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Old 03-26-2020, 05:40 PM   #21
mrprime
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Purely anecdotally from my experience, but as it stands right now, given equal skill and starting conditions, I don't see how the Hornet loses to the Viper in BFM. I find the Viper underwhelming in close, it bleeds crazy amounts of energy with light manoeuvres and despite it's stated T/W seems I find it next to impossible to pick up speed again without having it straight and level.
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Old 03-26-2020, 06:13 PM   #22
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Its a very close match. In a BVR scenario i think the viper is superior as it can give more energy to its shots versus the hornet, it can also abandon the fight if he wants to. This only holds true for DCS, in real life the hornet built in jammer and more powerful radar can probably deny a first shot.

The hornet can in fact carry more amraams, this will let him "waste" long range shots to force the bandit defensive". That is a plus for him.

In a dogfight situation is just the better pilot who will win. In a CAC with both planes having 9x, the sutpidly crazy hornet nose ability (pulling the g override) will allow him a first shot in a neutral merge.

So for me: BVR 1 vs 1 F16, BVR against multiple bombers F18, CAC with 9X hornet, guns only dogfight (its just the better pilot) but maybe the F16.
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Old 03-26-2020, 06:54 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzU View Post
True but with this question both pilots need to have the same skill and experience. It's the only way to compare two planes.

It gets worse. Today pilot A might be on her game and own the engagement, tomorrow pilot B is feeling good and cleans house. The day after that it might change again.



Yes, a more capable aircraft may allow a pilot to get away with more mistakes in some cases. For my money (I own them both) they're a wash from the perspective of hardware. Pick one, own it, and spend the hours to get proficient.


The only reason I spend most of my time in the F-18 is the manly hook. The F-16 has a dainty little hook that, while cute, isn't very useful. Then again, given my lack of proficiency around the boat I'm not sure hook size matters. I just taxi up to the one wire most of the time, and I'm always left of center (yeah, the bloody runway moves sideways. I'm getting used to it.)
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:19 PM   #24
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The differences are pretty marginal, with lots of offsets, caveats, exceptions, pros, cons, and situational variations on both sides. But as most people are saying, I think the F/A-18 gets the nod for BVR engagements, and BFM goes to the F-16.

I do not believe there is a better dogfighter in DCS than the Viper. Which isn't making a grandiose statement of superiority or anything. It merely means that if you're flying the Viper and get your butt kicked in 1v1 BFM, you have no excuses.
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:31 PM   #25
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This is one of the more amusing threads I've read here in a while
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:39 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notso View Post
This is one of the more amusing threads I've read here in a while
You've discovered my motive for starting it.
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:40 PM   #27
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You've discovered my motive for starting it.

It was curiously specific. And a source of arguments long before DCS existed...
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:54 PM   #28
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Flare to land = squat to pee.
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Old 03-28-2020, 03:12 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VDV View Post
Exorcet, all that you are wrоte is totally wrong.

And you forget one engine...BOOM.

F-18 Wins. Sorry mate.
Two engines are not there to provide redundancy, but to provide better endurance with smaller cost in size, weight and fuel economy, than going for one bigger engine to get same benefits.
https://youtu.be/SsUCixAeZ0A

If you want highest possible endurance for the size, weight and fuel, then you go for single engine. But you will either restrict yourself to extremely tiny fuselage or very huge engine for larger fuselage.

And getting shot does no good if you have two engines close together, you likely bust both of them. That is one reason why F-14 and Su-27 has engines separated wider, regardless that there is big penalty if other is turned Off for the flight characteristics. Yes, you can survive back to home, but really only if you are not anymore in danger to be engaged or shot at.
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Old 03-28-2020, 03:16 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RampantCoyote View Post
I do not believe there is a better dogfighter in DCS than the Viper. Which isn't making a grandiose statement of superiority or anything. It merely means that if you're flying the Viper and get your butt kicked in 1v1 BFM, you have no excuses.
If you end up to WVR with Viper, you have no excuses.
If you lose to Viper in turning fight, you have no excuses.

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