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Anyone dialing in takeoffs with regular success with NO takeoff assistance?


rbapon

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Takeoffs with 100% assistance isn't that difficult for me but turn off (set to 0%) takeoff assistance and immediately I'm veering off course and scraping wing tips. I can't get any kind of nice forward momentum and it doesn't matter how much I adjust rudder trim and boost settings. One difficult bird to get moving down the runway respectably without assistance! :pilotfly:

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Takeoffs with 100% assistance isn't that difficult for me but turn off (set to 0%) takeoff assistance and immediately I'm veering off course and scraping wing tips. I can't get any kind of nice forward momentum and it doesn't matter how much I adjust rudder trim and boost settings. One difficult bird to get moving down the runway respectably without assistance! :pilotfly:

 

 

Keep your stick to the right and back when you roll, only using small correction in your pedals, when the tail wheel starts to come up, roll the stick slowly back to the centre and avoid jumpy throttle movements. Torque plays a huge factor in keeping the aircraft straight, remember that. :)

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This is what I do:

1. Set rudder trim so the word "STBD" is at the 3 O'clock position on the trim wheel.

2. Set the RPM lever about 1 inch back.

3. Set the pitch trim to neutral. Sometimes up one tick. Either or...

4. Taxi forward a bit to ensure the tail wheel is straight. *Very helpful*

5. No flaps.

6. Stick full right. I don't pull it back for takeoff, only for taxiing.

7. Jam the throttle to 3000rpm immediately.

8. Minor rudder adjustments.

9. When I feel the plane start to roll right I gingerly bring the stick to center.

10. Plane lifts off all by itself. Not kidding about this.

11. Maintain positive rate of climb to 140mph.

12. Bring throttle back to operating boost pressures.

13. Raise gear and have fun.

 

This is what is working for me.

 

Watch the boost pressure. You will blow the manifold and lock her up.

 

Landing...I suck at it still.

 

If anyone wants my curve settings for my Hog just let me know.

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This is what I do:

1. Set rudder trim so the word "STBD" is at the 3 O'clock position on the trim wheel.

2. Set the RPM lever about 1 inch back.

3. Set the pitch trim to neutral. Sometimes up one tick. Either or...

4. Taxi forward a bit to ensure the tail wheel is straight. *Very helpful*

5. No flaps.

6. Stick full right. I don't pull it back for takeoff, only for taxiing.

7. Jam the throttle to 3000rpm immediately.

8. Minor rudder adjustments.

9. When I feel the plane start to roll right I gingerly bring the stick to center.

10. Plane lifts off all by itself. Not kidding about this.

11. Maintain positive rate of climb to 140mph.

12. Bring throttle back to operating boost pressures.

13. Raise gear and have fun.

 

This is what is working for me.

 

Watch the boost pressure. You will blow the manifold and lock her up.

 

Landing...I suck at it still.

 

If anyone wants my curve settings for my Hog just let me know.

 

Thanks for an actual informative answer that isn't humblebragging.

 

It helped to at least leave the ground without fireballs.

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The Spit's devilish handling on 0% assistance reminds me of the early release Bf109K4. That was an experience to be endured and not really enjoyed. As the developers refined the handling model over time the Bf became that high horsepower taildragger challenge to be enjoyed as it is for me now. Maybe it's just me and I need more time with the Spit but from what I've read I haven't known this plane to be so fiendish on the takeoff run.

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More time is the key I think. I expect the 109 got easier for you because you got used to how it behaves rather than the flight model being changed.

 

The Spitfire was awful for me at first - until I realized I had LEFT the take off assists on, and that made things less predictable for me.

 

Tail draggers are just very fussy, and the main gear being so far forwards of the centre of mass means it'll step out and ground loop if you don't stay on top of the rudder control. You get to the point where you can anticipate what will happen next, and then control just clicks - as you found in the 109.

 

Just stick with it, and change nothing - that way you will get a feel for what to do much faster. zero curves and quick but gentle corrections are the order of the day.

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This is what I do:

 

2. Set the RPM lever about 1 inch back.

7. Jam the throttle to 3000rpm immediately.

.

