First Module Reccommendations (I've researched, but advice welcome)

Another vote for the F/A-18. This will be ED's primary module for some time to come.

Sounds like Harrier might be your cup of English tea (to be read with a British accent). It is a fast ground attack aircraft that can hold its own in a2a battle. And it is only going to get better.

 

VTOL and ability to refuel / rearm with engine running means minimal downtime between flights.

 

Startup procedure is short so it literally takes 30 seconds to go from cold/empty aircraft to flying with CAP / light CAS load.

 

And it can take a pounding just like A-10. Can't fly with a wing missing though, but nobody is perfect.

 

On a downside, wings tend to snap off during high-G maneuvers and VTOL has a bit of a learning curve. Some bugs are present (early release) but nothing game breaking.

 

But other than that - think of it as cross between A-10/F-18/UH-1H.

If you try the F18 this weekend and it isn’t for you, I’d second this recommendation for the Harrier.

I think based on what you want, you are going to end up in the Hornet, whether that happens right away or down the road. The Harrier has a very similar HOTAS and MFD logic as the Hornet, so transitioning from one to the other is very easy.

There are some bugs and incomplete items in the Harrier, but the Hornet is more A-G limited right now. The Harrier is a lot of fun, especially low level night attacks using the HUD FLIR (when it works properly lol)

I would say go Hornet. It will give you the most options for A-G and A-A down the line. ED is the most solid thrustworthy dev around. Since they also make the DCS world engine, you will have unprecedented support.

Viggen is also ofc. a great choice for FAST, low level, pre-planned strikes with coldwar technology. But very specialized in it's role. Solid module, but not for everyone.

Choose an aircraft you are interested in and learn to fly it well. It is way more fun and important than getting some quick highscores online.

INS bombing is enabled since release.

Not the best example as the INS in the Mirage has been broken for a long time making INS bombing just a gimmick:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=207327

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=179802

An opinion is an opinion but this statement makes it look like the Hornet is not bugged and unfinished but it is the opposite:

As I said, the problem with the Harrier is that the bugs are all over the place, making it hard to perform even basic functions. Almost a year since release and it still can't drop bombs in trail, CCRP is broken making it unnecessarily difficult to drop bombs from level flight (both guided and unguided). TGP also has plenty of bugs lingering for months, like https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=215959

Maybe veteran customers are used to it, but there are better choices for a newcomer. Hornet at least has a solid base and the bugs are removed on a (bi)weekly basis.

If the complexity of F/A-18C is the only thing preventing you from getting it, I would not worry. It is still pretty simple because many features are not implemented yet. You will learn as they are added. It is also very easy to fly and you don't have to do Case I carrier landings at all if you don't want to :).

+1...yes the Hornet is the best modeled jet I've seen in any sim, and given its state of development the learning curve is not extreme. There are many wings out there with training programs as well.

As I said, the problem with the Harrier is that the bugs are all over the place, making it hard to perform even basic functions. Almost a year since release and it still can't drop bombs in trail, CCRP is broken making it unnecessarily difficult to drop bombs from level flight (both guided and unguided). TGP also has plenty of bugs lingering for months, like

I am not sure how things were a year ago when it comes to Harrier, but over the last 2 months (2-3hrs of play per day) I've had no issues executing bombing runs CCRP or CCIP in multiplayer. I have not had issues with laser guidance/designation or pop-up mav attacks. I have not encountered any TGP issues.

However, I could not get tv-mavs to work and sidearms are glitchy at times. But these were the only two issues I've encountered in the last 2 months and they were hardly game-breaking, more of a nuisance.

So saying "bugs are all over the place, making it hard to perform even basic functions" is a bit of a stretch, at least from my personal experience with the module. Or maybe I am just a rare exception and others' mileage may vary.

