DCS G-Model

Tried out some Just Dogfight servers online (with G-model set to realistic) in the Viper. Well, it not realistic at all. I start blacking out when pushing above 7G. Can only sustain 9G for like a second, then I can't see anything.

I doubt this is realistic and it makes the Viper useless in BFM. I've seen several videos of people sustaining 9 G for a lot longer than what DCS offers. Also, my father in law, being an ex fighter pilot in the Swedish Airforce also confirms this is not realistic at all.

ED, please investigate and make the necessarry adjustments.

It's being 'investigated'....

ED is simulating Weakest Pilot, Lack of G training and Fly without proper G-suit...

I can sustain 8 to 8,5 G rather long in the f/16 without blackout... Your doing it wrong...

The blackout limit is at around 7.8 Gs. After this, the more Gs you add only shortens time to GLOC. So 7.8Gs is the max you can sustain. Really simplified system that is in desperate need of an update.

Tried out some Just Dogfight servers online (with G-model set to realistic) in the Viper. Well, it not realistic at all. I start blacking out when pushing above 7G. Can only sustain 9G for like a second, then I can't see anything.

 

I doubt this is realistic and it makes the Viper useless in BFM. I've seen several videos of people sustaining 9 G for a lot longer than what DCS offers. Also, my father in law, being an ex fighter pilot in the Swedish Airforce also confirms this is not realistic at all.

 

ED, please investigate and make the necessarry adjustments.

The g-modeling includes warmups. Your father in law should be familiar with that concept. It's common to perform a few moderate g turns to ''warm up'' before engaging in BFM training/combat. This is also a recommendation in DCS, as it improves your g endurance.

When spawning in air against the ai, or an adversary there's really no time to perform a g warmup of you want to survive, the ai does not seem to be affected at all. In either way, it's way too harshly simulated, making high g capable planes like the f16 and f15 for example handicapped.

Like alfas said above, it's not very fun or realistic to demand this of a sim pilot under the circumstances we play. Perhaps the goal should be to simulate a veteran pilot and not someone who haven't flown for months. But as usual when suggesting a change to DCS, it's negated and defended and ignored.

The Viper and g tolerance in BMS feels a lot more manageable. I suggest you bring up for discussion.

If I can't rate fight a Hornet because I'm blacking out constantly when pushing above 7g, it's not correctly modeled.

I think if we are talking realistic vs dcs I think ur cherry picking just talking about g/blackout. What about head movements or control movement. Just seems strange u think just bc u blackout so easy dcs is wrong. It’s wrong on so many other g aspects as well.

The whole reason for the reclined seat in the F-16 was G-tolerance. If the baseline in DCS is 7.8 then in the Viper it should be bumped to 8.8.

The whole reason for the reclined seat in the F-16 was G-tolerance. If the baseline in DCS is 7.8 then in the Viper it should be bumped to 8.8.

Mover and other SMEs on this topic have said that the G-limit is super low, regardless of air-frame. The reclined seat is a 2 edged sword, when you need to look behind you at 8g, you might not like it anymore... as many have complained.

that aside, the g-limit / blackout is really low, but i've heard that g-warm-up might be a thing modeled in DCS. I'd like to know this definitively... as sometimes I can pull a lot more g than others... especially toward the end of a mission...

I think there should be a G tolerance hook based on how many flight hours your logbook pilot has since their last death.

Boom.

Done.

Headed for the wishlist.

There is G warm up in DCS and it does increase the tolerance slightly. However you stay "warmed" up for about 2 minutes before you need to do it again. I guess we should all be zig zagging through the air to keep the tolerance up. :D

When spawning in air against the ai, or an adversary there's really no time to perform a g warmup of you want to survive, the ai does not seem to be affected at all. In either way, it's way too harshly simulated, making high g capable planes like the f16 and f15 for example handicapped.

 

Like alfas said above, it's not very fun or realistic to demand this of a sim pilot under the circumstances we play. Perhaps the goal should be to simulate a veteran pilot and not someone who haven't flown for months. But as usual when suggesting a change to DCS, it's negated and defended and ignored.

 

The Viper and g tolerance in BMS feels a lot more manageable. I suggest you bring up for discussion.

