DCS WWII: Pacific Marine Question

Well, whatever one will be thinking of has to keep in mind range and situation of P-40F. And some historical background.

Well, whatever one will be thinking of has to keep in mind range and situation of P-40F. And some historical background.

I'm only thinking of the range and situation of the F4U-1, Beaufighter Mk XXI and B-25. I'd like to see this more than any other area of operations for a WWII specific DCS map. Hopefully EDGE will make the entire map MiloMorai posted achievable.

I dont think most of the people realize the distances in Solomon Islands Campaign. Between Rabaul and Henderson is over 650 miles in a straight line.

I havent seen anyone flying with P-51D a long distances flights in DCS and I doubt anyone would be capable of flying in front of his PC for 4 hours to Henderson (or from Henderson to Rabaul), take part in combat and than return with same long flight.

Even if one would take-off or refuel on Bougainville that is still 400 miles in one way.

You have to admire the fighter pilots, especially, who flew such distances day after day, in unpredictable weather, with nothing but sea or jungle to crash into, or bail-out over, if shot down or something went wrong. Saburō Sakai's flight back to Rabaul while injured after an encounter with an SBD - epic.

For gameplay, I wonder whether it would be possible to have the option to 'telescope' time to, say 20 minutes?

That is why New Guinea is way more reasonable in terms of gameplay. From Lae to Port Moresby its 180 miles in straight line, to Milne Bay 330 (so still quite a lot), from Wewak to Port Moresby 450 miles which is the longest range from one base to another in that region.

 

New Guinea seems to be a very reasonable area to fly and based on my own knowledge it involves far more types of aircraft operated there.

I'm only thinking of the range and situation of the F4U-1, Beaufighter Mk XXI and B-25. I'd like to see this more than any other area of operations for a WWII specific DCS map. Hopefully EDGE will make the entire map MiloMorai posted achievable.

In case of asked planes.

First F4U-1 used on Pacific was the so called "birdcage" variant.

Slightly lower performance than F4U-1a and some other differences :

The maximum range of F4U-1 based on F4U Corsair Series Pilots manual was around 1100 miles.

That Beaufighter you mention was quite a late variant. 456th RAAF Squadron used back in December 1942 Beaufighter MK VI. In large numbers since late 1943 and in 1944 was in use Beaufighter TF Mk X.

Based on the Pilots Notes it had range of about 1700+ miles.

First operated B-25 on Pacific were C and D model. Range was about 2750 miles without any external load items.

You have to admire the fighter pilots, especially, who flew such distances day after day, in unpredictable weather, with nothing but sea or jungle to crash into, or bail-out over, if shot down or something went wrong. Saburō Sakai's flight back to Rabaul while injured after an encounter with an SBD - epic.

 

For gameplay, I wonder whether it would be possible to have the option to 'telescope' time to, say 20 minutes?

Well, this had to be absolutely exhausting for those Japanese pilots. No wonder they suffered such losses in that campaign with conditions they had to fight.

I dont think that would be possible, you could reduce the size of the "world" by half as I recall in one game I played about 10 years ago, which offered and 1 hour flights to Germany in a B-17. But dont see other way.

And that is why I through of New Guinea, as a picture presented on a previous page:

Besides, into New Guinea you can actually put all Allied forces - RAAF, RNZAF, US and I think even Dutch pilots were there.

I want larger maps because there are more options as far as gameplay is concerned. My want is for a map that covers New Guinea, New Britain and the Solomon Islands. Not just New Guinea/New Britain. My preference is for long ranged aircraft so the P-39/P-40/Wirraway/Boomerang are not what I want to fly. The vast majority of Corsair operations were from the Solomons and (The Corsair being in the top three of my most wanted aircraft) that is what I want to simulate most. For multiplayer having larger maps with many airbases scattered around different islands is a plus as it doesn't have to be strictly historical for the airquake type missions everyone seems so fond of. Just pick two bases that are reasonably close to each other and have at it.

I agree with Hiromachi.

If the map was made it should be possible to make simple and quick missions on it.

Flying 4h to your objective is out of the question. The map must be compact and varried. New Guinea fits perfectly and you could have Corsair and Zero.

Too big maps and we will have still problems that we have with DCS now. We should have more maps and smaller instead of making one big that is just too heavy on performance, making FPS drop and lagging servers.

We don't have high performance Jets, so we don't need as much space and realy flying from Rabaul to Guadacanal is a super bad idea for video game.

