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3rd unanounced helicopter speculation


QuiGon

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I've always wanted a Kiowa in the game, I believe it would bring in more co-operation between fixed-wing and rotary, there are quite a few strikers in plan or near release so I believe it's due to have some sort of rotary FAC(A) aircraft. I can't think of a better aircraft than the Kiowa for that. And the Kiowa has recently redirect, sadly but I believe that would make it easier to find system information, correct me if I'm wrong. I personally would buy the Kiowa right off the bat!


Edited by ORANGELIMEKILLA

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F/A-18C, F-16(Block40+), Su-30, Su-24, F-15E, Tornado IDS

Oh-58D, Ah-1(W/Z)

Missile Flight Model Upgrade

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Hmm, am not making fun of any of you guys, but it is entertaining to red what opinions people have, why something can be or can not be. I am overwhelmed sometimes too.

 

Nobody ever mentioned that the Kiowa can be operated fully with a single pilot in real life, which could be important for a game too, as I figured that multicrew does not always work, but we are on it to solve with strong support from Eagle Dynamics the multicrew code issues that rose.

 

Any Helicopter you or we could come up with have thier ups and downs.

Some are more likely some are less, but I personally have the additude that nothing is impossible, it is just a way how to approch things that limits yourself.

 

Once someone told me I can not fly to moon, so I started to prepare to fly to mars.

 

I hope you get what I mean by that and I see it coming, this statement could end up in another speculation.

Let us have an agreement ok. We will share some intel if the community is not pressing on us for a release ?

 

I know it will not work that way cause peope always are like children. I am myself similar like that. If i could have the F18c today I would have it for sure, same are other people ut there, so I will talk with Patrick about it and maybe we share something at christmas, but no promise, cause it also depends on his vote as my bussinesspartner.

 

Ok, I have to write a summary of the intel I received today of the real french Gazelle compared to what there is now in the sim and the questions I asked.

 

Have a nice weekend as always.

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Its a shame that you guys have to deal with that, I think everyone would love to hear what you guys have planned for us but sadly a huge section of the community bombards with questions for release. I hope you guys make the right decision, whatever it is I will support you guys!

i7-4790 @3.6GHz, 16GB DDR3 Ram, GTX 745, Saitek X55 Rhino, Track IR 5.

 

Modules I can't wait for (Wishlist)

F/A-18C, F-16(Block40+), Su-30, Su-24, F-15E, Tornado IDS

Oh-58D, Ah-1(W/Z)

Missile Flight Model Upgrade

ATC upgrade

Wing Vapor and Wingflex (on everything)

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Hmm, am not making fun of any of you guys, but it is entertaining to red what opinions people have, why something can be or can not be. I am overwhelmed sometimes too.

Is that aimed at me (amongst others?)?. If so, you're totally right. smile.gif

Of course I can't know what is possible for you guys and what is not. I just had to think about some other (former) 3rd parties for DCS that had too ambitious goals and failed to reach them. I'm not calling names here but we had two full fidelity 4 gen fighters as well as a 5 gen fighter in development by 3rd parties that had to give up on these projects. That's where my comment came from. "Everything is possible" sounds nice, but I'm afraid reality isn't that simple. Anyways, as I said before, you guys probably know better what you're able to do and I sound way more negative than I actually are. :)

 

If you take on such a project I will of course support you guys to the best I can, just like I did with other 3rd parties, even the ones that failed in the end, because without trying, nothing is possible. ;)

 

 

Its a shame that you guys have to deal with that, I think everyone would love to hear what you guys have planned for us but sadly a huge section of the community bombards with questions for release. I hope you guys make the right decision, whatever it is I will support you guys!

Well said! :thumbup:


Edited by QuiGon

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DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

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@QuiGon:

 

It is aimed at all the assumtions of all customers. I personally find it highly interesting to see reasons for and against projects.

I am with you on the fact that others had to give up on projects, why I really like to research before, if it is doable in the sim or not, or lets say, if we have the knowledge to do it.

Accessing intel on certain helicopters is sometimes easier and sometimes harder.