 

If I can't rate fight a Hornet because I'm blacking out constantly when pushing above 7g, it's not correctly modeled.

Cause your doing it wrong...

The G warmups only allow you to sustain 7.8Gs without blacking out, but don't increase peak G tolerance above this.

I think now that we have an F-16 in the game, there really should be a revamp to the whole system. The current system does not allow fighting to the strengths of the Viper, and looking at online dogfight servers really expose this. The MiG-29 is also a "victim" of the current G-model.

An interesting article about this is Air Force Magizine. Many have probably already read this - but seems if you can't sustain 8G for several seconds before G-Lock in the F-16 this would seem very off.

Basically it points out that today's pilot can sustain about 9G for about 1.5 seconds in the F-16, or similar "high agility" aircraft. I don't own the F-16 but can pull about 9G before G-Lock sets in the F-14B -seems about right.

Anyhow, here is the link: https://www.airforcemag.com/article/1091glock/

Good day,

DrDetroit

Anyhow, an interesting read

I don't really see where that 1.5 seconds claim is in the article and I've never heard of that either. I could have overseen it though.

But I'm pretty sure that F-16 pilots train to hold 9Gs for an extended period, 15-30 seconds? (Someone please correct me on this)

There is no doubt that RL F-16 pilots are trained to withstand 9Gs for way longer than 1,5 seconds.

I don't really see where that 1.5 seconds claim is in the article and I've never heard of that either. I could have overseen it though.

But I'm pretty sure that F-16 pilots train to hold 9Gs for an extended period, 15-30 seconds? (Someone please correct me on this)

 

There is no doubt that RL F-16 pilots are trained to withstand 9Gs for way longer than 1,5 seconds.

Actually, my bad....it talks about g-limiters that limit pilot to about 9g IN 1.5 seconds...not FOR 1.5 seconds.

I haven't read the whole thing yet, but 9G for 30 seconds seems waaay too long, but maybe you are correct. Seems would be more like 5-10 seconds at 9X gravity.

Again...the myth about "g-warmup"...

DCS is very unrealistic here, and there's no such thing as a g-warmup as it happens in DCS.

The so called g-warmup doesn't increase g-tolerance. It's performed to check the g-suit is connected and working properly AND to check your general status and tolerance for the day.

If you slept well and are in great shape, you can pull and sustain a lot of g immediately, it's not like if you did the warm-up you'd sustain more g.

Conversley on a shitty day, your g-tolerance will be lower and no warm-up can make it better.

To conclude, the warm-up is done to get a feeling for how many g you can safely pull but it doesn't magically boost your tolerance.

"You cannot sustain more Gs because you didn't do G warm up..." Well, G warm up doesn't really increase your G tolerance in real life.

Yea, let's make realistic g tolerance. But please, don't forget tgat you won't be able to turn your head if you pull more than 5 Gs

You can already move your head in unrealistic ways with TrackIR and VR, what's your point?

I'd much rather that the game be unrealistic in that regard, than not being able to pull high Gs at all.

Tried out some Just Dogfight servers online (with G-model set to realistic) in the Viper. Well, it not realistic at all. I start blacking out when pushing above 7G. Can only sustain 9G for like a second, then I can't see anything.

 

I doubt this is realistic and it makes the Viper useless in BFM. I've seen several videos of people sustaining 9 G for a lot longer than what DCS offers. Also, my father in law, being an ex fighter pilot in the Swedish Airforce also confirms this is not realistic at all.

 

ED, please investigate and make the necessarry adjustments.

This was the first complaint I heard from a real-life Viper pilot when he tried out the DCS F-16 in VR. He was very impressed in most respects, but the gloc onset is a real problem.

How about a compromise? Hold 9gs as long as you are looking within 30deg of center, then its a sliding scale.. by the time you are looking at your tail, gs are down to 6max before gloc

How about a compromise? Hold 9gs as long as you are looking within 30deg of center, then its a sliding scale.. by the time you are looking at your tail, gs are down to 6max before gloc

Pilots are trained to position their head before they begin a high g turn, often to the side of the headrest where it is held in place until gs are unloaded!