to land her smoothly.

also, i doubt that the dcs dora is harder to land than a real dora...Yo-Yo mentioned, that in RL you never land a dora with two pointers.in dcs, thats no problem after little practice.

Yep, it isn't meant to be easy, it is meant to reflect real aircraft operations, and up till now all flight sims have "held your hand" when it comes to flight models. Just try and try again. When you succeed it is a real buzz.

I thought the Dora was pretty easy to land, so much so I did it first time (after about 15 take off attempts working out the correct method), and pretty much do it consistantly.

The P51D took me ages to land properly, think it took me about 20-30 goes before I managed it once.

For me it's a lot more difficult than the mustang which I can land no problem. Obviously I've never flown a FW in real life and have no idea what it's like...and honestly, if the real thing handles like the DCS version on landing I would be dead many times over :D I wouldn't want it to be made easier though, I'm sure after a lot of practice we'll get there, hopefully :P

From my RL flying taildraggers experience i think landing in DCS ( P-51 and D-9) are quite realistic and natural to me.

I rather think that something is not correct with take offs - both in P-51 and D-9. Planes behave during take off runing not natural for me, make crazy things expecially with a little flaps ( take off flaps). Of course never fly as such high power taildragger but i think BOS simulated ground handling and take offs much better and realistic to me. DCS is too " mechanic" ( or robotic) to me hard to explain but i feel it not natural.

Truly speaking prop planes take off in DCS are much harder to do correctly then landings. So something is not right. Landing IRL are much difficult to do corrctly then take offs. In DCS there is opposite.

Follow someone in a car IRL, you can be inch perfect in your formation.

Refuel in a tanker in DCS and it becomes impossible.

Input and output are difficult to measure without feedback, effectively if you watch RL pilots they move their sticks and rudder differently. But because they have different sticks to us...or to put it accurately, there is a range of input devices with different sentitivties, notoriously more inaccurate than in real life. Then add the feeling in your body of acceleration and deceleration, of rise and fall, your extra peripheral vision. I'm goign out on a limb to say it's harder to fly at the desk than it is in real life, at least in the general flying sense which I have flown.

You need more practice, simple as that. I have gone from making hundreds of craters at takeoff and landing to taking off and landing successfully 90% of the time. With more practice, I think even that will improve.

The key to landing is to pull the stick when descending until you are in ground effect and the plane wants to go up again. That is the moment you ever so slightly center the stick and you should touchdown without bouncing up again.

And by the way, the K4 is supposedly harder to land, because it has a narrower wheelbase. This supposedly killed a lot of rookie Luftwaffe pilots.

I believe sooner or latter someone will correct the propwash bug introduced with the fw 190 release.

This makes takeoff with wind unrealistically difficult.

Take the Batumi takeoff situation. Using the Fw190 it is even more evident, but the same applies to the p51d.

Set wind from your left ( port ) side at, say 10 or 11 m/s. Apply takeoff power and, in a real prop aircraft, talidragger or not you would expect to use right rudder to counter the tendency of the aircraft to weathercock, and even aileron into the wind.... Forget it - as it is now modelled in DCS you will have to use full left rudder ( into the wind! ) and even right stick, and even so you will in the fw190 probably find yourself leaving the rw downwindside :-/

If you repeat the test with wind from your right ( starboard ), the opposite will apply, with you finding that sometimes even full right rudder will not be sufficient...

This need to use rudder into the wind and opposite aileron is counter-intuitive, and makes takeoffs, landings and even taxiing feel strange when x-wind is present.

Of course if you test with the jets, a10c, su25t, ..., they'll behave correctly, there being no deflected propwash effects.

No, no ,no... the testers have said it's alright, so the real pilots must be wrong!

In WWII 90% of the german pilots dying at start... because of flase rudder use yes.. that's the truth... and my mom can fly without wings... onyl with the use of her brain.... believe the simulation testers! :lol:

Of course, no sim is perfect, and ED, just like other active devlopment teams, strive to get their products better and better with each new release.

This is a problem, but we can't forget about the many exxcellent aspects of DCS's flight dynamics, for fixed and rotary wing aircraft, modern fighters, etc...