For example people yellling for the Mh6 have to understand that it is still in active duty and used by JSOC and SOCOM and that do to these circumstances it is completly restricted and not possible to be done.

I only figured that out in the course of research and talks to people at BOEING that were or are involved with that project, and by that I mean we met personally somewhere on this globe.

"somewhere on this globe" :) can not believe I wrote this.

For example we do aim to get a license from the manufacturers for all of our products. Different approach by different 3rd parties, but we figured that this is a good approach, but we also know that some manufacturers are willing to give licenses and others are not. For the products that will not get a license we have to solve certain aspects a bit different, but that are details customer do not need to bother with.

Fact is, we are small at the moment and I want to have our company grow slowly. We have good links to the manufacturers and do not depend on the armies in first hand but like to work with our military contacts aswell.

Still, projects like a Tigre for example is anything then easy to achiev for many many reasons, but I would never say it is impossile, cause that would already shrink us in our mental state.

 

But one fact is given from our side. We will not do something that we can not achieve, which is why I have not approached the RAH66 or the MH6 or AH1Z Viper, cause these are really impossible without running into interogations by NSA and lawyers. So no, I do not like such a party at my private appartment at all.

 

That said, I like the conversations I see lately here, it seems after our last update the heat is not as hot anymore and the tone becomes more friendly. Thanks for that


Edited by borchi_2b
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I possible I would like to ask a question regarding what is outside the helicopter itself. I believe that a Gazelle would be much more interesting if it could be provided also with simulation enhancement, like i.e. the possibility to use logistic functions directly with ground vehicles and not only by the 4-slot FARP structure, or better fragmentation damage for rockets, or better ground smoke effects when flying NOE or again better logistic code access by script. (all things that you surely know the community is asking almost since DCS series exist).

 

I know that those things don't and shouldn't belong to the third party, but I also think that the way Heatblur added the "road refuel" code or RAZBAM is adding a proper Harrier carrier is a good way to add value to their products.

 

What do you think about this?

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The thing is, helicopters are different from planes. An airplane by it's nature wants to fly, and if not interfered with too strongly by unusual events or by a deliberately incompetent pilot, it will fly. A helicopter does not want to fly. It is maintained in the air by a variety of forces in opposition to each other, and if there is any disturbance in this delicate balance the helicopter stops flying; immediately and disastrously.

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I want to say again what I posted in other threads, maybe stated a bit differently to make the most sense.

 

People wanting light scout/CAS helicopters as well as troop carriers should keep in mind a couple of things.

  • Combined Arms is pretty bare bones, barely as detailed as some Battlefield mods, never mind BF2 or ARMA.
  • These third parties are businesses selling to a very small market, compared to the games market in general.

For these two reasons, everyone should know that priorities of what is the most useful and desired to the most gamers, and will sell well, are the two most important factors in what ends up in DCS World, or they should be. A developer that makes decent money will not just continue to survive, but have cash to fund more projects. I'm probably never going to buy a scout chopper like the Littlebird or Kiowa, or fly an unarmed Gazelle. Not going to buy a troop mover like the CH-53 or 47. Not even if Combined Arms becomes a full fledged ground combat section of DCS. I don't want to be stuck being a bus for getting troops into combat, flying a vulnerable chopper to peek at enemy locations, or driving a tanker or AWACS miles from the action. That is job of the bots. I want to be down in it, reducing enemy combat capability with extreme prejudice.

 

For me, the bottom rung of the ladder should be the UH-1 and Gazelle, utility choppers with some weapons bolted on. With the Red side having dedicated attack copters like Ka-50 and Mi-24 coming along, the Blue team needs purpose built, well armed, rugged combat choppers. My vote is for the AH-1W because it's a late model Cobra with very good battle capability, combat arms resistance and a battle proven track record. And as others have said, less confidential aspects.

 

I want all kinds of assets in DCS too, many as A.I. inventory. But I think everyone should be keeping in mind my two points above, and focus on what will be the most useful first, and what will sell well, so 3rd parties and ED can keep at this mad mission, and we get the most goodies to play with.

