Difference between Flaming Cliffs 1 and 2? - ED Forums
 


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Old 09-07-2018, 10:16 PM   #1
Duxa
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Question Difference between Flaming Cliffs 1 and 2?

So I bought LOMAC Gold back in like 2004 or 2005. I played it back then a bunch, but its been on my shelf for over a decade.

I recently dug out my old stick and got this urge of playing LOMAC again.

LOMAC installs and runs (with minor issues) on Windows 10. But the second disc (Flaming Cliffs) uses StarForce, which after jumping through hoops for a few hours I finally concluded (through updating StarForce and using their utility (http://www.star-force.com/support/sfhelper/) and it actually telling me that the only way it would ever work would be for the developer to release a patch to make it compatible with new versions of StarForce or ideally remove it altogether), that basically there is no way Ill ever be able to play Flaming Cliffs again (unless I install Windows XP, which is not something I will ever do I dont think).

So the question is then. What exactly is the difference between Flaming Cliffs 2 and 1? I read through that page about all of the stuff Flaming Cliffs 2 added, thats not what I am curious about. More specifically i want to know, does Flaming Cliffs 2 contain everything from Flaming Cliffs 1? Because the Flaming Cliffs 2 info page is very cryptic about this. It simply states that its a great improvement upon Flaming Cliffs 1. But what about content from FC1? Is it all in there?

If not, is it possible to take the scenarios/missions etc from Flaming Cliffs 1 and use them in Flaming Cliffs 2?

To distill it even further. If I have LOMAC and Flaming Cliffs 2. What am I missing out on by not having Flaming Cliffs 1?

PS - How has there not been an outrage from the community about inability to play the product they paid for? Why hasnt ED/Ubisoft or whoever owns the code released a patch to remove StarForce. Surely they arent making any sales of FC1 and havent in over a decade?

Thanks!

Last edited by Duxa; 09-07-2018 at 10:21 PM.
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Old 09-07-2018, 11:05 PM   #2
Rudel_chw
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Originally Posted by Duxa View Post
PS - How has there not been an outrage from the community about inability to play the product they paid for?
What inability? ... that product can still be used, but you do have to fulfill the game requirements .. and those include Windows XP, Vista or Win 7 (https://www.lockon.ru/en/downloads/s...ffs_2_english/

What you are asking for is to have ED update the game for a different Operating System ... well, they have done that and now its called Flamming Cliffs 3

Quote:
Why hasnt ED/Ubisoft or whoever owns the code released a patch to remove StarForce. Surely they arent making any sales of FC1 and havent in over a decade?
Why would a developer spend time on something that will net zero revenue, rather than invest it on making new sims?

I also own LoMac and it is still on my shelf, but I'm not frustrated at the fact that I cant use it anymore, I already got my money's worth over the hundred of entertainment hours that it gave me:

Even if I could run it again, why would I do that ... there is no comparison, 15 years of technological difference is a really big deal:



https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php...25&postcount=6

In sum, you are much better off purchasing FC3 on a sale, than sticking to the old Sim.

Cheers
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Old 09-07-2018, 11:38 PM   #3
Duxa
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Originally Posted by Rudel_chw View Post
What inability? ... that product can still be used, but you do have to fulfill the game requirements .. and those include Windows XP, Vista or Win 7 (https://www.lockon.ru/en/downloads/s...ffs_2_english/

What you are asking for is to have ED update the game for a different Operating System ... well, they have done that and now its called Flamming Cliffs 3


Why would a developer spend time on something that will net zero revenue, rather than invest it on making new sims?

I also own LoMac and it is still on my shelf, but I'm not frustrated at the fact that I cant use it anymore, I already got my money's worth over the hundred of entertainment hours that it gave me:

Even if I could run it again, why would I do that ... there is no comparison, 15 years of technological difference is a really big deal:



https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php...25&postcount=6

In sum, you are much better off purchasing FC3 on a sale, than sticking to the old Sim.

