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Async Loadouts - Rolling Effect


FoxxyTrotty

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When you have load imbalance (usually after dropping a bomb from 1 wing) the F18 will begin rolling towards the heavier wing - all good and as expected.

 

But when you fly inverted (ie during low level CAS operations / overbanking / terrrain hugging etc) the roll continues to pull the aircraft in the same direction, even though the heavier wing is now on the other side of the aircraft (with respect to the direction of flight).

 

here is an image to better explain the issue within DCS... Hopefully it is somewhat obvious that in inverted (but level) flight that the roll direction on the right image is the wrong way. The heavier wing, with respect to the direction of flight, should always favour towards the ground (unless pulling/pushing G force would cause otherwise)

 

I get the programming likely has something along the lines of "if left wing is heavier than right wing, then add left roll " but what is missing from this (oversimplified) line of code is "but if aircraft is upside down, then the heavier wing is other way around - thus add roll force right"

 

I understand if you were inverted (as in the image on the right) but were to pull any G force at all (over 0G) then it would be correct as the heavier mass, is now causing a force on the plane (even though it is upside down, much like being pushed into your chair during a loop, despite being upside down).

 

I hope this makes sense to someone who can perhaps better explain it.

 

f18_async_loadout_dcs_incorrect_roll_zpsjksdhazr.jpg

. . . . . . .

Every module/ map except the dual winged joke.

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Unfortunately, I can't confirm your observations. With payloads only on right wing I have roll to right in level flight and roll to left when inverted and pushing -1G.

Could you record a track with your problem so we can watch it and understand what the problem is?

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I was really surprised about this post, and have a try.

 

Edit : sorry, just tested with the AIM-9X only payload, and the aircraft is banking on the correct side when inverted. That required some more test with different weapons.

 

Edit 2 : Tested with the following config :

 

STA1 AIM-9M

STA2 AIM-120B

STA3 AIM-7M

STA4 AIM-120C

STA5 FPU-8A Fuel Tank 330 Gallons

STA6 AIM-120C

STA7 AIM-7M

STA8 AIM-120B

STA9 AIM-9M

 

After firing an AIM-9M, the aircraft behaviour is still correct, banking in the correct side.


Edited by vctpil

IAMD Ryzen 9 5900X 12x 3.7 to 4.8Ghz - 32Go DDR4 3600Mhz - GeForce RTX 3080 - Samsung Odyssey G7 QLED - AIMXY

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When upside down if you are still pulling positive g then the asymmetric force is still the same direction. It's not gravity that matters it's the felt g on the airframe.

 

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I agree with you WindyTX - I did try to make that point as clear as I could (although probably not very well).

 

I am refering to level flight (but inverted)...

 

edit - the issue I was describing has been resolved in the last few patches, I am unable to reproduce, it is now behaving in the correct manner - so flying inverted the heavier wing still dips, and if you pull positive G (while inverted) the heavier wing now "pulls towards the sky" as it should. Thanks for the fix and also for clearing up the difference between inverted flight and positive/negative G effects on the loadouts/mass.


Edited by FoxxyTrotty
issue resolved

. . . . . . .

Every module/ map except the dual winged joke.

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If I had to venture a guess, I'd say that weight is not the only factor here. Lift, and specifically the difference in lift between the wings, and also drag.

 

Drag is greater on the right wing in your example, so the aircraft tends to yaw in the direction of the "heavy" wing. This has the effect of decreasing lift on the heavy wing and increasing lift on the light wing, thus inducing roll. The asymmetric drag situation works the same way when you're inverted, with the induced yaw from the drag resulting in increased lift on the "light" wing.

 

The same thing happens in the Cessnas and Pipers I've flown. When you step on the rudder (induce yaw), you have to apply aileron in the opposite direction to keep from rolling in the direction of the "rear-most" wing.

 

DISCLAIMER: I could be wrong. I could always be wrong.

Very Respectfully,

Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch

London

"In my private manual I firmly believed the only time there was too much fuel aboard any aircraft was if it was fire." --Ernest K. Gann

 

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