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Team Blue want AH-1W, AH-64, Alphajet, A-4, Jaguar, Tornado, F-16, A-6, A-7, F-111, F-15E, B-52, B-1B

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Stryker, although I agree with you we need an attack helicopter plenty of people enjoy roles that are not directly combat related. The Huey and MI-8 are very popular in the server I fly in because they can be used to sling load defenses into position and move troops around. I would welcome a CH-53 or 47 as would almost everyone I fly with. I hope a developer takes a risk on a support aircraft as well such Kc-135, Awacs, or cargo plane. Hell I think a King Air would be cool to do ISR and target marking with.

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Stryker, although I agree with you we need an attack helicopter plenty of people enjoy roles that are not directly combat related. The Huey and MI-8 are very popular in the server I fly in because they can be used to sling load defenses into position and move troops around. I would welcome a CH-53 or 47 as would almost everyone I fly with. I hope a developer takes a risk on a support aircraft as well such Kc-135, Awacs, or cargo plane. Hell I think a King Air would be cool to do ISR and target marking with.

 

+1(0000000).

 

I get the some --- maybe many --- might like to blow things up / shoot things down. But I think there are also many like myself, who actually like flying transports, medevacs, rescue, CSAR, etc. I will take the challenge of navigating mountains in poor visibility using doppler to fly legs and take-off landing in difficult situations --- uneven ground, high winds, small clearing or mountain precipice, or peopple shooting at you. It's about the flying. My all-time favorite single mission, that still has not got old after years, is "Huey Drop", where you work really hard under really difficult conditions to "reducing enemy combat capability with extreme prejudice" by dropping ground troops in the correct locations. The insurgents shoot accurately, and you have to find drop zones that allow you to land and egress close enough so that the AI troops engage, yet still under cover and/or far enough so you do not get shredded. I've modified the mission to fly Mi-8's (which I now LOVE), and also thrown in some gunships just for variation. I get a kick out of flying in the Hip with 6x20 rockets obliterating the resistance pockets ... but the long-term appeal is always the transport mission.

 

The mission that DCS does not support in any truly satisfying way is the scouting mission. You can get something out of a MP/co-op play, maybe, but it is difficult to feel like it is not just busy work. And SP, you cannot even fool yourself into thinking it is not busy work. All made worse by the lack of ground unit visibility in VR.

 

So, yep, by all means lets get a heavy armored Western attack helo (the US philosophy) to complement the light attack helo (the European philosophy) --- the Cobra if not the Apache.

 

But, honestly, if it turns out to be a Black Hawk or a Chinook of a CH-53, that would be A-OK with me, and, I suspect, a lot of other people!

 

Of course, we know we are all just biding time hoping to still be alive and in control of both our minds and bodily functions when the dream arrives, i.e. DCS sky (helos, a/c) + ARMA ground (troops, vehicles)

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  • 3 months later...
  • 2 weeks later...

[quote name=

 

Or maybe an MH/AH-6 littlebird :)

 

SD[/quote]

 

An AH-6 would be so awesome to fly because of its versatility.

 

My hope is for a real attack helicopter like the Tiger or the Apache. Another really cool chopper that I rarely see in games is the OH58 Kiowa. It is similar to the Gazelle with a camera on top.

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Guys, this thread is old. They already anounced, that they are working on the Kiowa...

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DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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Well the thread titel indicates speculations about our 3rd helicopter. Our 2nd left the company when we did the split, so our 3rd became the 2nd now. We still have a 3rd, 4th and 5th in the pipeline, which does not indicate thier current status. the status for the helicopters can be anything, from resource research, over licensing or 3d job up to programming. So yes we try to have a plan for longer and some projects are more complex then others.


Edited by borchi_2b
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Augusta westland Mangusta. A light attack chopper built in Italy with a gunner and a pilot. Not too new but not too old.

 

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That! I would like to see Eurocopter tiger as Mangusta some day.

 

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  • 3 months later...

