MIG29 NAV (and F15)

With the removal of the Map from the MIG29 display Nav is problematic as you dont have any real way of knowing What Waypoint in ENR or Airfield in RTN/LNDG modes your system is referencing. In the real aircraft WYPT number or Airfield number is displayed to the pilot. Adding Text to the HUD might be a suitable less invasive way of doing it. I propose a single digit WYPT no in ENR mode and the ICAO airfield ID in RTN and LNDG modes

Until such time as actual aircraft methods are modelled, how about a fix to supply the pilot with this Basic but essential data ? its very easy to loose track of what you are refrencing if you use the WYPT increment/decrement commands or the aeroplane auto increments as you pass a WYPT. This could be applied to the SU27/33 and F15 as well.

To those that say its unrealistic ... well no aeroplane on the planet presents Navdata without the pilot being able to determine what has been selected or referenced. secondly there are numerous concessions to accuracy in a lot of aeroplanes in DCS/FC3

+1 :thumbup:

I propose no ICAO airfield codes, simply numbered ... the reason here being that I don't believe an entire ICAO list would represent that time's systems. That means you'll need a numbered list but that's ok.

What is RL case then for A/S models?

Found this:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=39372

I suspect they use radio nav - looking through my docs, I'll see if I can find something relevant.

With this. Similar to the Mig-21. RSBN-ADF, Course selector

What about EKRAN codes?

https://studfiles.net/preview/2137820/

The EKRAN is a built in test showing malfunctions and errors.

What do you want to know?

I propose no ICAO airfield codes, simply numbered ... the reason here being that I don't believe an entire ICAO list would represent that time's systems. That means you'll need a numbered list but that's ok.

Numbering would be fine for RTN/LNDG as long as the list is published... similar to the way numbers are used for airfields in the SU25T

Best though involved would be to realistically enable the entire Nav control panel and systems. My proposal is an interim to get something usable going in a reasonable and not code intensive (I think) time scale.

Su-25 has lights working in the Nav Panel, a barely minimum but a good start for the 29.

So if we go for Airfield ID numbers we already have the Caucaus list from the SU25T from the supplements section of the manual:

Does a Similar list exist for Nevada ? by experimentation:

17 RTN Airfields in Nevada

Creech is ID1

Groom Lake is ID2

McCarran is ID3

Nellis is ID4

Beatty is ID5

Boulder is ID6

Echo Bay is ID7

Henderson is ID8

Jean Airport is ID9

Laughalan is ID10

Lincoln County is ID11

Mesquite is ID12

Mina is ID13

North Las Vegas is ID14

Pahute Mesa is ID15

Tonopah is ID16

Tonopah Test field is ID17

Obviously a list for the new Gulf map would be required.

With this. Similar to the Mig-21. RSBN-ADF, Course selector

 

Looks like there are 3 waypoint buttons at the top of that panel, for 3 possible waypoints (or pre-programmed airfields) total, like in the Su-25A? I suppose they would get illuminated when selected, just like in the Su-25A, or simply appear depressed? If that's the case, I can't think of a simpler and at the same time more realistic and cooler way of doing it.

So if we just went with Wypt no in ENR and Airfield ID no in RTN and LNDG in the MIG29/SU27/SU33 it would just require copying the same code used in the SU25T

It would look something like this:

Looks like there are 3 waypoint buttons at the top of that panel, for 3 possible waypoints (or pre-programmed airfields) total, like in the Su-25A?

Correct.

I suppose they would get illuminated when selected, just like in the Su-25A, or simply appear depressed?

They are illuminated - the text caption(in this case numbers) are illuminated in red(see attachment).

If that's the case, I can't think of a simpler and at the same time more realistic and cooler way of doing it.

I agree :)

Thanks for the clarification!

It seems all the methods proposed in this thread already exist in other FC3 planes, so it would probably require minimum effort to be implemented, but the benefit would be huge. Actually, this is not truly a benefit, but more of a fix. Cmon ED, you know you want do do this!

Looks like there are 3 waypoint buttons at the top of that panel, for 3 possible waypoints (or pre-programmed airfields) total, like in the Su-25A? I suppose they would get illuminated when selected, just like in the Su-25A, or simply appear depressed? If that's the case, I can't think of a simpler and at the same time more realistic and cooler way of doing it.

You can actually program 6 WP with the 3 buttons and the 2-position switch to the left according to the RW manual. EDIT: Actually, that switch position (ППМ/АЗР) allows you to select 3 navigation points (in the "up" position) and 3 airfields (in the "down" position).

We dont need any extra symbols on the HUD.

Everything needed for navigation is on the ADI, the HSI and the Navigation Panel, and the HUD. The only thing missing is the Nav Panel.

The HUD shows distance to the WP-BASE selected in the Nav Panel, and a guide ring to follow.

The HSI shows DISTANCE-HEADING to that WP-BASE and the guiding needles ( desired heading, desired track )

The ADI shows guide indications also to follow both in pitch and in roll to center the WP or the BASE selected.

What we need if possible to code are operative lights on the Nav Panel like the Su-25 to know what WP is selected, or Base selected, and the mode in what we are, ROUTE-RTN-LANDING. In an ideal DCS enviroment we should be able to use the Nav Panel using the keyboard ( even withour clickable cockpit ) to select and highlight the WP-BASE desired, the RSBN channel, the Navigation ADF channel and the main Nav modes.

But i think this is to much for a FC3 level sim.

With operating lights like the Su-25 should be a good addition.