VPC Configurator Software

45 minutes ago, imacken said:

If you’re looking to configure the detents on the CM3, you don’t need virtual any more with the new software. Here is a guide I have posted over in the Virpil forums - more than once!

Virpil Throttle Detent Setup
1)    Idle detent.
a.    The new versions of VPC software have a new way of defining the detents with buttons for off/idle.  We will just concentrate on the idle detent, as DCS does not have buttons for activating the afterburners.
b.    To configure the idle detent, it is necessary to do several steps.
c.    Firstly, in the axis settings page, change the calibration to ‘Both Detents’.
d.    Place the stick in the off position – fully aft - and input the raw value in the ‘Axis begin’ box by double clicking. The value will be entered automatically.  Also, enter ‘0’ in the ‘output %’ box, then
e.    Place the stick in the idle position (just past the 1st detent) and input the raw value into the ‘Detent #1’ by the same method above.  Also input ‘0’ - yes, 0 again! - in the ‘output %’ field.  I also recommend a ‘Deadzone %’ of 5 for Detent #1 to compensate for the handle movement when going past the physical detent.
f.    Do ‘Axis end’ and ‘Detent #2’ in the same way. (See below for ‘Detent #2 advice.)
g.    Then, you have to define the idle off virtual button. (This is also done in a new way to before.)  Firstly, note the ‘Axis begin’ and ‘Detent #1’ raw values, 29423 and 29905 in my case.
h.    Do this for both axes (inputting the appropriate values for each!).
i.    Go to the Axis page in VPC software, and look at the ‘Axis to button’ section.
j.    Select your axis – 1 for rX and 2 for rY, in my case – and then under ‘Type’ select ‘hardware’. Then enter the ‘Range from’ and ‘Range to’ values so that your raw values between the off and 1st detent are included. For the above values, I would input 29400 and 29800 to allow for a margin of error.
k.    REMEMBER TO ‘SAVE VPC DEVICE’ for any of these changes to take effect!
l.    If you then go to the Button page in VPC Configurator, you can see what physical button the software has allocated your 2 new buttons to, and then give them logical buttons that you can then bind to for off/idle in DCS. (Each module has slightly different naming and binds for this, but it works well for all for me, but you do have to make the correct choices for the binding in DCS.)
2)    Afterburner detent.
a.    The purpose of setting this a value in Detent #2 in VPC Configurator is twofold. Firstly, to correct the discrepancies in the throttle outputs when they are not bound together by the axis lock lever, and secondly, to coordinate the afterburner kick in spot in DCS.
b.    Looking at each one in turn, firstly, if an output value for the position at the second detent is not set, you will see that the 2 axes have different output values throughout the throw, but easy to see when both are at the 2nd detent.  (In my case, the left is 67% and the right is 70%).  This discrepancy can cause issues in-game with the imbalance. It is adjusted to the lower of the two when the axes are hardware linked, but still, this is a better solution.  When you set a – same for both axes - value for the 2nd detent in VPC software that issue disappears.  This is done by inputting the desired value into the ‘Detent#2 Input’ and ‘Output %’ boxes of the axis setting tab in VPC Configurator.  (You put the stick at the 2nd detent and double click in the input box. The raw value at that point will automatically be filled in.  Also, put in the required output %age in the appropriate box. In the above example, 67% would probably be the optimal value, but see next step.)
c.    Secondly, syncing with DCS for the afterburner kick-in point.  In my experience, leaving this at default means that the axes are not sufficiently advanced in DCS to fire the afterburner at the original output level when just going past the 2nd detent. (In my case it is 67% with both axes linked.)  So, in order to fix this, it is necessary to find what your output level is to match that required by DCS to fire the ABs.  This is largely trial and error, and in my case it is 74%.  This works well for Hornet, Viper, F-5E, Viggen, etc. The only one that still had a slight delay was the Mirage, but I was OK with that.  When you get the correct value for the output level input to VPC Configurator, the afterburners kick in just past the 2nd detent, and it feels much better.
d.    Now, the other thing you have to do, is adjust the planes that don’t have afterburners, e.g. Harrier, A-10C, warbirds, etc., to allow to you have the full travel between detents, rather than having to go past the 2nd detent to get full throttle.  You do this by adjusting the ‘Saturation X’ in Axis Tune for each module affected to the value you set above, in my case 74%.
 

