Engine Sound And Feedback

Hi everyone greetings :pilotfly:

Recently i was flying bf109 i noticed some serious issue with it after update, The Engine feedback is gone, There is no vibration at all. I guess this is bug or something related to it. When there is no feedback there is no immersion left...

Second, There is engine sound problem after update and everyone is reporting about that. There is unusual noise going on in cockpit which i noticed in every warbird in dcs. It sound unrealistic and extra, I guess it is okay with allied plane because they have small engines. I don't think so it should be in german engines too. They are big and should sound big. This is exactly a serious problem and destroying immersion to the game. No feedback no viberation of engine, There is unsual artificial sound coming from engine which is super unrealistic. I also make video for better analysis.

 

Following things i noticed wrong in bf109 module.

1: There is no front aspect propeller sound of bf109 in dcs.

2: There is no engine feedback (engine vibration on high rpm or low rpm)

3: Engine sound is only dependent on RPM of engine (It doesn't change with Propeller pitch)

4: Sound of Propeller is inaccurate.

5: Artificial sound coming out of compressor or turbo something at M50 boost which is so stupid and same goes to all warbirds in dcs (except p47 which is new)

6: DCS is going to implement new sound engine for DCS which may improve sound. But this time every bird is affected by this problem especially bf109 which is completely different engine and big one.

BTW i want to thank ED for WW2 experience.

 

Youtube Video:

Edited June 6, 2020 by AliPG

My biggest issue to bf109 sound is that loudness depends on rpm and not on combine rpm and ATA.

So it ends that at cruise settings like 1.1 ata or 1.0 engine sound is almost gone, only supercharger wine stays very high.

And on every YouTube vid about Bf109, sounds very loud even at low cruise settings which those birds flying right now.

I think that 1.0 ATA and 2000 rpm should produce quite nice sound, but in DCS there is almost no sound at this settings external sounds. No matter how you crank up volume.

My biggest issue to bf109 sound is that loudness depends on rpm and not on combine rpm and ATA.

So it ends that at cruise settings like 1.1 ata or 1.0 engine sound is almost gone, only supercharger wine stays very high.

And on every YouTube vid about Bf109, sounds very loud even at low cruise settings which those birds flying right now.

I think that 1.0 ATA and 2000 rpm should produce quite nice sound, but in DCS there is almost no sound at this settings external sounds. No matter how you crank up volume.

 

 

Exactly its true, There is no in cockpit propeller sound too which is sad. It is absolutely unrealistic and sound is broken in dcs. I have video of in-cockpit sound of BF-109, It has incredible big engine and bassy sound. Propeller sound is brutal in real life.

 

Bf109 in cockpit sound:-

 

[YOUTUBE]<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/JGhMGQst4lo" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>[/YOUTUBE]

Please don't duplicate messages in different topic.

For Messerschmidt there have been no updates on sound for the last 2 months.

 

About the volume at low rpms (ATA) - it has already been written 100 times. It is very difficult to explain in detail each time :)

In short, the video volume is overestimated by the compressor at low RPMs (ATA) and greatly lowered by the limiter at high. We are trying to show a huge difference in changing the sound volume from idle to maximum, that you cant hear from gopro cameras. But you can in real life.

 

I know what are you trying to do, but it is too much, at low ATA/RPM bf109 makes no sound at all in DCS. On another hand when you increase RPM manually, sounds is back as full power loudness but even with throttle closed.

You are trying to set a comfortable volume level for flight or maximum RPM mode, and at the same time (with the same volume level) you want to hear Idle well. This is correct and should be for the game, but not for our simulator.

 

Please check the video, I just want to make sure that now in your version of the DCS the same sound?

 

I think now there is a proper level difference between idle and flight modes. but if you have a recording of more or less professional audio equipment - please share it. If there is a discrepancy, I will correct it immediatly.

 

There is no accurate engine vibration simulated here in cockpit in every bird, For 109 there is no in cockpit propeller sound at Front Aspect, More ATA with LOW RPM, The propeller should sound more low pitch but loud. This is not implemented here in DCS unfortunately. I tried every bird here on dcs the sound of compressor or something is so loud on high ATA or boost even overwhelm the sound of engine itself which should not be there but it is there may be because of bad mixing or something. Everyone complaining i know but you guys should focus on public opinions??? The old sound of BF109 was good but no prominent... I am not saying everything should be perfect but its been long time didn't it? :P

Edited June 4, 2020 by AliPG

My biggest issue to bf109 sound is that loudness depends on rpm and not on combine rpm and ATA.

Have you by any chance ever flown yourself a constant speed propeller aircraft? It's weird indeed how, as governor keeps the rpm constant, you at first and until get used to it can't hear really very well how engine changes happens because only MP changing doesn't really change the sound "pitch", it's a constant pitch or "note" (I'm musician either, BTW) and MP changes only do change "intensity" of the rumble to some extent but not the sound itself. Really tough to put in words, but that's it and I know that's hardly audible in a recording no matter how good quality the recording equipment is.

