[NO, NOT ACCURATE] ILS - ICLS airports

No the real F/A-18A and C have ILS as does the Superhornet. ACLS has channels, that is where the needles come from for carrier landings. ILS is for runways, entry should be frequency for ILS. Go AND TALK TO A REAL HORNET PILOT AND ASK HIM OR HER!!!:doh:

Read real manuals, find how the systems work, where and what equipment is fitted to the aircraft.

ILS

ILS localiser frequencies operate between 108.10 - 111.95 MHz with a emission pattern that looks like this:

The DCS Hornet does not have equipment compatible with ILS

ICLS

ICLS as found on the Stennis uses a scanning microwave beam, transmitted from a AN/SPN-41A radar that operates in the 15 GHz range using frequencies set over 20 channels. Position information (pulse pair timing) is received/decoded from the scanning beam by the AN/ARA-63 fitted to the Hornet, F-14, AV-8B and similar.

The beam has proportional information for +/- 6° and fly left/right info for +/- 20°

ACLS

ACLS as found on the Stennis uses a AN/SPN-42 radar operating at 33 GHz, a datalink to the aircraft i.e. link 4, and a radar beacon (9 GHz) fitted to the Hornet.

At approx 4NM the Hornet enters a radar 'gate' where the AN/SPN-42 is able to 'lock' onto the radar beacon, the carrier then transmits fly left/fly right proportional information to the Hornet via the data link. The pilot can fly the carrier command guidance manually or connect it to the auto-pilot so the aircraft flies it's self.

Comments

None of these systems are compatible with each other due to the different frequencies/equipment needed.

TACAN, ICLS and ACLS are often used together as a cross check, for fallback redundancy, usefulness at different ranges, etc., and is perhaps why you (@SUB17) think ACLS uses an ICLS channel.

ILS is ILS it is a standard requirement for all military aircraft particularly fast jets. It says ILS i:doh:n the cockpit. That is ILS and should work with all airfields, I don't know who the wanna be is that is lying to you guys but Hornets have ILS even the A version. So maybe send Wags to an Air Base and ask him to find out the ILS freq, climb into a jet with battery on and tune it.:joystick:

Who the Hell has been talking to your people?

ILS is ILS it is a standard requirement for all military aircraft particularly fast jets. It says ILS i:doh:n the cockpit. That is ILS and should work with all airfields, I don't know who the wanna be is that is lying to you guys but Hornets have ILS even the A version. So maybe send Wags to an Air Base and ask him to find out the ILS freq, climb into a jet with battery on and tune it.:joystick:

 

Who the Hell has been talking to your people?

No American Hornet or Super Hornets have ILS for civilian airfields. They only have ship compatible ICLS.

Exceptions are the Blue Angels, and expeditionary (non carrier) Growler squadrons. That’s It.

I don't know anything about the RW F/A-18 except the available info on the net like the -1 etc.

According to the -1 (US NAVY F/A18s) the ILS consists of the AN/ARA-63 on board equipment and it works only with the carrier based AN/SPN-41 equipment.

The -1 only mentions ILS and ACLS. Except for the deviation bar in the standby attitude indicator, ICLS is nowhere mentioned in the manual.

Maybe that's where the confusing results from...

No the real F/A-18A and C have ILS as does the Superhornet. ACLS has channels, that is where the needles come from for carrier landings. ILS is for runways, entry should be frequency for ILS. Go AND TALK TO A REAL HORNET PILOT AND ASK HIM OR HER!!!:doh:

ICLS and ILS require completely different equipment, they aren't just in different frequency bands, they require totally different communication sets.

ICLS and ILS require completely different equipment, they aren't just in different frequency bands, they require totally different communication sets.

Again, nowhere in the -1 systems description, procedures etc. is an ICLS mentioned, only ILS, that's (partially) the reason for the confusion IMO.

Again, nowhere in the -1 systems description, procedures etc. is an ICLS mentioned, only ILS, that's (partially) the reason for the confusion IMO.

