Does Preload radius setting do anything?

According to the manual, the Preload radius setting is supposed to load terrain objects into memory with more memory being used the larger the radius.

In my testing I'm not seeing any difference in memory usage with Preload Radius setting at 100 vs 150000. Does this setting actually do anything or is currently disabled?

Logging system RAM usage in RTSS shows little to no difference between Preload min and max settings while floating around the PG Map.

Same here, what are we missing?

The manual? Where is this manual?

The manual? Where is this manual?

C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\Doc\DCS User Manual EN.pdf

Page 19:

PRELOAD RADIUS. Radius of the preloaded terrain around user position in meters. A large setting can decrease hard disk swapping but it requires more system RAM.

good thread. i was thinking about making a thread about the same topic.

i would want some technical explanation from the devs, what this setting actually does.

the official explanation does not make much sense, does it? i mean a programm sould always use as much ram as it needs and is allowed to. why should users deliberately limit the use of system rescources?!

for me it this option feels like a debug option of some sort, that should not be in a release build (same with the weird implementation of "gamma", but this is for another thread, i guess).

that being said, i do notice big effects when changing prelaod radius. it's only that it's not the effect that stated in the manual.

i have only 8gigs of ram (but can still run the game on very high settings, 60fps on caucassus with small/medium missions). i used to run with the compeltely arbitrary setting of "6000" (i think it was preselected with "high" preset) and the game ran well, but loading times were annoyingly long and ingame there was sometimes severe "hdd-lag" when f.e. cycling through units/airfields etc.

i now changed preload to "3000" and loading times are much faster, while there is less "hdd-lag" when cycling units.

on both settings i would get around 60fps in my test scenario and with both settings i would see the same ram usage.

what is going on here?

my first guess is, that ram management is a total mess in dcs, my second guess would be, that preload radius has more to do with page file or some other cache (i could imagine that dcs caches data to a place on the drive that it is installed on instead of putting it in ram).

can we please get an official in depth exlanation of what it does and what it is supposed to do???

As my observation, the preload radius is related with the pagefile size but not the physical RAM usage. The larger you set, the more pagefile caches and more loading time needed.

The preload sets how much, in distance, from you, does the game pre load files(textures).

The more ram and if you have dcs on a ssd, the more preload you can set. Results should vary on graphic settings too.

As you in increase the preload, it will increase your ram usage, to a certain moment, after which dcs starts preloading on your page file and you will see a drop in ram usage. DCS will load what it need right now in your RAM and everything else will be put on your page file

The big need for a lot of memory, I believe comes from the large size of the textures. Some time ago, there was a thread showing how the file type dcs uses for textures takes a lot of space and how other file types had the same quality for a lot less size.

Hopefully Vulkan will make a lot of good changes for DCS

The preload sets how much, in distance, from you, does the game pre load files(textures).

 

The more ram and if you have dcs on a sad, the more preload you can set. Results should vary on graphic settings too.

 

As you in increase the preload, it will increase your ram usage, to a certain moment, after which dcs starts preloading on your page file and you will see a drop in ram usage. DCS will load what it need right now in your RAM and everything else will be put on your page file

 

The big need for a lot of memory, I believe comes from the large size of the textures. Some time ago, there was a thread showing how the file type dcs uses for textures takes a lot of space and how other file types had the same quality for a lot less size.

 

Hopefully Vulkan will make a lot of good changes for DCS

Shadow,

I understand your thoughts, but wouldn’t you expect the overflow into page file to only happen when the PC has run out of ram.

I run with 24GB in total, typically around 6gb free on a more complex map. Can we suggest a value to DCS of the ram we’d like it t to use as a max value?

Shadow,

I understand your thoughts, but wouldn’t you expect the overflow into page file to only happen when the PC has run out of ram.

I run with 24GB in total, typically around 6gb free on a more complex map. Can we suggest a value to DCS of the ram we’d like it t to use as a max value?

Correct, the pagefile isn't used unless you run out of available system memory. In my testing with page file enabled, DCS doesn't use it unless I force it to use all available memory. You can do that by setting "preloadRadius = 0" in the options.lua. I don't recommend doing that for anything other than testing though.

Even with hundreds of objects loaded in a mission it still doesn't use all 32 GB that I have.

wat?

dcs “pre-load to the pagefile”?

that is incorrect. it does not work like that. and dcs can’t do it.

no operating system allows user applications to access its private pagefile. it is not even technically possible.

wat?

dcs “pre-load to the pagefile”?

 

that is incorrect. it does not work like that. and dcs can’t do it.

 

no operating system allows user applications to access its private pagefile. it is not even technically possible.

DCS itself will not move it into the pagefile.

It will move the data into RAM and when thats full windows OS will start moving it into the page file, because the pagefile is the extension of the RAM.

As the stuff in RAM is cleared, the content in the pagefile is then moved into RAM.

I guess that the files from the Pre-load are kind of compressed when read from the DCS file folders and then unpacked into firstly RAM and then into the page file when RAM has ben exhausted.

The sixe of the Pre-load area means that more data is loaded into RAM and possible page file.

If You only have a small amount of RAM, then it makes little point of having a high pre-load radius, cause data will only que up in the page file.

Having lot´s of RAM and a a high pre-load radius will mean that data is much quicker available for the sim.

But things arent static, cause the amount of data within the set pre-load radius are dependent on the amount of objects (especially AI units).

With 16GB or more I guess setting Pre-load radius to 15000 is fine for most non complex missions.

Well, our findings are different then, not saying you are wrong.

My PageFile can go up & beyond 30GB and stay there forever when I fly WHILE my RAM hovers around 18-22GB. So that voids somehow the idea that PF is only used when RAM is saturated.