 

I remember P-51 was like that when it first came out and I can tell that sounded really spot on in that regard since I was still flying myself back then (not a P-51 of course, but still an advanced aeroplane). Changes happened not because quality was "bad" but because people without that kind of experience and/or knowledge do complain all of the time.

 

 

S!

Have you by any chance ever flown yourself a constant speed propeller aircraft? It's weird indeed how, as governor keeps the rpm constant, you at first and until get used to it can't hear really very well how engine changes happens because only MP changing doesn't really change the sound "pitch", it's a constant pitch or "note" (I'm musician either, BTW) and MP changes only do change "intensity" of the rumble to some extent but not the sound itself. Really tough to put in words, but that's it and I know that's hardly audible in a recording no matter how good quality the recording equipment is.

 

I remember P-51 was like that when it first came out and I can tell that sounded really spot on in that regard since I was still flying myself back then (not a P-51 of course, but still an advanced aeroplane). Changes happened not because quality was "bad" but because people without that kind of experience and/or knowledge do complain all of the time.

 

 

S!

 

Do you have any idea that in bf 109 it is not a case. Because every change in MP will change RPM as well. You cant experience difrent MP for constant RPM in Bf-109 un less you hit crit alt.

Do you have any idea that in bf 109 it is not a case. Because every change in MP will change RPM as well. You cant experience difrent MP for constant RPM in Bf-109 un less you hit crit alt.

My story was just an example on how you think you know something until you experience yourself, but still not the sound change you seem to crave for. That's only your liking, not the real sound of an aeroplane and it's a nonsense to publish that as a "bug". If everything I don't like in the World were a bug then the whole World is a bug mate…

 

 

S!

Have you by any chance ever flown yourself a constant speed propeller aircraft? It's weird indeed how, as governor keeps the rpm constant, you at first and until get used to it can't hear really very well how engine changes happens because only MP changing doesn't really change the sound "pitch", it's a constant pitch or "note" (I'm musician either, BTW) and MP changes only do change "intensity" of the rumble to some extent but not the sound itself. Really tough to put in words, but that's it and I know that's hardly audible in a recording no matter how good quality the recording equipment is.

 

I remember P-51 was like that when it first came out and I can tell that sounded really spot on in that regard since I was still flying myself back then (not a P-51 of course, but still an advanced aeroplane). Changes happened not because quality was "bad" but because people without that kind of experience and/or knowledge do complain all of the time.

 

 

S!

 

I totally disagree with you, He is saying absolutely right.

 

Originally Posted by grafspee View Post

My biggest issue to bf109 sound is that loudness depends on rpm and not on combine rpm and ATA.

 

I totally agree with this, this is what i am complaining about, This is problem with dcs sound engine it cannot reproduce something like this. There is no propeller sound either in cockpit front aspect.

My story was just an example on how you think you know something until you experience yourself, but still not the sound change you seem to crave for. That's only your liking, not the real sound of an aeroplane and it's a nonsense to publish that as a "bug". If everything I don't like in the World were a bug then the whole World is a bug mate…

 

 

S!

 

I disagree with that, The previous sound version of bf109 was better than this new one, If you are saying this is not bug then it is a dodgy thing that ED has done???

My biggest issue to bf109 sound is that loudness depends on rpm and not on combine rpm and ATA.

....

Well... it depends on RPM and ATA.

 

 

 

 

Fox

Well... it depends on RPM and ATA.

 

 

 

 

Fox

 

share link, don't wrap it plz there is also bug with this forums xD :helpsmilie:

share link, don't wrap it plz there is also bug with this forums xD :helpsmilie:

Here is the link. But you should check your browser. I have no difficulties with embedded videos.

 

 

 

 

 

edit: maybe youtube hat a delay in releasing the video. Should work now

 

 

 

Fox

Edited June 5, 2020 by iFoxRomeo

Well... it depends on RPM and ATA.

 

 

 

 

Fox

 

External sounds. I don't complain about internal,

I tested it yesterday looks like this issue got solved, At 1.0 ATA engine is quite loud now, even at lower ATA/RPM. Im ok with it now.

Still don't sound even close to this video:

 

The sound in dcs 109 is so artificial and fake. there is no punch into the sound. it sound so unfortunately stupid as compare to real one. There is no propeller sound too neither their is engine feedback (viberation) it looks and sounds fake

Edited June 5, 2020 by AliPG

What's your audio equipment like? The fact is these complaints would make sense if you're hearing the sound through very low quality speakers/headphones/etc.; with such gear the high-quality complex samples the DCS 109 uses are almost indiscernible.

 

A disclaimer as I don't fly and am not an audio expert, but I've seen many warbirds (admittedly not the 109) fly and have been in a P-51 during a runup, and a B-25 and T-6 in flight. Based on watching videos of 109s, and comparing videos of the warbirds I've seen with what they actually sounded in real life, I have to say the DCS 109 seems spot on. You can turn up the volume to max and play with the throttle and propeller, and the sound changes accordingly. Every single asset is extremely high quality and has no noticeable loops. You don't feel like you're playing a 109 simulator, but you're actually there, flying a Messerschmitt. And that's only from inside the cockpit, the external sounds are an art of their own. Very few games can attest to that.