Your right because the publicly available version of the manual calls it ILS when it references the the AN/ARA-63 however that's a nomenclature difference because it's referring to what we call ICLS and the receiver is not compatible with civil ILS microwave systems. The manual is not the end all be all, especially the outdated version you'll find out on the internet.

ILS is ILS it is a standard requirement for all military aircraft particularly fast jets. It says ILS i:doh:n the cockpit. That is ILS and should work with all airfields, I don't know who the wanna be is that is lying to you guys but Hornets have ILS even the A version. So maybe send Wags to an Air Base and ask him to find out the ILS freq, climb into a jet with battery on and tune it.:joystick:

 

Who the Hell has been talking to your people?

Nope. In this case you are wrong, Sorry.

Notice we have Ex US-Navy F-18 Pilots in this community (Lex for one) who have confirmed this.

The last time Subs dug in this hard he was arguing with an actual F-14 Pilot about flat spin techniques.

Ended up getting a good thread locked and he was proved wrong over and over. Shame there wasn’t anything learned out of that thread.....

ICLS and ILS require completely different equipment, they aren't just in different frequency bands, they require totally different communication sets.

ILS is a button on the UFC, ACLS is a button on the UFC. ILS should enter freq, ACLS should be for channels for ACLS. F-16 has ILS and you enter freq, Superhornet has the same. The F-14 and Harrier use preset channels which have to be setup prior to take off. So for the F-14 and Harrier they need in the ME the ability to select preset ILS channels which is a channel for a particular runway or aircraft carrier.

eg F-14 flying to Nellis would have channel 3 for Nellis ILS.

An F-16, Hornet or Superhornet, the pilots can enter the freq for the ILS on the UFC.

ILS is a button on the UFC, ACLS is a button on the UFC. ILS should enter freq, ACLS should be for channels for ACLS. F-16 has ILS and you enter freq, Superhornet has the same. The F-14 and Harrier use preset channels which have to be setup prior to take off. So for the F-14 and Harrier they need in the ME the ability to select preset ILS channels which is a channel for a particular runway or aircraft carrier.

eg F-14 flying to Nellis would have channel 3 for Nellis ILS.

An F-16, Hornet or Superhornet, the pilots can enter the freq for the ILS on the UFC.

The UFC says ILS. They didn’t want to write the four characters of ICLS.

The Hornet and Super Hornet do not have the ability to enter an ILS frequency. Only a channel for ICLS. Only exceptions: Blue Angels. Expeditionary Growler squadrons. That is it in the US.

You are declaring things to be true that aren’t. What is your source? You heard a guy tell you this? It’s ok for people to be misinformed, but you are repeatedly propagating falsehoods.

Why don’t you prove the things that you’re saying? I know that you can’t. But try to show us all that were wrong with proof.

Just give up, this guy is imune to reason, last time he was shown 3 distinct oficial manuals and was told so by a real pilot, but that wasnt good enough for his gut feeling, just dont feed the troll.

Your right because the publicly available version of the manual calls it ILS when it references the the AN/ARA-63 however that's a nomenclature difference because it's referring to what we call ICLS and the receiver is not compatible with civil ILS microwave systems. The manual is not the end all be all, especially the outdated version you'll find out on the internet.

I don't think that this has anything to do with outdated versions. The manuals I have are from 1997 and 2008 and the cockpit controls are also labelled ILS.

In the first 30 years MCD/Boeing called it ILS and the DCS Hornet is a 1998 version AFAIK. ILS is correct for the DCS Hornet. When did the Navy change the nomenclature?

The Super Hornet manual (2001) also says ILS. The only difference is that in the systems description is says ICLS instead of ILS, but the rest of the manual also refers to ILS.

Nevertheless I agree that arguing/explaining things to SUBS17 doesn't make any sense, since he apparently doesn't even read all the posts in this thread.

What about USMC Hornets? They operate in land based airfields, and should have ILS...