It'll certainly get addressed sooner or later. They're busy now, very busy, with the mighty K4 about to be released :-)

I guess the real question is, are they more or less realistic than the BOS and other versions. No one would deny that there is still room for improvement, for the developers as well as for the users, these aircraft are a steep learning curve.

They're getting better, that's what matters.

last night I watched a document about World War airplane. it is said that the number of pilots died in training was more than in dogfight. I guess taking off and landing killed a lot. Not so surprise it is hard to manage these tail-draggers.

I'm not surprised at all that it is more difficult in the sim than in the real thing. We have no sense of motion in our chairs and our joysticks have much shorter throw than an aircraft stick. But I don't want it made easier to fit the needs of a computer game.

I guess the real question is, are they more or less realistic than the BOS and other versions

you don't wanna go that way - It is Eagle Dynamic Forum here, moderators will not allow that comparison, which i totally understand.

I think it would be interresting to find some "landing" video of real FW190 and compare with video of DCS:Dora, with same camera angle.

I'm not surprised at all that it is more difficult in the sim than in the real thing. We have no sense of motion in our chairs and our joysticks have much shorter throw than an aircraft stick. But I don't want it made easier to fit the needs of a computer game.

Totally agree !

Ok guys, I've got two tracks here of me practicing landing the dora... Most of the time I can touch down ok, I think but after that I always seem to lose control and either lose a wing or end up as a crater at the side of the runway :D if someone could take a look at these and let me know where I'm going wrong it would be much appreciated :thumbup:

fw1.trk

fw2.trk

Oh absolutely, I was making a rhetorical point, not asking for opinions.

It looked very good, until touchdown.

Try flaring a bit more with increased AoA, when you see runway on sides, to stay as long as possible in air.You have the right AoA when you feel all 3 wheels touchdown almost at once. (Only flare to just below center on Vertical speed indicator)

Edit; Watching track 2, I see you got this covered.

Rudders are very important too just after touchdown, but keeping the stick towards you to lock the wheel, help with stability, as long as landing is straight.

And also toebrakes, if you have a Rudder controller, help a lot.

Well, I will continue to practice. I use the G940. It could possibly be sensitivity in the pedals. I can get on the ground, but after that the slow fishtailing begins.

Either way, for me DCS is so good in DK2 that I could get over any issues.

If none of you have tried this in DK2 then you have not flown DCS.

I just got the Dora a couple days ago during sale, but after 2 failed takeoffs (not fatal) I got in air, and had one landing going off the track, mostly because it was unexpected. ( I forgot the lock of stearing wheel)

But I used to fly IL-2 before, and learned alot in the last Cliffs of Dover. (Corrected, I did fly Burning Cliffs too, but both are a few years back, and I mixed it)

And I made better and better takeoffs, and landings, but it really help to have good equipment too.

I don't think it's poor simulated at all.

Tip; Use the brakes to begin with, to increase power before rolling, and you have liftoff faster to avoid too much fishtailing. Don't use brakes at all to adjust direction, only rudders, exept for landing. (I've seen some do that in Youtube, one failed alot, maybe ok early at too slow speed, but propwash should help making rudders work)

Also, to be prepared for the wingstall at stallspeed during takeoff, helps a little.

I was reading last night that when 6 Staffel of JG2 converted from BF109 to FW190s in 1942 they lost 11 FW190s to accidents in less than 4 months. These were experienced pilots of the BF109 so I doubt that flying the FW was the cakewalk that other sims make it. Alot of Germany's pilot losses weren't air combat losses but accidents, flak, etc. Just practice and read other peoples tips to help you out. The Dora is just one of those planes that when you get it ... your good to go after that.

It looked very good, until touchdown.

Try flaring a bit more with increased AoA, when you see runway on sides, to stay as long as possible in air.You have the right AoA when you feel all 3 wheels touchdown almost at once. (Only flare to just below center on Vertical speed indicator)

Edit; Watching track 2, I see you got this covered.

Rudders are very important too just after touchdown, but keeping the stick towards you to lock the wheel, help with stability, as long as landing is straight.

And also toebrakes, if you have a Rudder controller, help a lot.

Thanks for the input. I guess I mostly need to work on rudder control once I'm down, easier said than done though :P