[2.5.6] Refuel and rearm

Now we can't refuel/rearm anymore when engines are on.

 

We have to stop both engines, request rearl/refuel and then turn on engines

Isn't this realistic?

At least I know aircrafts can refuel mid air while the engine is running perhaps not so on the ground.

I would think the the guys re-arming could be doing so with lots of risk with engine running.

 

I am not sure if this new development is a bug and an intended change by Ed

 

I remember reading somewhere in the forum debates on whether the refueling/re-arming on the ground was correct when engine is running.

It's a bug. ED and belsimtek modules don't suffer from it (except for the P-51 for some reason), but most (if not all) 3rd party modules have that as well

I had to roll back to 2.5.5. Ground crews refused to rearm or refuel because they said they were out of supply, and when spawning on the carrier wouldn't hook up ground power or air because I was "moving". Wing sweep didn't seem to initialize properly when spawning in the air... It seemed I had to cycle manual/auto and hit the CADC reset before it would start functioning. Didn't do any more digging than that because I wasn't in the mood for troubleshooting.

Isn't this realistic?

At least I know aircrafts can refuel mid air while the engine is running perhaps not so on the ground.

I would think the the guys re-arming could be doing so with lots of risk with engine running.

 

I am not sure if this new development is a bug and an intended change by Ed

 

I remember reading somewhere in the forum debates on whether the refueling/re-arming on the ground was correct when engine is running.

 

While yes it is realistic it’s also still a game. I don’t want to have to go through a start every time I fly it, i spend all day going through check lists I don’t always want to do it when I get Home. To save time in missions we often start hot and rearm then go. I understand the whole realism thing but sometimes it’s just a bit annoying, it’s not affecting flight realism so why force us to start cold and dark every time, let us rearm hot and then we can decide if we want to do it by the book in hardcore mode or not and just go flying, just my 2 cents

 

 

But judging by other posts in this thread it’s a bug.

 

Either way let’s see what the legends at heatblur do :)

Edited February 15, 2020 by PSYKOnz

Try idle and handbrake on

Try idle and handbrake on

 

This is what I was going to try myself later today.

 

Starting from cold not being able to get the alignment started until after you're reloaded is not what happens in the real world. However, in the game Jester won't start his alignment until you have an engine running - so far as I know.

Try idle and handbrake on

 

Tried this it does not work.

 

here are my test results

 

1) hot start, engines idle: unable, they tell you to idle your engines.

 

2) Hot start, parking brake on, idle engines: unable, they say that they have no weapons in stock then tell you to idle your engines.

 

3) hot start, shut down both engines: "copy" then they rearm you

 

This is what I was going to try myself later today.

 

Starting from cold not being able to get the alignment started until after you're reloaded is not what happens in the real world. However, in the game Jester won't start his alignment until you have an engine running - so far as I know.

 

that would be a good change to make!

 

that would be a good change to make!

 

 

 

 

Jester is following the real world start up checklist. Alignment was done after engines were spooled.

 

 

 

As for rearm, that is a bug. It seems something changed in the ground crew menus/ radio, hence certain items do not seem to work, including air supply etc..

 

Hopefully it will be fixed with the next patch.

Jester is following the real world start up checklist. Alignment was done after engines were spooled.

 

 

 

As for rearm, that is a bug. It seems something changed in the ground crew menus/ radio, hence certain items do not seem to work, including air supply etc..

 

Hopefully it will be fixed with the next patch.

 

Adding to that, NATOPS has the RIO do the alignment after both engines are online.

 

This is due to two reasons.

 

1. The engine startups and electrical generators coming online and getting connected can cause transients that can interrupt or restart the WCS thus trashing the alignment.

 

2. Doing the correct checklist tests for startup involves testing the emergency generators and this is even more likely to interrupt or void an alignment.

 

Neither of these are currently implemented but they might be.

 

In any case, like Ironmike says, Jester is following procedure.

Adding to that, NATOPS has the RIO do the alignment after both engines are online.

 

This is due to two reasons.

 

1. The engine startups and electrical generators coming online and getting connected can cause transients that can interrupt or restart the WCS thus trashing the alignment.

 

2. Doing the correct checklist tests for startup involves testing the emergency generators and this is even more likely to interrupt or void an alignment.

 

Neither of these are currently implemented but they might be.

 

In any case, like Ironmike says, Jester is following procedure.

 

That makes sense, i doubt ealy 70s power rails had great regulation

Jester is following the real world start up checklist. Alignment was done after engines were spooled.

 

 

 

As for rearm, that is a bug. It seems something changed in the ground crew menus/ radio, hence certain items do not seem to work, including air supply etc..

 

Hopefully it will be fixed with the next patch.

 

Hopefully it will be.

And this is why I said “let’s see what the legends at heatblur do”

 

As per usual, you guys are nailing it, thank you so much for your continued amazing work! It’s easy to get confused with all the different information that’s out there on things like this. I’m eternally grateful to you guys, thanks for all you do

This bug also exists for startup as well. Ground crew won't disconnect ground power when one engine is running. This makes the startup procedure... undesirable :p

This bug also exists for startup as well. Ground crew won't disconnect ground power when one engine is running. This makes the startup procedure... undesirable :p

 

i just drive off :music_whistling:

 

I remember reading somewhere in the forum debates on whether the refueling/re-arming on the ground was correct when engine is running.

 

So, the answer is "it depends" but generally yes. Though it isn't routinely done in peactime except to practice it.

 

Harrier hot-pit refuel/rearm

 

 

F16 hot pit refuel

 

 

I couldn't find anything like this on a Carrier however, and I would assume that the procedures might be different, like (goto hangar to refuel/rearm) cuz having live ordnance/fuel on the deck is maybe too dangerous?

Edited February 18, 2020 by Harlikwin

i just drive off :music_whistling:

 

WhAt ArE YoU DoInG!?!?! :megalol:

i just drive off :music_whistling:

i don´t want to injure my ground crew

So, the answer is "it depends" but generally yes. Though it isn't routinely done in peactime except to practice it.

 

 

I can't speak for fighters but we hot refuel armed helicopters every single day in the Canadian Air Force. At sea we even refuel them while they fly along side the ship's deck.

Just to add, this happens to all aircraft, A-10c included which is designed to allow for this....just throwing it out there that this can’t be intended....especially disconnecting power and air which is sorta required to start said engines, that then disallow you from disconnecting....

Have you seen how the GPU is handled on every big airport ?

 

Having someone doing things or other on airplane with motor running is a very common thing

So, the answer is "it depends" but generally yes. Though it isn't routinely done in peactime except to practice it.

 

Harrier hot-pit refuel/rearm

 

 

F16 hot pit refuel

 

 

I couldn't find anything like this on a Carrier however, and I would assume that the procedures might be different, like (goto hangar to refuel/rearm) cuz having live ordnance/fuel on the deck is maybe too dangerous?

For the carrier part, we keep live ordnance on deck back behind the island. We can hot pump (refuel with the engines running) and we do it a lot actually. But rearming while the engines or electrical power applied is a no no. Aircraft has to be cold and dark for rearming to be done in real life. It's for ground safety and stray voltage possibilities.

 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

just curious, which fighter cannot be hot fueled and hot armed...

 

i'm pretty sure the above planes, 14/15/18 can.

 

also, with ed breaking this , nerfing and buffing stuff.. I think it is time we call for "realism" and just accept that even ED treats this like a game...

Here's some carrier footage.

 

1:50

 

 

Can't tell if the engines are still running, but the pilots never got out.