As I said, the problem with the Harrier is that the bugs are all over the place, making it hard to perform even basic functions. Almost a year since release and it still can't drop bombs in trail, CCRP is broken making it unnecessarily difficult to drop bombs from level flight (both guided and unguided). TGP also has plenty of bugs lingering for months, like https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=215959

 

Maybe veteran customers are used to it, but there are better choices for a newcomer. Hornet at least has a solid base and the bugs are removed on a (bi)weekly basis.

As i said, i won't start a flame war. If you aren't happy with the bugs of the harrier, than it's fine, since the OP needs the information and it's mostly true.

But there is some exaggeration in both statements: the harrier is far from unplayable and many things are OK, as it is with the hornet which is far from being perfect and free of bugs.

And i think that ED modules are superior in quality than the modules from Razbam so i can confirm this statement.

But as you see in the F/A-18C section of this forum you may notice that many people are as unhappy with the hornet as it seems you are with the harrier.

It is a fact that it is not complete and has bugs and that it takes month until more features get added and bugs are fixed. Yes there are updates every two weeks and more than are coming from Razbam (if you want to hear it) but it's not always a big step up and after two updates a month is gone. I can recommend the hornet and it will be some day a great and capable module, but it is in early access and given the huge amount of negative comments of not implemented features and complains about A2A radar, i just want to point that out. To prevent more disappointment. I just can't recommend it as first high fidelity module to a newcomer to DCS now.

I'm sure it will be the best module available in the most aspects, if it is complete some day.

Getting to fly the F-18 for free is quite nice, and gives me a good idea what to expect from the study sims.

(I used my lunch break to go through the cold start training and then fly around for a bit. Failed my landing because I was out of time but wanted to land before turning it off and rushed it. Came in too slow and low and wound up hitting the water right in front of the runway at around 120 knots).

Was amazing to fly. I bought the Oculus and a GTX 1080 for this exact purpose, and while it isn't perfect (some limitations with current hardware in VR) it was still breath taking to go through all the procedures of a "real" cockpit to take off, and the thrill of flight was wonderful.

(Did a little 500+ knot run through the mountains, a nice rush! Also was happy to nail flying under a bridge on my first try (I fully expected to hit the deck or the bridge, but didn't!).

Also, the F18 is much more responsive with flaps on "Auto" rather than "Half" as I learned after about 10 minutes of flying wondering why it didn't perform as anticipated...lol

still pondering what to get. Seems like the F18 will be a module of choice at some point, but still pondering the Viggen. I've watched hours of ground strike footage from it and it is certainly appealing.

As for multiplayer scores...no so interested there. I'd probably be making scenarios for my dad and I to fly, so we'd be working together.

still pondering what to get. Seems like the F18 will be a module of choice at some point, but still pondering the Viggen. I've watched hours of ground strike footage from it and it is certainly appealing.

 

 

 

As for multiplayer scores...no so interested there. I'd probably be making scenarios for my dad and I to fly, so we'd be working together.

A lot of the workload of the Viggens unique computer is bypassed if you don't have to set up flight plans manually (like you have to if you want to fly multiplayer). But you can learn this feature if you have mastered the rest of this planes systems.

There is still some work to do in the mission editor for your flight plans and attacks.

Though you can start with easy things like ccip bombing runs (but like in the M-2000C the mode of weapon deployment is bound to specific weapons, so ccip is only available with high drag bombs) which is mostly straight forward. You have some things to consider, which you don't have in the F/A-18C like to dial in the target qfe for the bombing run, but this is a lot of less hassle in SP as it is in multiplayer.

And the training missions don't cover much of the viggens potential. I don't know if the campaign is better, but after i played the first mission i think so (you have to do some reconnaissance in this mission, that's not covered in the training, so it is a great addition).

But on the pro side the viggen has, in my opinion, a perfect learning curve for a beginner. You can start very easy with ccip bombing and maverick skeet shooting. But after that you can improve by preprogramming pop-up points, ELINT, easy straight forward ship strikes and step up by preprogramming the anti ship missile with turning and target waypoints and do similar things with the mighty mjollnir. There is a heathblur-kneeboard-road-farp system build in, so you can start, land and rearm/refuel at roads like the real viggen.