Cheers
Why do we ever go back to old games instead of always playing latest and greatest? I dont know, because I want to? Is that not reason enough? Nostalgia?

Does FC3 have all of the same missions/campaigns/landmasses? If not then it wouldnt be a better replacement, it would just be an alternative. In the ideal world I have access to all of them and play all of them. Not just one.

I dont mean to pick a fight. But what you have stated is the obvious. The whole "they would have to modify it to support a new OS thing" is a loop hole. And as for the reason as to why do it, how about so that their customers are happy? I am much less inclined to purchase anything new from a developer if they use a loop hole to stop supporting their old products. Again they are more than welcome to do that, but maybe a few days it would take an engineer to patch out StarForce would be worth the effort? They probably already have non StarForce protected exes at the studio from testing the game/patches (I highly doubt that they internally ran StarForce protected exes during development/testing). There is probably not much work to be done in the first place. As for the benefits of even spending a day to dig it up and post it. Well the worth of that is a matter of opinion and is not worth going into here.

Being OK with it is like saying, oh your 10 year old car wont start because of a protection manufacturer put on it? Well, why would you want that car anyways? New ones are so much better! Because I paid for it and there is no good reason for it to not work? There is nothing wrong with the game, its perfectly supported under Windows 10, the issue is with the copy protection that is refusing to launch the game.

My original question remains though. What am I missing if I have LOMAC and FC2 but not FC1?

Last edited by Duxa; 09-07-2018 at 11:49 PM.
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Old 09-08-2018, 01:03 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Duxa View Post
Does FC3 have all of the same missions/campaigns/landmasses? If not then it wouldnt be a better replacement, it would just be an alternative. In the ideal world I have access to all of them and play all of them. Not just one.

You are right, the map on Lo-Mac is different and Crimea was lost on DCS.



Quote:
I dont mean to pick a fight.

Me neither .. you probably should just install a Windows 8 on a separate partition of your PC and dual boot to play the older game, I used to do that a lot when Windows 7 was new


Best regards
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Old 09-08-2018, 02:43 AM   #5
Duxa
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You are right, the map on Lo-Mac is different and Crimea was lost on DCS.






Me neither .. you probably should just install a Windows 8 on a separate partition of your PC and dual boot to play the older game, I used to do that a lot when Windows 7 was new


Best regards
Do LOMAC/FC1 and FC2 all share same maps? Or did FC1/FC2 add new maps?
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Old 09-08-2018, 03:50 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Duxa View Post
Do LOMAC/FC1 and FC2 all share same maps? Or did FC1/FC2 add new maps?

LoMac and FC1 shared the same Map, it covered Caucasus and Crimea and was much larger than the one we have now on DCS





FC1 used the same Map, but added textures for all four seasons.


FC2 is almost the same as FC1, but used the new Caucasus map developed for Blackshark, this allowed multiplayer between Blackshark and FC2, this was the map then:





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Old 09-10-2018, 08:37 PM   #7
Duxa
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Originally Posted by Rudel_chw View Post
LoMac and FC1 shared the same Map, it covered Caucasus and Crimea and was much larger than the one we have now on DCS





FC1 used the same Map, but added textures for all four seasons.


FC2 is almost the same as FC1, but used the new Caucasus map developed for Blackshark, this allowed multiplayer between Blackshark and FC2, this was the map then:





Thanks for the detailed reply. So do I have this straight:

So then what about DCS/FC3, are those all sharing same map as FC2? (except Nevada that was added and I think one more) ?

Any idea if FC1 content can be extracted and used either with FC2 or LOMAC (like extracting textures).
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Old 09-10-2018, 09:31 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Duxa View Post
So then what about DCS/FC3, are those all sharing same map as FC2?

FC3 is currently using the rebuilt Caucasus Map, so it isnt really the same map anymore.


Quote:
Any idea if FC1 content can be extracted and used either with FC2 or LOMAC (like extracting textures).

I dont really know, sorry .. it's been many years since I used to play FC1
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