The thing is, there is NO definitiv page from MS that really explains how the memory construct in 10 really works and shifts. I base my findings on actual graphing ( if those are true is a different story ) and try to understand it with what I cross-read on the net for the past...ahhh..20+ years for Windows memory management..and I still havent found the 1 and only correct answer.

The brute force way is 32G and 32GB swap on SSD. Not the most elegant and cheapest but it works without any CTD, errors or BSOD's, my DCS always exits properly and hardly ever has problems. Tho YMMV

Well, our findings are different then, not saying you are wrong.

 

My PageFile can go up & beyond 30GB and stay there forever when I fly WHILE my RAM hovers around 18-22GB. So that voids somehow the idea that PF is only used when RAM is saturated.

What are you using to monitor your pagefile usage that makes you think it's using 30 GB?

I've just gone to test this myself. As per my sig, I have 24GB of ram.

Tested on a fairly complex single player mission.

DCS RAM usage with pre-load nearly maxed out was around 5.2Gb, with a Pagefile use of roughly 24Gb. At the time, I had 12GB of free RAM

With pre-load nearly minimised, same mission. RAM usage was 6GB, Pagefile about the same.

In short, makes no logical sense at all, and with all the free RAM, why is the Pagefile being hit so much?

...

 

In short, makes no logical sense at all, and with all the free RAM, why is the Pagefile being hit so much?

Same question.

I've just gone to test this myself. As per my sig, I have 24GB of ram.

Tested on a fairly complex single player mission.

 

DCS RAM usage with pre-load nearly maxed out was around 5.2Gb, with a Pagefile use of roughly 24Gb. At the time, I had 12GB of free RAM

 

With pre-load nearly minimised, same mission. RAM usage was 6GB, Pagefile about the same.

 

In short, makes no logical sense at all, and with all the free RAM, why is the Pagefile being hit so much?

Can one of you guys post a screenshot of what you think is pagefile usage? Task Manager does NOT show pagefile usage. If you're looking at the "Commited" memory in task manager that is not your pagefile usage.

The only way to see pagefile usage is by using Performance Monitor and enabling the pagefile usage counter.

I used MSI Afterburner, which includes a specific metric for pagefile.

I used MSI Afterburner, which includes a specific metric for pagefile.

I have seen the same effect in afterburner-heavy pagefile usage and low ram load .

Im installing 32 GB of RAM, whats the highest setting I can use?

I hope some one from ED will chime in and give a more thoroughly explanation of what to expect.

I added 8 GB more RAM recentyl to bring me to 16GB (the max my motherboard supports). It has helped alot, specifically for the Persion gulf map.

But how to best use Your resources seems to be a mystery.

No real gains to proper DCS memory control seems to have been added and feedback from ED is very spuriuos to non existant.

Instead of adding more modules and features, I would rather like to see some fixes to allready notified and/or affirmed bugs, as well as a consolidating update to everything included.

My feeling is that rather than nearing a real stable release version, we tend to move into an unfinished beta/alpha version, bringing in alot of unfinished content.

Also ED should start whipping those 3rd party addon developer who doesn´t bring forward the state of their unfinished modules, and stop asking them to start projects that come in the way of the projects they allready got paid for in early access.

I used MSI Afterburner, which includes a specific metric for pagefile.

I use MSI Afterburner also... and it DOES NOT show you your pagefile usage. I assume you're talking about the "Commit charge" counter. That just shows the same thing as "Commited" memory in Windows Task Manager. It has nothing to do with your pagefile.

Those counters go up to 20-30+ GB on my system also, with the pagefile DISABLED. This is why there is so much debate/confusion over pagefiles in DCS. People aren't monitoring the usage of it correctly. If you really want to see how much your pagefile is using you have to use windows Performance Monitor.

1.) Launch Performance Monitor>Select "Performance Monitor" in the left pane

2.) Click the + sign at the top, then find "Paging File" on the list of counters and select it.

3.) Add both Usage counters for your pagefile and click Add, then click OK.

4.) Change the graph type to "report" by selecting the graph icon at the top

Now launch DCS and run some missions and tell me how much your page file is being used.

C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\Doc\DCS User Manual EN.pdf

 

Page 19:

 

PRELOAD RADIUS. Radius of the preloaded terrain around user position in meters. A large setting can decrease hard disk swapping but it requires more system RAM.

Exactly. If you have enough RAM to preload the max, the likelihood of stuttering is reduced.

I hope some one from ED will chime in and give a more thoroughly explanation of what to expect.

 

Instead of adding more modules and features, I would rather like to see some fixes to allready notified and/or affirmed bugs, as well as a consolidating update to everything included.

YES... this! We get little to no updates on work being done to the game engine so as a customer it becomes frustrating. Communication regarding updates to the Hornet have been great, but I'd like to see that same level of communication be applied to work being done to the game engine itself.

I've never noticed a difference, therefore I keep it all the way down.

I use MSI Afterburner also... and it DOES NOT show you your pagefile usage. I assume you're talking about the "Commit charge" counter. That just shows the same thing as "Commited" memory in Windows Task Manager. It has nothing to do with your pagefile.

 

Those counters go up to 20-30+ GB on my system also, with the pagefile DISABLED. This is why there is so much debate/confusion over pagefiles in DCS. People aren't monitoring the usage of it correctly. If you really want to see how much your pagefile is using you have to use windows Performance Monitor.

 

1.) Launch Performance Monitor>Select "Performance Monitor" in the left pane

2.) Click the + sign at the top, then find "Paging File" on the list of counters and select it.

3.) Add both Usage counters for your pagefile and click Add, then click OK.

4.) Change the graph type to "report" by selecting the graph icon at the top

 

Now launch DCS and run some missions and tell me how much your page file is being used.

Perhaps you are on a different version of Afterburner . My graph is clearly marked "pagefile" .