Another point on the pro side is the 3rd party add on campaign available for the nevada map. But unfortunately you can't play it in coop and it needs an additional map.

But most important: you can roll backwards!

If the time until the Hornet would hit completion would be one year, the Viggen could perfect get you through this time of waiting and than you can get a nearly perfect hornet then.

In fact i can recommend every plane in DCS except the hawk, i would not recommend early access planes to newcomers as i said beacause of the already mentioned reasons.

The comments show that some modules fits more your preferences of low and fast with some A2A and the most fits are Viggen (hell of a "low and fast" but no A2A radar) and the F/A-18C (currently in early access, but on the other hand, as a true multirole aircraft you can sooner or later do everything with it, except sling loads) and the harrier (but it seems like you aren't interested so i leave this out).

If you can't decide, just toss a coin or drink a beer with your dad and buy both modules for each of you while you are drunk.

I'd recommend the Hornet - just try it out this weekend and get that bundle.

As a beginner, you have to learn quite some things and while you're doing that, the Hornet development progresses, but you'll have some pretty solid elements on that road. It's not perfect at the moment and she's got some issues, but that goes for any module.

Otherwise, the AV-8B sure is lots of fun and even if it can't go supersonic in level flight (or hardly, for that matter - it does crack the M 1 mark at ~30kft, but not by much), it is pretty fast, has a great acceleration and climb rate rendering it pretty agile in the Danger Zone.

I'd also recommend the Viggen, but it's quite special in the way it's delivering it's payload, there are more different possibilities in the other modules.

As there's the bundle deal, I'd really go for the Hornet at the moment, hooves down. That PG theatre map is absolutely gorgeus as well and you'll be saving 40 bucks as opposed to getting both modules without a special offer. And there's at least one of the FC3 planes on top in case you don't have that package yet.

If your not willing to read the manuals you will not be happy with dcs. If your ne to dcs it might be wife to learn dcs with a simple mod/aircraft. The yac is a beginning ac for pilots in the user. Next level up is the f5 then you can get in to the big fighters. You might wish to follow dThat path or go with the fc3 module with simpler design aircraft mods since they are not full clickable cockpits. But if you wish to save money then get the hornet and read the manuals watch all of wags videos since he shows you step by step how to fly the hornet and use the various systems. Try it out this weekend since the hornet and pg map are free this weekend to use and tryout. Download them go to YouTube find wags videos and start at cold and dark and take notes so you can review them in dcs.

Still around.

I did fly the F18, and had an enjoyable time in it for the one hour I got to play with it.

Now torn between F-18, Viggen and AV-8B. All have various pros and cons. Viggen is looking most likely. (Lowest cost entry point is a plus, still lots to do with it, and the speed...buahaha) with AV-8B and F-18's main detractors being that they are still WiP (and a big pro being they are in english and can do carrier operation and A2A refueling, just more to do as time progresses). That said, I'm not overly keen on spending $80 for something that is very much in progress.

Think Viggen for the next year or so is a good call.

Again, thank you for all the feedback, I honestly was not expecting so much interaction and it's appreciated!

Yeah I have the same profile as you. Coming from Strike Commander ... did a lot of Janes ... a LOT of Falcon 4 (was in a Virtual Squadron) ..FSX .. LOCK-ON and now DCS 2.5.

Like you, I mostly love ground attack and light dog-fighting.

I initially bought the L-39 first since it is quite forgiving, not expensive and a very good learner to jump back in the boat. But my past experience with past flightsim made me outgrow it rather quickly. I love the little aircraft and had a blast with it, but it's now time to upgrade.

I did a LOT of research and it seem that the Viggen is the next one to go.

- Viggen was done by a very respectable 3rd party company.

- Was built FIRST as a ground striker but can defend itself quite good.

- Damn it is FAST AS HELL.

- The technology in it is not overwhelming

Not sure if you saw that review from Ralfidude, but it is priceless :)

Viggen is for sure my next one.