You are not real WW2 pilots and you'll never be. You don't have orders and will to fight for your country in the game. You are not doing anything of importance, then why modeling maps that have 5h distances from 1 base to another? Also try navigating over open Pacific. GOOD LUCK.

EDIT:

@Vampyre You can say so now and then I will see you fly one mission for 4 hours from point A to B and you die during 5th hour and you will never come back to the game.

There is no Auto-pilot, so you have to sit your butt on the chair in front of your PC for 7 hours just to find nothing, or get killed by a Zero in one pass or even better loose your engine to missmanagment before you can even see the action. Good luck again.

Based on my observations its more a matter of finding a relatively good area which will not involve unimaginable amount of work, time and money. I mean the case is that we have P-40F coming, sooner or later. So to have some first PTO battles its a matter of making a map and making a Japanese fighter, in this case easiest seems to be A6M.

I know we are speculating but if one would think of trying to involve some development team, to build a Zero ... I think they would be highly interested how much resources that would involve.

I agree with Hiromachi.

 

If the map was made it should be possible to make simple and quick missions on it.

 

Flying 4h to your objective is out of the question. The map must be compact and varried. New Guinea fits perfectly and you could have Corsair and Zero.

 

Too big maps and we will have still problems that we have with DCS now. We should have more maps and smaller instead of making one big that is just too heavy on performance, making FPS drop and lagging servers.

 

We don't have high performance Jets, so we don't need as much space and realy flying from Rabaul to Guadacanal is a super bad idea for video game.

 

You are not real WW2 pilots and you'll never be. You don't have orders and will to fight for your country in the game. You are not doing anything of importance, then why modeling maps that have 5h distances from 1 base to another? Also try navigating over open Pacific. GOOD LUCK.

 

EDIT:

@UP You can say so now and then I will see you fly one mission for 4 hours from point A to B and you die during 5th hour and you will never come back to the game.

 

There is no Auto-pilot, so you have to sit your butt on the chair in front of your PC for 7 hours just to find nothing, or get killed by a Zero in one pass. Good luck again.

Well it seems that there is no reason to have anything other than the Georgia map then. Just change the colors of the map add some era specific objects and viola, its just like New Guinea without all the dreaded true to life simulation inconveniences. Not everyone wants less realism with half or quarter scale maps for gameplay purposes. I was always irritated with IL-2 maps for this very reason. I would want the entire earth modeled but it seems this will not be possible. The current Georgia map is far too small for my tastes as it is. There is no real use for the tankers because every aircraft in game (minus the helo's) can fly from one side of the map to the other with no problems and many can make it all the way back as well. My hope is for a realistic map.

At Solomon island did have some airfields....The bigger map its great because you should make diferents missions with diferents location of same map. We can use diferent parts of same map. No to make a fly of 4h, but if you want to do this at SP mission....you can do!

Examples of missions:

1943 Feb

Seigi airfield vs Guadalcanal (Herderson airfield) distance about 280km +-40'

Seigi airfield vs Renard airfield distance about 180km time +-30'

At diferents dates we have more near airbase of japan and USA.

And with another parts of map we have other airfields to engage....we dont need to fly by rabaul and santa cruz.

This is one map that can make diferents mission with diferents dates and location....And a great variation of ground , naval and air superiority missions. And if CA can control naval operations they have a entire world to enjoy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon_Islands_campaign#mediaviewer/File:Solomon_Islands_Campaign.jpg

Well it seems that there is no reason to have anything other than the Georgia map then. Just change the colors of the map add some era specific objects and viola, its just like New Guinea without all the dreaded true to life simulation inconveniences. Not everyone wants less realism with half or quarter scale maps for gameplay purposes. I was always irritated with IL-2 maps for this very reason. I would want the entire earth modeled but it seems this will not be possible. The current Georgia map is far too small for my tastes as it is. There is no real use for the tankers because every aircraft in game (minus the helo's) can fly from one side of the map to the other with no problems and many can make it all the way back as well. My hope is for a realistic map.

Nice way to completely flip the table to suit your own cause. Straw man argument. A classic.

I just said that we should get smaller map of New Guinea instead of making silly oversized map that kills the performance of the game. We can get 3 maps that are smaller instead of making a map that is not even possible to fly on one fuel tank with additonal fuel tanks.

You will not make me believe that you go to DCS just fly your plane for 10hours constantly landing and taking more fuel.

Tell me with full confidence that you would like to fly for 4 hours straight without even seeing an enemy plane. Even more. Tell me that you even tried to take a P-51D(or any other plane) with full fuel load and fly around the map that we have now. Have you?

I realy can't imagine that.