Based on the fact that Polychop is (always?) making light attack/recon helo with the gazelle and the kiowa + the 3rd helo being currently under production by Airbus, we can suppose that their next product could be a small attack helo as well, should they have the license to do so.

 

 

With that in mind, I see some possibilities being :

 

 

- EC645/H145M (also known as UH-72 Lakota in the US army)

 

 

4692536927_b74f22ae4d_o.jpg

 

- AS550 fennec

 

BG07D045h.jpg

 

 

 

There are also the EC120 but no very used in military and the EC135 but it seems that there are no weapons for it (If I'm not wrong for both assumptions...)

 

So yeah, I would not bet on these.

 

 

However, I would love to see something heavier like a puma/caracal or nh90 tho :thumbup: :


Edited by morse
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Sure but those 32 pages are just speculation and some of the posts are rather wishes than "analysis" (kind of)...

Moreover, we have not 1 but 2 samples : The gazelle and the Kiowa which are both light attack helicopters. I agree, it's not quite accurate but we may have a pattern.

 

 

That's why I suggest that the next chopper might be a light attack helo too but I can be totally wrong (and personnally I hope that I'm wrong :) ). In their "whishlist" poll on FB there were not those choppers. The only Airbus helo was the Tiger so we might actually have a completely different kind of aircraft.

 

 

In the end, we just have to wait and hope that Airbus will allow them to work on the next chopper, when the Kiowa is finished. Only at that time we will be fixed on the model choosen.


Edited by morse
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Please:

 

1. MD Helicopters AH-6 Little Bird

ah-6-carrier.jpg

 

 

2. Eurocopter AS 550C3 Fennec

37302_1247562786.jpg

 

3. Aerospatiale SE3130 Alouette II

se3130_be_a-27.jpg

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The H145M or Tiger would be a real treat for me.

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The more I look into the Tiger the more I like it!

High mounted optics.... lovely!

Massive weapon load.... superb!

 

 

Since playing DCS and experiencing the Gazelle, the tiger could just be the true filthy sniper I crave.

HP G2 Reverb, Windows 10 VR settings: IPD is 64.5mm, High image quality, G2 reset to 60Hz refresh rate as standard. OpenXR user, Open XR tool kit disabled. Open XR was a massive upgrade for me.

DCS: Pixel Density 1.0, Forced IPD at 55 (perceived world size), 0 X MSAA, 0 X SSAA. My real IPD is 64.5mm. Prescription VROptition lenses installed. VR Driver system: I9-9900KS 5Ghz CPU. XI Hero motherboard and RTX 3090 graphics card, 64 gigs Ram, No OC at the mo. MT user  (2 - 5 fps gain). DCS run at 60Hz.

Vaicom user. Thrustmaster warthog user. MFG pedals with damper upgrade.... and what an upgrade! Total controls Apache MPDs set to virtual Reality height with brail enhancements to ensure 100% button activation in VR.. Simshaker Jet Pro vibration seat.. Uses data from DCS not sound.... you know when you are dropping into VRS with this bad boy.

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The more I look into the Tiger the more I like it!

High mounted optics.... lovely!

Massive weapon load.... superb!

 

 

Since playing DCS and experiencing the Gazelle, the tiger could just be the true filthy sniper I crave.

The high mount optics is reason why I love the look of Kiowa. As then AH-64D Longbow because radar mast, but real killer is Mi-28 with dual radar domes (nose + mast).

 

O want to see the remake of "Firebirds" movie, without love story and without silly actions scene like in the "Stealth".

 

Maybe the Russian "Black Shark" movie is the best... Haven't seen it yet, really want to in future.

 

The Tiger would be very nice "neutral" module by not being American or Soviet.

 

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I usually post from my phone so please excuse any typos, inappropriate punctuation and capitalization, missing words and general lack of cohesion and sense in my posts.....

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I’m sure it will be the NH90.

 

- We will have to wait forever :-)

- It will be the most expensive module so far :-)

 

But it will fly like a dream.

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[DCS Mirage 2K; Huey; Spitfire Mk IX, AJS 37, F-14, F-18, FC3, A-10 Warthog II and a few more ]

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