Still around.

I did fly the F18, and had an enjoyable time in it for the one hour I got to play with it.

 

 

Now torn between F-18, Viggen and AV-8B. All have various pros and cons. Viggen is looking most likely. (Lowest cost entry point is a plus, still lots to do with it, and the speed...buahaha) with AV-8B and F-18's main detractors being that they are still WiP (and a big pro being they are in english and can do carrier operation and A2A refueling, just more to do as time progresses). That said, I'm not overly keen on spending $80 for something that is very much in progress.

Viggen is also still WIP, don't expect it to be fully fleshed out. Though there's no doubt it's the closest to completion from the three.

I think both the good thing and the bad thing with the Viggen is that it is so unique. The cockpit is in a language that few people here understand, the systems are unusual and operate differently than in other aircraft, it's mission profile is also unique in DCS. That means your previous experience in other aircraft won't be as useful, and the experience you gain in the Viggen won't translate easily to airplanes like Hornet or Harrier. On the other hand, that's what makes it an interesting choice. :)

spend some time doing high speed low level flights, with future proofing options for ground strikes, some light air combat (maybe dogfights? more interested in ground target strikes though).

 

A-10C or Black Shark.

Both are good introductions to real aircraft and controls as the systems such as fuel, communications, weapons, etc. are all highly detailed and have very good instructions available on how to use them.

These will also let you do what you want ( GROUND POUNDING! :thumbup:, My Favorite! ). The A-10 and Shark are also capable of defending themselves, especially the A-10, which can carry AIM-9M's, against air attacks. If you want a little more speed, and an intermediate between the fighter jets and helicopters, go with the A-10.

One thing I saw in my brief tryout of the F-18 was the difference between it and the A-10 in the ground attack role. The A-10 shows itself to be a MUCH more effective ground pounder, even without radar capability. It's ability to just hover for extreme amounts of time over the battlefield is it's greatest capability. That, and the immense amount of weapons that it can carry in one load, compared to a general fighter. I was amazed at how fast the F-18 ran out of fuel on a mission. It's obviously made for quick darting in and out of the battlefield, while the A-10 can just hover above like a giant spider, waiting patiently for it's prey to enter the killbox.

The cockpit is in a language that few people here understand,

Please tell me that an English cockpit is available!!!!

Officially no, but there's a mod.

If you're looking for A2A aircraft (already have a gazelle) it looks like F-18 and the 2000 are the only study level options. F-18 sounds like it will get used a lot in the long run (also F-14 will probably have some 6 months later release so near term the F-18 should be more stable).

Survey level aircraft is more interesting for me (at the moment) but you'll basically get all of those with the MAC release - still a few months off.

F-18 could then be the reasonable buy (if you think a bit more in long term) unless you want to invest in a single survey level craft just before MAC?

(Actually more interested in the PG map in the bundle - expect to get much usage of it for the Gaz and Ka-50.)

So, settled on the F-18. (After a month of flying the community MB-339A).

One week in, 100% VR flight.

-Full checks Cold-Start of the aircraft is now second nature.

-Air-to-Ground CCIP bombing and Rockets are getting more accurate. (Although still learning)

-Waypoint Navigation is being learned.

-Successfully landed every time, save for a quick mission where I had total electronics failure after taking some AA. Tried a belly landing in a field (couldn't make it to runway, and gear wouldn't extend) blew that plane up, but pilot ejected safely). Landings are getting smoother too.

Starting to notice how much of the plane is incomplete at this phase, but I still have plenty to learn in the interim. I haven't done any carrier operations, haven't touched Comms. No Air-to-Air experience... so much to learn.

Nice to hear that things are moving forward. Don't hesitate to consider a different module if you at some point feel stuck with the F-18.

Took the bundle myself and love the PG - the Hornet can be a great experience too, but I don't think it's the best that DCS has to offer at this point. Perhaps when it is closer to being complete - but many others have MUCH more personality.