The most think that i want is take off and landing at carrier with a PFM airplane.....I will need to practice much this and when i can really do it i will be a happy guy.

If we have a dynamic weather affecting wave size....and your carrier shaking over waves...You can image how hard can be landing at shake carrier....hehehehhe

Will be amazing!

A dog bone map could be made for the air quakers. Three airfields at each end of the bone and a 1/2 hour flying time from end to end.

A dog bone map could be made for the air quakers. Three airfields at each end of the bone and a 1/2 hour flying time from end to end.

I see nobody cares about the way the game runs. It is impossible to make a map of scale that you want to run well. IT IS IMPOSSBILE.

The game runs bad when there is too much data.

I see nobody cares about the way the game runs. It is impossible to make a map of scale that you want to run well. IT IS IMPOSSBILE.

 

The game runs bad when there is too much data.

It is true Now at DCSW 1.2.14, but it will be a problem after DCSW 2.0.0?

Guadalcanal its what i thinking....New guine its ok....but its more boring than a beutifull map with many islands and many naval combat.

 

Tell me with full confidence that you would like to fly for 4 hours straight without even seeing an enemy plane. Even more. Tell me that you even tried to take a P-51D(or any other plane) with full fuel load and fly around the map that we have now. Have you?

 

I realy can't imagine that.

Are we really starting '15 by arguing over the size of a map on a wishlist? :lol:

I think the map should be as large as ED has resources to devote to it. We probably don't need the entire Pacific within the first map dedicated to that region but I'm pretty sure our current performance issues with servers are not due to map size.

Open expanses of water might allow us to use those handy AN/ARA-8 (Uncle Dog) homing radio antennas you see aft of the Mustang canopy.

Guadalcanal its what i thinking....New guine its ok....but its more boring than a beutifull map with many islands and many naval combat.

I dont like to sound like being completely focused on New Guinea but it seems to be the most possible map to do with decent effort.

Now to answer. Its not true what you say.

What is more, what you say proves how little people know about New Guinea campaign.

This is the only area in which combat lasted for almost 3 years without any break, starting from 10th March 1942 when Yorktown and Lexington launched their TBD Devastators, SBD Dauntless and Wildcats to fly over Owen Stanley range and hit established newly Japanese Navy base at Lea.

to the east occured the major naval battle prior to Midway, the battle of Coral Sea.

It's the only area in which you can enjoy such variety of machines being used by both sides, just to name warbirds like Ki-43 Oscar, Ki-61 Tony, Ki-45 Nick, J1N Gekko, all kinds of Zeros, Boomerangs, P-38Fs, Wildcats, P-39s and P-400s, P-40s, P-47s (first P-47Ds were deployed in New Guinea).

The missions flew from Rabaul to strike targets over northern Australia (Townsville) had to cross this area.

New Guinea is not boring by any mean. From my perspective it is even more interesting than Solomon Campaign as it involves wider variety of aircraft flying in more balanced conditions, as it was true attrition campaign.

I dont like to sound like being completely focused on New Guinea but it seems to be the most possible map to do with decent effort.

 

Now to answer. Its not true what you say.

What is more, what you say proves how little people know about New Guinea campaign.

This is the only area in which combat lasted for almost 3 years without any break, starting from 10th March 1942 when Yorktown and Lexington launched their TBD Devastators, SBD Dauntless and Wildcats to fly over Owen Stanley range and hit established newly Japanese Navy base at Lea.

to the east occured the major naval battle prior to Midway, the battle of Coral Sea.

It's the only area in which you can enjoy such variety of machines being used by both sides, just to name warbirds like Ki-43 Oscar, Ki-61 Tony, Ki-45 Nick, J1N Gekko, all kinds of Zeros, Boomerangs, P-38Fs, Wildcats, P-39s and P-400s, P-40s, P-47s (first P-47Ds were deployed in New Guinea).

The missions flew from Rabaul to strike targets over northern Australia (Townsville) had to cross this area.

 

New Guinea is not boring by any mean. From my perspective it is even more interesting than Solomon Campaign as it involves wider variety of aircraft flying in more balanced conditions, as it was true attrition campaign.

Guadalcanal need wider variety of aircraf its a positive thing now.....Fewer aircrafts to make to this happen...now we don´t have any pacific planes and to make many airplanes now take too time....

New Guine its ok for me....I fly many years ago at 1942 Pacific Air War....i still have the cd, box and manuals.....

