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Old 09-11-2017, 07:40 PM   #21
capthaltli
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Thanks for this review and heads up on the product, couple questions:

In your video, when making those 90 deg banks, the chair only moves 10 or 15 degrees, is that very noticeable, or is your mind tricked with VR?

When you accelerate or decelerate on the runway, does the chair pitch forward (simulate decel) and pitch back (simulate accel and g force in crease) while the image in VR stays flat? this is how real full motion simulator fake acel and decel

You went with 2 DOF, do you reget not getting 3 DOF? Do you think it would add more or not?

Does motion sickness come from latency or just from moving?

When doing dog fight maneuvers (fast rolls and sharp moves) does the chair keep up, or does it feel off? Is it better for more benign maneuvers versus acrobatic/dog fight?

Thanks!
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Old 09-11-2017, 08:43 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by capthaltli View Post
Thanks for this review and heads up on the product, couple questions:

In your video, when making those 90 deg banks, the chair only moves 10 or 15 degrees, is that very noticeable, or is your mind tricked with VR?

When you accelerate or decelerate on the runway, does the chair pitch forward (simulate decel) and pitch back (simulate accel and g force in crease) while the image in VR stays flat? this is how real full motion simulator fake acel and decel

You went with 2 DOF, do you reget not getting 3 DOF? Do you think it would add more or not?

Does motion sickness come from latency or just from moving?

When doing dog fight maneuvers (fast rolls and sharp moves) does the chair keep up, or does it feel off? Is it better for more benign maneuvers versus acrobatic/dog fight?

Thanks!
Hi capthaltli yer the chair only moves a small amount but the feeling feels much greater in VR, it certainly feels like your banking harder than the chairs movement.

Regarding the acc / decelerate, this is the surge part of the axis> when you accelerate or decelerate the chair pitches on and down slightly - giving the feeling of motion

The only difference between the 2dof and 3dof is a (loss of traction motor) this pivots the back of the chair left of right. the only thing i feel this could add is the rudder effect or if your in a chopper, the helio swing motion (rudder)

Do i regret not getting it. Not yet but i will I'm sure, however you can add the 3rd motor with an addon pack. I believe its $499. i may get this in the future but im happy with the 2dof for now

The motion sickness was purely down to the chair movement, or the brain believing your motion is great than it is

In regard to the chair keeping pace, this is a tricky one, the tuning and smoothing of the sim motions is a rather tricky for me. im 90% there, nut having to learn the program aswell.

If i fly the mirage with its high turn rate over say the L39, you do notice a slight motion lag. BUT only if your out of Vr,

Once your in VR even the slightest lag isn't noticeable.

However tuning Simtools is a totally new arena for me and I am always tweaking to get the setup better and better, others have simply told me it takes time to setup. its not an out the box setup. much like chasing fps i guess

IF a database of settings existed for DCS, life would simply be easier for tuning, however we dont have one yet, but im willing to share my findings with anyone
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Old 09-11-2017, 08:46 PM   #23
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also i forgot to mention you can increase the bank angle of the chair, still awaiting new on the max degrees possible. once i learn the program for this i will be doing it
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Old 09-11-2017, 09:27 PM   #24
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Quick video showing the full motion range
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Old 09-12-2017, 05:52 PM   #25
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Thanks for the update and info.

Also, thanks for being a trail blazer using this technology and tweaking the system settings. I may be next.

Trying to understand the surge part. When you are on the runway and go from zero to Afterburners lit, the seat will surge up (vertical up movement) to simulate accel. Similar for decel but with serge down?

Keep us posted on the max bank news (is it for both axes, or just roll?). Maybe a video from take off, dog fight, and landing would be good to show extent of ops and how it performs. Of course I know it will not speak to how it feels in VR and agree once in VR with slight motion the brain is going to do the rest of the work.
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:12 AM   #26
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Thanks for the update and info.

Also, thanks for being a trail blazer using this technology and tweaking the system settings. I may be next.

Trying to understand the surge part. When you are on the runway and go from zero to Afterburners lit, the seat will surge up (vertical up movement) to simulate accel. Similar for decel but with serge down?

Keep us posted on the max bank news (is it for both axes, or just roll?). Maybe a video from take off, dog fight, and landing would be good to show extent of ops and how it performs. Of course I know it will not speak to how it feels in VR and agree once in VR with slight motion the brain is going to do the rest of the work.

