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Wait for new ryzen?


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All,

I currently have a custom looped PC with the specs below that’s a few years old. I recently replaced the gpu with a new evga 2080ti and hydro copper water block (old was a 980ti hydro copper. Although frame rates increased some (I fly exclusively in VR using samsung odyessy+), the change wasn’t as dramatic as I expected. I’m currently running the i7-6700k at 4.5mhz as that seems to be the limit with my chip and I’m thinking the problem is the CPU bottlenecking the system. Was thinking of upgrading but wondered if it would be better to wait until the new ryzen chips came out to decide? Since dcs uses only 2 cores, the fastest single core clock speed seems to be goal rather than more cores right? Although the 2700x seems to beat intels offerings in most games, i’m thinking in DCS, the lower clock rate of the ryzen cpus results in lower performance? What would you recommend?

 

Specs:

I7-6700k @ 4.5mhz

32mb 3000hz ddr4

Gigabyte z-170x gaming 3

Evga 2080ti black w/ evga water block

360mm custom water cooled loop

500gb nvme m.2 drive

500mb sata ssd

2gb hdd

Odyessy+ VR headset


Edited by Rossterman

I7-6700k @ 4.5ghz

Gigabyte gaming 3 motherboard

32gb 3000hz ddr4

EVGA 2080ti black w/ hydrocopper water cooling

360mm custom water cooled loop for CPU and Vid card

500mb nvme ssd

256mb sata ssd

2gb hdd

Samsung Odyessy +

TM warthog stick & throttle

MS ff2 stick

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1) I am using a 6 core, 12 thread Intel CPU at 4.8GHz fixed clock. I get good results (with a RTX 2080Ti at 5280x2880 resolution). However, while DCS is running all threads are active / busy. So I am only 2 cores and 300 MHz ahead of you...

 

2) My CPU does not throttle at all. Hence the solid OC. You said you have a custom loop: how are your temps and is there any CPU throttling? It looks like you are using only a 360 for OCed CPU and powerful GPU... this is bare minimum. Anything you could do to improve your loop efficiency would probably pay off. But I'd need to know your temps to be more confident vs a guess. For example my CPU has it's own loop with 1 D5 and a 480 rad. The GPU has its own D5 and separate rad.

 

If you can't upgrade radiator area, consider upgrading to the best fans you can get. And or make sure that you are getting a high volume of cold air puched from outside, into your case. Best fans are NF-A12x25 in 120mm size. Arguably they are as good as the best 140mm fans. An NF-A14x25 is on the cards but will be at least a year before release.

 

3) If I were you, I would upgrade (most likely) from the OCed 6700K. But I would definately wait to see what AMD come up with Ryzen 3. It will have more cores, probably run faster (certainly single cores will clock faster) and probably be more energy efficient and therefore cooler running at similar clock speeds. Given that you are using limited radiator space that could buy you some extra performance.

 

So, for now: check on your cooling.

And wait a few weeks for the AMD presentations at Computex. Probably in 4-6 weeks you could have attractive CPU / MB upgrade options.

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Milou,

Thanks for your reply. I think The kit is called a 360 because it has 3 each 360mm fans for the top mounted radiator. The radiator is quite large covering the entire top of the full size case. It measures - 17” inches long and 7” inches wide. As to cooling, both cpu and gpu run very cool. CPU max temps are around 55-57c under full load while the gpu is in the low 50s.

I7-6700k @ 4.5ghz

Gigabyte gaming 3 motherboard

32gb 3000hz ddr4

EVGA 2080ti black w/ hydrocopper water cooling

360mm custom water cooled loop for CPU and Vid card

500mb nvme ssd

256mb sata ssd

2gb hdd

Samsung Odyessy +

TM warthog stick & throttle

MS ff2 stick

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A 360 kit is made of 3x 120mm x 120mm of fin area. Typically the kits will have 3x 120mm fans. For example I know EK does a kit like this with Varder fans which are decent performers.