If someone make something like that i will be happy! Guadalcanal its a personal opnion, but any south pacific operation will make me happy!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon_Islands#mediaviewer/File:EasternSolomonsEnterpriseBurning.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solomon_Islands#mediaviewer/File:Solomon_Isles.jpg

DCS J2M3 Raiden, yes I am waiting :)

it's not perfect but whoever makes these mods is incredibly talented!

i haven't tried the raiden myself but i would seriously take a look into it http://virtualcockpits.web.fc2.com/mod/dcsw_raiden21/dcsw_raiden21.html

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also on a side note what about a wake island map?

Nice way to completely flip the table to suit your own cause. Straw man argument. A classic.

 

I just said that we should get smaller map of New Guinea instead of making silly oversized map that kills the performance of the game. We can get 3 maps that are smaller instead of making a map that is not even possible to fly on one fuel tank with additonal fuel tanks.

 

You will not make me believe that you go to DCS just fly your plane for 10hours constantly landing and taking more fuel.

 

Tell me with full confidence that you would like to fly for 4 hours straight without even seeing an enemy plane. Even more. Tell me that you even tried to take a P-51D(or any other plane) with full fuel load and fly around the map that we have now. Have you?

 

I realy can't imagine that.

You know good and well I cannot prove what I have done before so stating that I have flown around the Black Sea will not magically make it true in anyones mind. Nice try though.

With EDGE coming out sometime this year (hopefully) there will be performance improvements within the engine and it is my hope that it will mean better optimization and use of system resources that will enable larger maps with more detailed terrain than is currently possible.

I suppose it all boils down to what you want DCS to be for you. I want the realism that I have never had in a combat sim before. The argument for anything less than real world distances is a moot point when the one thinks about it. DCS aspires to be more than just a game. ED want's DCS to be a full fidelity simulation (as full as it can get anyway) and cutting corners to make it more game like would take away from that. Stating that you want less of something is a sure way to get exactly that. I say shoot for the stars.

It's the only area in which you can enjoy such variety of machines being used by both sides, just to name warbirds like Ki-43 Oscar, Ki-61 Tony, Ki-45 Nick, J1N Gekko, all kinds of Zeros, Boomerangs, P-38Fs, Wildcats, P-39s and P-400s, P-40s, P-47s (first P-47Ds were deployed in New Guinea)..

There was a huge variety of planes in other theatres as well, think MTO, P-40, P39, Wildcat/Martlet, Hurricanes, Spitfires, Beaufighters/Beauforts, G.50, CR42, MC200, MC202, Re 2000, Bf 109E/F/G, Ju-88, SM79, Br20, the MTO is a very interesting theatre and I think it would be very fun in the DCS environment. But this is a little :poster_offtopic:

Just saying, don't go saying "only area" when there are possibilities that there are others.

Flare

I hope that south pacific theater operation come to DCSW, but it is sad to say that if it will be done.....it will take a long time, because the planes (we need alot of USA and Japanese planes). New planes take many time to be completed. The map, units and others stuffs to make the scenary should be take less time, but only will be done after the planes.

Nice footages of guadalcanal combats

Just saying, don't go saying "only area" when there are possibilities that there are others.

Flare

I think you misunderstood, I was referring to the Pacific. Not whole world war two. I am aware that there are areas like Mediterranean sea, personally I would enjoy flying Italian bombers and dropping torpedoes.

But once again, I was just trying to make a point in regard to the Pacific.

I hope that south pacific theater operation come to DCSW, but it is sad to say that if it will be done.....it will take a long time, because the planes (we need alot of USA and Japanese planes). New planes take many time to be completed. The map, units and others stuffs to make the scenary should be take less time, but only will be done after the planes.

For the begining just P-40F and Zero would be fine :)

I think you misunderstood, I was referring to the Pacific. Not whole world war two. I am aware that there are areas like Mediterranean sea, personally I would enjoy flying Italian bombers and dropping torpedoes.

But once again, I was just trying to make a point in regard to the Pacific.

 

 

 

 

For the begining just P-40F and Zero would be fine :)

No one is developing a Zero right now ( Ed or 3rd party)

The P40F is being done....F4 Wildcat is planed to late of 2015

F8F bearcat is planed to be done but its not fly at WW2. the war was over when they come to production.

Is someone doing a Zero?

It will be amazing!

No one is developing a Zero right now ( Ed or 3rd party)

 

The P40F is being done....F4 Wildcat is planed to late of 2015

 

F8F bearcat is planed to be done but its not fly at WW2. the war was over when they come to production.

 

Is someone doing a Zero?

It will be amazing!

No, nobody is. But that was speculation, I mean there is P-40F coming so was thinking what would be easiest and cheapest to build for some company.