 

Our warbirds in DCS weren't sampled from a gopro mic in a youtube video, they instead went out to a flying example with extremely expensive audio equipment and spent days if not weeks recording and perfecting a soundset, then spent a similar amount of time in the studio coming up with ways to represent them in the sim on the fly (I feel like that doesn't get the appreciation it deserves!!). This is why some videos can sound so different, because they usually use the camera's built in microphone and many sounds that are apparent in high quality recordings simply aren't there. In a similar vein the reality is that these nuances aren't apparent with very low quality speakers/headphones/etc. They can sometimes even sound "meaner" in theses setups because of clipping and other stuff, but the actual sound is just less complex. And remember, DCS is a simulator, so it doesn't make sense to make a plane that sounds like a youtube video or arcadey game, they instead made a plane that sounds like real life.

 

I'm not saying it's wrong to use low quality equipment in an elitist way or whatever, I don't have anything more than budget SHP9500s plugged into my motherboard myself, just that there could be a disconnect between expectations and reality in this regard. Thanks for reading my wall of text.

What's your audio equipment like? The fact is these complaints would make sense if you're hearing the sound through very low quality speakers/headphones/etc.; with such gear the high-quality complex samples the DCS 109 uses are almost indiscernible.

 

A disclaimer as I don't fly and am not an audio expert, but I've seen many warbirds (admittedly not the 109) fly and have been in a P-51 during a runup, and a B-25 and T-6 in flight. Based on watching videos of 109s, and comparing videos of the warbirds I've seen with what they actually sounded in real life, I have to say the DCS 109 seems spot on. You can turn up the volume to max and play with the throttle and propeller, and the sound changes accordingly. Every single asset is extremely high quality and has no noticeable loops. You don't feel like you're playing a 109 simulator, but you're actually there, flying a Messerschmitt. And that's only from inside the cockpit, the external sounds are an art of their own. Very few games can attest to that.

 

Our warbirds in DCS weren't sampled from a gopro mic in a youtube video, they instead went out to a flying example with extremely expensive audio equipment and spent days if not weeks recording and perfecting a soundset, then spent a similar amount of time in the studio coming up with ways to represent them in the sim on the fly (I feel like that doesn't get the appreciation it deserves!!). This is why some videos can sound so different, because they usually use the camera's built in microphone and many sounds that are apparent in high quality recordings simply aren't there. In a similar vein the reality is that these nuances aren't apparent with very low quality speakers/headphones/etc. They can sometimes even sound "meaner" in theses setups because of clipping and other stuff, but the actual sound is just less complex. And remember, DCS is a simulator, so it doesn't make sense to make a plane that sounds like a youtube video or arcadey game, they instead made a plane that sounds like real life.

 

I'm not saying it's wrong to use low quality equipment in an elitist way or whatever, I don't have anything more than budget SHP9500s plugged into my motherboard myself, just that there could be a disconnect between expectations and reality in this regard. Thanks for reading my wall of text.

 

 

Well, I don't know what you guys up to. I have ATH M50x with decent DAC/Amp combo, I don't think you should judge game audio with good audio equipment, That everyone should have good audio equipment to get full audio experience , i totally disagree regard your claims, However you are talking about DCS used high end equipment to record, My friend every organisation in the world do the same for recording, 2nd: You don't need high quality equipment to listen actual sound of the game. it is not true. The mastering and mixing of DCS is bad even Grim Reaper mentioned it thousand time on youtube, IT just sound bad and mixing is bad.

 

Also you guys focusing wrong things, This is not about equipment and recording, It is about the thing which doesn't exist if exist it is extra and artificial. Following things i noticed on bf109 module.

1: There is no front aspect propeller sound of bf109 in dcs.

2: There is no engine feedback (engine vibration on high rpm or low rpm)

3: Engine sound is only dependent on RPM of engine (It doesn't change with Propeller pitch)

4: Sound of Propeller is inaccurate.

5: Artificial sound coming out of compressor or turbo something at M50 boost which is so stupid and same goes to all warbirds in dcs (except p47 which is new)

6: DCS is going to implement new sound engine for DCS which may improve sound. But this time every bird is affected by this problem especially bf109 which is completely different engine and big one.

Edited June 6, 2020 by AliPG

Still don't sound even close to this video:

 

The sound in dcs 109 is so artificial and fake. there is no punch into the sound. it sound so unfortunately stupid as compare to real one. There is no propeller sound too neither their is engine feedback (viberation) it looks and sounds fake

 

Oh, this absolutely not the way to record internal sounds, go-pro mounted to plane's fuselage :P

I can say that sound which you can hear is much different then this.

3: Engine sound is only dependent on RPM of engine (It doesn't change with Propeller pitch)

 

That i don't understand since RPM is dependent on prop pitch