SU-33 for dogfight?

I did some search and hardly see anyone use flanker D to dogfight but just to play carrier/refilling ops only, makes me wondering if flanker D is really bad for PVE / PVP situation.

old posts says the bird bleeds energy quick, low WTR, poor substantial turn rate make it inferior to su-27 or even f15c /f16/ f18 to the extend of almost obsolete in MP, while some say the difference is minor, can be neglected.

i know most of the players acquired the bird with FC3 package, so they can choose a better flanker to dogfight, but mine is given as gift by my friend as the only modern fighter in my lineup, I am wondering if i should buy a su27 or f15c just to be on par with other players in MP situation, personally i want to make the best out of it cause i hate giving up.

I do have experience in spitfire and bf109 in IL2 so i understand energy is the key, and i do know "any bird is good if you know what your are doing", but i think we shall all admit that "to work extra hard just to be on par" is a bad idea, and L2P is just a paradox.

can someone plays both birds can share the experience if the performance difference is quite significant or obvious that a different set of tactics and mindset shall be adopted for the two flankers. su-33 learning material is lacking at the moment, so i just learn from those of su-27 currently

Many thanks for your attention and polite reply, fly safe, land safe

I have to admit, I've not tested the FC3 birds in neutral dogfighting setups, it's been many years since they were the only thing going. I don't there's much dogfighting in MP, it tends to be BVR or ambush, which you might call a dogfight, but not many people would choose to dogfight on an equal footing, and neither should they, it's quite risky. Realistically meeting a flanker with a light loadout and the equal same for a Eagle lightly loaded and fuelled in DCS mp is quite uncommon unless its staged. Exploiting strengths and weaknesses, the ambush would suit the Sukois. If you are seeing a lot of Su27 dogfighting Eagles, which server is that on?

Well, you can do it. It's mainly a strike aircraft and being naval is a bit heavier than 27 but the difference is not huge. Certainly not bigger than pilot skill and fuel state or weaponry at hand.

It’s canards and weight can have up to 20% effect in speed and range. The advantage you get from more wing area and high alpha control does not make up for it. Doesn’t help that with space for two more R-27s people choose to usually load them up.

It can do a lot of things it’s really good at, but in a neutral fight with Su-27/J-11 with equal pilots it’s at a marked disadvantage

Like every aircraft the Su-33 has advantages and disadvantages. It's heavier than the Su-27 so has a marginally lower T/W ratio. That being said it also has canards which the Su-27 doesn't and is notably steadier at high AOA, potentially giving you slightly better ultimate nose authority for a gun kill or R-73 shot. That being said, it's heavier so bleeding significant amounts of energy in a high-G, high-AOA manoeuvre carries more risk than it does in the Su-27.

Ultimately the Su-33 is more of a multi-role fighter than the Su-27, even though the -27 can carry air to ground ordnance. The DCS Su-33 is also notably missing things like the SVP-24 bombing system which supposedly gives it significantly enhanced accuracy with non-guided bombs. Exactly what upgrades the Russian navy Su-33's have received is unclear but it could be argued that they're much closer to being a navalized Su-27SM than the baseline Su-27S that we have in DCS.

Exactly what upgrades the Russian navy Su-33's have received is unclear but it could be argued that they're much closer to being a navalized Su-27SM than the baseline Su-27S that we have in DCS.

Doesn't look like that case. Su-33 is early born branch.

https://s019.radikal.ru/i600/1204/c2/0aaff76d976e.jpg

Yeah I believe there’s some to this day that don’t even have a RWR. Ours only has SPO-15 Beryoza for playability. I don’t think the first ones got L150 Pastel unil 2012-2016 right before the deployment to Syria

Things like changes to IRST are not modeled

Like every aircraft the Su-33 has advantages and disadvantages. It's heavier than the Su-27 so has a marginally lower T/W ratio. That being said it also has canards which the Su-27 doesn't and is notably steadier at high AOA, potentially giving you slightly better ultimate nose authority for a gun kill or R-73 shot. That being said, it's heavier so bleeding significant amounts of energy in a high-G, high-AOA manoeuvre carries more risk than it does in the Su-27.

It also has a larger wing area, which in combination with the higher weight means higher wing loading and thus a lower G-rating( 8 ). Anyway, the entire aerodynamic configuration is different, so I guess much depends on the situation.

Ultimately the Su-33 is more of a multi-role fighter than the Su-27, even though the -27 can carry air to ground ordnance.

Not really - although Sukhoi clearly had ambitions in this regard, its quite evident that the Soviet/Russian navy always saw it just as an Su-27 air dominance fighter capable of operating from a carrier, while the role of strike-fighter was assigned to the MiG-29K(and Yak-41) - much like with the US Tomcat/Hornet combination.

The DCS Su-33 is also notably missing things like the SVP-24 bombing system which supposedly gives it significantly enhanced accuracy with non-guided bombs.

I don't know if you could say that the SVP-24 is missing - it depends on what period you want to depict, since the SVP-24 is very recent addition. For the vast majority of its operating life, it had the exact same armament and systems as the Su-27S - safe for a couple of extra wing stations, a better OLS, a much more sophisticated navigation system....and the missing RWS.

Exactly what upgrades the Russian navy Su-33's have received is unclear but it could be argued that they're much closer to being a navalized Su-27SM than the baseline Su-27S that we have in DCS.

Not as far as I can tell - so far it seems that the upgrades the Su-33 has received are exactly the SVP-24(and a new MFD in place of the old IPV for the purpose) along with the long overdue L-150 RWS and improved engines. There are rumors that they may go for a further Su-27SM style multirole upgrade, but I guess we will see if it materialises.

IMO it dogfights very well. It fights very similar to the hornet, just less crispy but with more feedback it’s great for high AOA pounces and low and slow is the name of the game, just like the bug. Have to be more gentle with the controls though, the FCS is not as smart. But Overall I find it very nimble.