What about USMC Hornets? They operate in land based airfields, and should have ILS...

Should and do are different things.

Naval Air Stations often have land based radar equivalents to the SPN-41 (ICLS) and SPN-42/SPN-46 (ACLS) for compatibility and aircrew/ATC training.

The ARA-63 receiver/decoder dates from 1966 and there was a proposal for a Multi-mode ARN-138 upgrade (ICLS, MRAALS, ILS and MLS) in the late 80's but it's development was put 'on indefinite hold' in 1994 due to development of the Joint Precision Approach Landing System (JPALS), which is GPS based.

AFAIK, 25 years later, JPALS is still in development and the Hornet is due to receive LNAV certification for it's GPS.

What about USMC Hornets? They operate in land based airfields, and should have ILS...

Just like the Navy: No ILS.

All the complete but complicated explanations on how to use

Tacan and HSI, glideslope to barely come close to the efficiency of an ILS are fine.. BUT...

It is indeed VERY difficult to understand WHY ON EARTH the F-18 does not have an ILS...

Especially already having on board an ICLS for the carrier.

The a-10 C. Mirage 2000, C-101, and if I am not mistaken, the upcoming F-16 have it....

The a-10 C. Mirage 2000, C-101, and if I am not mistaken, the upcoming F-16 have it....

Hmm... I wonder how many of those aircraft you listed have been in service with the US Navy:unsure: I wonder if that might be a clue. LOL:doh:

Most non-carrier F-18s have ILS for land bases (Other airforces like the Swiss for instance and the Blue Angels etc). The F-18 specifically modelled in DCS is a Carrier aircraft, it ONLY has ICLS and not a conventional land ILS system.

This may not make sense to you but these are the facts as confirmed by multiple real US Navy F-18 Aircrew.

Hmm... I wonder how many of those aircraft you listed have been in service with the US Navy:unsure: I wonder if that might be a clue. LOL:doh:

 

Most non-carrier F-18s have ILS for land bases (Other airforces like the Swiss for instance and the Blue Angels etc). The F-18 specifically modelled in DCS is a Carrier aircraft, it ONLY has ICLS and not a conventional land ILS system.

 

This may not make sense to you but these are the facts as confirmed by multiple real US Navy F-18 Aircrew.

I barely understand.. Even if the F-18 specifically modelled in DCS is a Carrier aircraft, so it is supposed to land with ILS (ICLS) only on carriers? What about landing on a land base with 0 visibility? And to answer your question... Does not the F-16 serve in the Navy?

Flight planning would dictate an alternate airport with better visibility. ILS isn’t the only approach airplanes can fly. TACAN approaches can get you down below the clouds where you can fly the rest of the approach visually.

F-16N are Aggressor aircraft only. Not many of them flying.

What about landing on a land base with 0 visibility?

A normal ILS is only CAT I which means at least 800m horizontal visibility and at least 200ft vertical. That's a well above 0 visibility.

With a VOR/TACAN approach you need at least a 300ft vertical visibility so the difference between a CAT I ILS and a TACAN approach is only 100ft.

If the weather is really bad the 200ft CAT I minimum is quite often still too high and you need to descend below 100ft to establish visual contact.

Does not the F-16 serve in the Navy?

F16 like the A10 is Air Force... No it does not serve in the US Navy.

F16 like the A10 is Air Force... No it does not serve with the US Navy.

The A/B models did. https://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=1100&tid=1150&ct=1

And the F-16N (F-16C/D block 30) of course.

Non-precision approaches are fine when airports have tacan, and creating waypoints for a GNSS approach is dull but also works, I would apreciate a feature such as ILS option, could be on special options or something

F16 like the A10 is Air Force... No it does not serve with the US Navy.

????????????

https://www.google.com/search?q=does+the+f-16+fly+with+the+navy&rlz=1C1CHBD_enCH818CH818&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj1kfbo0svjAhUt6KYKHS5OAB8Q_AUIDCgA&biw=2560&bih=1336&dpr=1.5