 

2 : I notice this workround works. but nothing to do wirth the RL pilot notes

7 : Poor little Merlin 66. ... ;-)

:music_whistling::pilotfly:

 

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The throttle sets boost, not RPM - which is set by the prop control. I agree with snowsniper - poor Merlin!

 

I can nail take offs with gentle throttle opening. The rudder authority is excellent, so there is nothing to be gained by rapid power application.

 

I find a neutral elevator and elevator trim, neutral rudder, and a lot of right aileron works perfectly. The critical point is when the tail rises, but if you are ready for the swing that may occur, it isn't too hard to compensate. Do it right, and she just flies when she is ready.

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It's always the same with each new module I buy, and more than due to any fine tuning done by the Devs Team, I tend to believe that what pays, just as almost everything in our existence, is practice / experience...

 

When I picked the Spitfire, without having first opened the Manual, or even watch Matt's video, I crashed in a row simply trying to takeoff... Then I tried to taxi, gave up on using the slider in my T16000 for brake, and set the brake to both toe brakes in my Rudder ( Saitek Combat ), but soon noticed this was very unrealistic.

 

In IL.2 Battle of Stalingrad/Moscow I have the button 0 of the TS16000 set for brake, which works great with the VVS aircraft. That's what I ended up doing in the Spit... I managed to takeoff and then started training landings. Biggest problem is the very narrow undercarriage area, prone to wing-strikes...

 

Practice will get me there :-)

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I find a neutral elevator and elevator trim, neutral rudder, and a lot of right aileron works perfectly.

 

Makes you wonder why the real POH recommends different settings.

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This is quite interesting.

 

 

watch what happens and what he does with the stick from about 3.00 onwards.

 

and this one

 

 

on the rearward view you can see the elevators reacting to a stick forward movement to gat the tail up quick on the T/O roll. Both have stick hard right at the start of the T/O roll and ease it back to central position as the speed builds up.


Edited by bart

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Takeoffs with 100% assistance isn't that difficult for me but turn off (set to 0%) takeoff assistance and immediately I'm veering off course and scraping wing tips. I can't get any kind of nice forward momentum and it doesn't matter how much I adjust rudder trim and boost settings. One difficult bird to get moving down the runway respectably without assistance! :pilotfly:
Just follow what Wags told us in taxi and take off video. It's better, once you enter and line up, to full stop the aeroplane, hold the brakes (back stick to prevent nose over), prop pitch a tad back (~2800rpm), advance throttle to +4 boost (don't push pedals as you'll start to roll the side you push, that's how steering works!!), free brakes, watch your path and correct slightly if needed (with brakes short inputs, as you have no speed), once you're sure she's stable and centred in the runway under control gently push throttle to +8 and let stick forward smoothly. Before you realize you'll be airborne, and all that I said happens in a matter of a few seconds, that's the trick. Practice the procedure in your mind before taking off if you need so, in order to remember all the dance in the quick sequence you'll do it. I find better to use a bit nose down trim as she's willing to get airborne even before you should, and take care with quick stick inputs still at low altitudes as she's really sensitive.

 

It takes only a couple of take off to get used, she's just a bit different than everything we had before. It's a 30's design mates, like 109, she features her own quirks and twitches. That's real aeroplanes mates :thumbup:.

 

 

S

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This is what I do:

1. Set rudder trim so the word "STBD" is at the 3 O'clock position on the trim wheel.

2. Set the RPM lever about 1 inch back.

3. Set the pitch trim to neutral. Sometimes up one tick. Either or...

4. Taxi forward a bit to ensure the tail wheel is straight. *Very helpful*

5. No flaps.

6. Stick full right. I don't pull it back for takeoff, only for taxiing.

7. Jam the throttle to 3000rpm immediately.

8. Minor rudder adjustments.

9. When I feel the plane start to roll right I gingerly bring the stick to center.

10. Plane lifts off all by itself. Not kidding about this.

11. Maintain positive rate of climb to 140mph.

12. Bring throttle back to operating boost pressures.

13. Raise gear and have fun.

 

This is what is working for me.

 

Watch the boost pressure. You will blow the manifold and lock her up.

 

Landing...I suck at it still.

 

If anyone wants my curve settings for my Hog just let me know.