 

However the rule of thumb for water-cooling is this:

 

Minimum number of 120mm fan space / radiator required = 1 + (number of components being cooled). In your case minimum requirement = 1 + (1+1) 120mm fan / radiator space = 360mm. So you are at the minimum. And this is without overclocking. Add 1 per OCed component. But most people doing water-cooling kits will want to exceed this minimum.

 

Things you can do to improve your watercooling rig:

 

1) Make sure you have a lot of ambient air coming from outside the case. Preferably set up so that convection helps you. ie. Cool air in the bottom of the case and/or from the front intakes. Radiator / fans pushing warm air up out the top of the case. Make sure you have intake fans (don't leave it to passively draw air in) and set intake fans high enough to make sure you have positive net pressure inside the case. Listen to some JayztwoCents videos for tutorials on this kind of thing.

 

2) Consider upgrading your fans from Vardars to Noctua NF-A12x25.

 

3) Consider setting up push / pull (ie fan on both sides of your radiator).

 

4) Fit a 2nd radiator if you can find space in your rig. Otherwise at some stage you could consider getting a larger case with more room for radiators.

 

FYI: I had been using a small mATX case for a 1 CPU + 2 GPU system in a custom loop (using 240 + 360 radiators). It was sufficient, but did not have much headroom for any more. Now I switched to a much bigger EATX case which has so much room for radiators that the limitation on my system is CPU and GPU chip quality, not cooling. So yeah - I moved the bottleneck.

 

By the way... there was a recent test which demonstrated that the cooler RTX 2080 Ti cards run, the more stable they are at overclock settings. If you are running them stock it does not matter, but if you overclock you only get the best speeds by keeping the chip cool. Similar deal if you are trying OCs with CPUs. My 4.8 GHz is quite a high OC with Skylake-X, but only possible because of my overkill cooling setup.

 

Link to RTX test which shows clock vs temps.


Edited by Milou

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Milou,

Thanks for clarifying how these coolers are sized and what is needed. I just reran the stress tests and I get 54c on the cpu and 45c on the gpu using HWmonitor. 100% cpu utilization on all cores. I like your idea regarding fans- currenty I have a phanteks eetho pro case with one big front fan (240mm?) pulling air in and a smaller one on the back exhausting air. Sounds like it might be better to switch the direction of the rear one to pull air in instead of exhaust?

 

Also are these temps high enough to cause slowdown? The CPU temp seems to vary whether under load (25 for low and 54 after stress testing while the gpu seems to barely get warm even under load or not.

I7-6700k @ 4.5ghz

Gigabyte gaming 3 motherboard

32gb 3000hz ddr4

EVGA 2080ti black w/ hydrocopper water cooling

360mm custom water cooled loop for CPU and Vid card

500mb nvme ssd

256mb sata ssd

2gb hdd

Samsung Odyessy +

TM warthog stick & throttle

MS ff2 stick

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Share on other sites

No problem: On the fans, I would try reversing the back fan so you got 2 intakes and the exit is top of the case through the radiator.

 

Having said that if those are peak temperatures under a stress test, then you have nothing to worry about... those temps are fine.

 

You are outputting to that VR headset? Not a monitor? (I use a monitor, not VR so I don't have direct experience of the performance overhead of that). I've heard that running DCS outside of Steam has lower VR overhead. There is a video discussion here of some tricks to get DCS running faster on one of those 5K VR headsets... not sure if there are any ideas there that can help you.

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I would wait till November for sales regardless. If the new Ryzen and benchmarks aren't out by then, you'll get a better price on an Intel CPU.

 

And your GPU is definitely bottlenecked. I threw a Titan Xp and a 1070 into my 9900k system out of curiosity. They both ran faster than in my 7700k system. The DCS engine likes fast CPUs. I think it's also safe to also assume after a Vulkan build is released faster CPUs will perform better given an equal amount of cores.

 

 

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