No worries yes the surge you explained above is correct. i will do a video of this part to show how it woks.

The max bank part is for the roll and pitch, within simtools i can move the platform to its max degree, however within dcs its only uses 80% of the motion. this is the part im tweaking at the moment. hopefully i will get this sorted today


I promise i will create a full flight video. but without me in the seat. that way your be able to see the chair movements easier.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:23 PM   #27
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Seriously considering the purchase of this motion simulator and have questions that I can't get clarified from the supplier(s) and your help will be most appreciated.
1. I was told the 2 and 3 DOF units can get very close to a full 20degrees of movement in all directions? Is this the maximum movement you have with your unit?
2. I contacted SIMTOOL as to their support for both DCS 1.5 and DCS 2.0 Open Alpha and also IL2 Sturmovik-BOS, BOM and BOK.
a. It appears their Plugin does work for DCS 1.5 but unclear if it will also work for DCS 2.0 Open Alpha, especially Normandy. Did your SIMTOOL Plugin support both DCS 1.5 and DCS 2.0 Open Alpha?
b. IL2 Sturmovik-BOS,BOM and BOK are also my favored flightsims, next to DCS.
SIMTOOL shows a Plugin for the IL2 Cliffs of Dover but they were non-committal on their
Plugin application for IL2 Sturmovik-BOS,BOM and BOK. Have you been able to setup
these IL2 applications for use with your simulator?
There appears to be an adequate Plugin for WAR THUNDER, which I seldom play.
3. I am not the most computer savy individual and how complex/difficult did you find in making the Plugin applications work correctly?
Would really appreciate your experiences and opinions with these questions as your answer will be the deciding factor for my purchase of the simulator.
Please respond,
Thanks, Jim
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:55 PM   #28
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Thanks, Jim

Hi Jim I will try and help you out. I will answer as best i can below your questions


1. I was told the 2 and 3 DOF units can get very close to a full 20degrees of movement in all directions? Is this the maximum movement you have with your unit?

A- I haven't measured the exact but it appears I have hit the limit in my latest video, not sure if this helps but i will measure it for you tomorrow

2. I contacted SIMTOOL as to their support for both DCS 1.5 and DCS 2.0 Open Alpha and also IL2 Sturmovik-BOS, BOM and BOK.
a. It appears their Plugin does work for DCS 1.5 but unclear if it will also work for DCS 2.0 Open Alpha, especially Normandy. Did your SIMTOOL Plugin support both DCS 1.5 and DCS 2.0 Open Alpha?


A- Yes sir all I did after getting this to work for 1.5 was copy the export file to nttr, this means you can use it within both version's of dcs, with one profile... I too struggled and found the simtools community very unhelpful, but I will simply give you my export files for both, as a extra bit of coding I came across helps make the motion a lot smoother when doing 360 rolls and loops.


b. IL2 Sturmovik-BOS,BOM and BOK are also my favored flightsims, next to DCS.
SIMTOOL shows a Plugin for the IL2 Cliffs of Dover but they were non-committal on their
Plugin application for IL2 Sturmovik-BOS,BOM and BOK. Have you been able to setup

A- I don't use this game I only use dcs BUT if their is a plugin for it. It will work, you can also make tour own plugins aswell; however I havens tried this yet


3. I am not the most computer savy individual and how complex/difficult did you find in making the Plugin applications work correctly?

A- Getting the plug in working was really easy, but getting the axis set up was harder BUT i will help you, I'm happy to use teamviewer and either teach you or do it for you ( I'm no master but I have learnt a lot so far and always willing to help)

I will post the link to the instructions for you, this will ease any concerns with the build and setup of simtools you may have. Just remeber help is always here

Also tomorrow I will upload the full video with
Takeoff
Dog fighting
Landing

It's without me in the chair so you can see the movement with no obstructions.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:59 PM   #29
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http://dofreality.com/Instructions.pdf


This is The link for the instructions. There is another set of instructions with better pictures, I will find that link aswell
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Old 09-15-2017, 12:20 PM   #30
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I am also tempted,

Do you have any idea how the implementation with x-plane is? This is my second most used flight simulator after DCS. Usability with x-plane is important for me.

Also, how do you use your mouse? Is there a place available to place it?

Last edited by witwas; 09-15-2017 at 12:26 PM.
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