 

This was very helpful. I was getting off the ground, but using this it has become a lot better. Specifically stick full right and not back.

 

Still can't land the thing reliably.

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The throttle sets boost, not RPM - which is set by the prop control. I agree with snowsniper - poor Merlin!

 

I can nail take offs with gentle throttle opening. The rudder authority is excellent, so there is nothing to be gained by rapid power application.

 

I find a neutral elevator and elevator trim, neutral rudder, and a lot of right aileron works perfectly. The critical point is when the tail rises, but if you are ready for the swing that may occur, it isn't too hard to compensate. Do it right, and she just flies when she is ready.

 

We all have very different ways of flying. Your notes are much appreciated.

 

The RPM lever restricts your RPM, as in the Mustang, so you wont go into the red. I did state back off the throttle to lower boost.

 

I can see where this thread is going so I will bow out now. Good luck all. PM me if needed.

 

Ta!

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We all have very different ways of flying. Your notes are much appreciated.

 

The RPM lever restricts your RPM, as in the Mustang, so you wont go into the red. I did state back off the throttle to lower boost.

 

I can see where this thread is going so I will bow out now. Good luck all. PM me if needed.

 

Ta!

 

 

 

LOL.....You are a wise man.........

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Managed to takeoff without any assistance (I turned it off before even loading the module) on the second attempt, with no manual or reading on techniques. I'll tidy up and go from there.

 

From what I felt, technique is basically the same the 109K4 with a smattering of the 190D's wing down thrown in. Compenstate for and be aware of it and the Spit isn't too much of a handful.

 

I did spend a bit of time earlier in the year doing K4 take off's with the tailwheel unlocked (thanks Yo-Yo!) so I'm used to the free castering, but to be honest, it felt as if the Spit is easier to control on the take off run. It seems to have a slightly bigger window to catch and correct the turn than the K4 and the rudder has much more influence at low speed.

 

Power settings were ~2800 rpm, and 4lbs to start rolling and get straight, quickly up to 8lbs to actually begin the take off.


Edited by Buzzles
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I did one tutorial takeoff, and got up without too much trouble. I did notice the wings dipping rather easily, but I lightened up on the aileron input and got it balanced enough to get in the air.

 

My biggest problem was the elevator trim kept trying to put me into the ground. The "one notch down" looked to be too much.

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I found it to be harder with take off assistance. I thought it was off by default. Use your rudder pedals. Be very quick and gentle so that you don't scrape your wings. I sort of dance with my pedals. Shouldn't take too long to get the hang of it if you can do a take off with the 190

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I've been handling the Spitfire so far, on Take off, like I always have the 109. I had to learn how to take off with that beast early on.

 

I line up, then double check my surfaces.

RPM all the way forward. Add a smooth throttle to get her rolling.

Stick slightly back, and right. A little bit of right rudder.

Once she gets rolling, I add throttle as smooth as I can to 8 inches. I've found that at about this point, my rudder begins to respond. albeit not a lot until I let the stick go back neutral and get the tail off the deck.

Once tail comes up, I'm all rudder and I like to lean my body to the right...(Not sure why! Just helps me lol) and hold control positions as she leaves the surface.

Once I'm able to stabilize the rudder effect and kind of balance everything, I add a few inches of boost, then pull back the rpms to 2500. Once everything is flying well, I raise the gear and go....

 

I think that, honestly, learning on the 109 did make a difference. I'm sure it helped, but I did find myself doing some crabbing take offs at first in the Spit.

 

I'm not able to really land any of the prop planes with long straight approaches. I think that it gives me too much time to think about what's going on. I do the short, turn/falling approaches with A LOT of rudder on them all. I find that it helps me slow down very efficiently, and doesn't give me too much time to think myself into a burning hole in the ground. Plus, I like how it really shortens the field.

 

I think that if you work on the smooth throttle, and let your feet do their thing on the rudders, and let her fly, you'll be doing touch and go's in no time. Smooth throttle, be consistent and deliberate on the rudder, and let the tail come up all by itself, and then follow the stick instead of pushing or pulling it....she'll take herself off. She just needs you to make sure she stays up once she gets there!! Good luck

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