I hope you find it useful. 

I used that guide when setting my CM3 up after the new firmware update. It was most awesome and easy to do! How you figured all that out though is beyond my comprehension! Many kudos for this!

@imacken My goodness that is so comprehensive. Excellent that you took the time to post that information here. Sorry I did not see it on the Virpil forum. That  @dburne reckons the information so good is like a star of approval ! I really appreciate your posting, I was starting to fear that I was not going to succeed in getting the best from the CM3.... now I look forward to applying your technique this morning... I will grab a coffee and get on with it. Thank you again.

Update: Well, success ! As an aside, I must repeat what has been said elsewhere in response to various posts of yours - I just don't know how you manage to figure that all out - but damn I am glad you did and that you are happy to share that in your posts. Thanks again. 

I do hope that the Virpil folk get their documentation updated to match the software. Its a trap for new users when doco and YT vids address old versions - something, for me at least, to watch out for.

@imacken Thanks once again for all the useful info. SOOOO nice to be able to setup the proper throttle mapping in VPC software and not have to mess with curves in DCS for each aircraft. 

One question though, it seems like most aircraft have off/idle control options but the A-10C does not? It only has individual Engine Start / EngineStop unless I am missing an Action somewhere? So basically off/idle is a toggle but the A-10C II needs specific Start and Stop binds?

I don't really mind just setting up Axis to Buttons for both Start and Stop (Off and Idle) since I have plenty available but wanted to make sure I wasn't just missing a toggle action I can use for the A-10C II.

Someone should really make a video for the CM3 showing exactly what you described. The ability to remap the throttle % values to 0% at the idle position with the physical detent and fine tune your AB % with the physical detent right within VPC is just excellent. I love that you can still have axis to button setup with raw hardware values instead of just throttle % so you can have still have that mapped to 0% at idle. Going to save so much time settling up different aircraft.

Hi, yes, the A-10C and A-10c II work the same. The bind you need is 'Left/Right Engine Throttle OFF'.  Works the same as off/idle in others. Not sure why it has a different name.

12 hours ago, imacken said:

Hi, yes, the A-10C and A-10c II work the same. The bind you need is 'Left/Right Engine Throttle OFF'.  Works the same as off/idle in others. Not sure why it has a different name.

Excellent thank you. Maybe some day they can unify the naming off all this a bit. I was looking for off/idle so must have missed it.

On 4/5/2022 at 3:57 PM, Dallas88B said:

@imacken My goodness that is so comprehensive. Excellent that you took the time to post that information here. Sorry I did not see it on the Virpil forum. That  @dburne reckons the information so good is like a star of approval ! I really appreciate your posting, I was starting to fear that I was not going to succeed in getting the best from the CM3.... now I look forward to applying your technique this morning... I will grab a coffee and get on with it. Thank you again.

Update: Well, success ! As an aside, I must repeat what has been said elsewhere in response to various posts of yours - I just don't know how you manage to figure that all out - but damn I am glad you did and that you are happy to share that in your posts. Thanks again. 

I do hope that the Virpil folk get their documentation updated to match the software. Its a trap for new users when doco and YT vids address old versions - something, for me at least, to watch out for.

 

Yeah I think that is just the nature of updating stuff quickly on a regular basis. They should definitely go through all the details in videos once they have the software in a place they are happy with.

Once you have done it once it actually makes perfect sense and is easy to do. They really just need to have someone on the Virpil software team to update the documentation whenever they make changes.

On 4/5/2022 at 6:57 PM, Dallas88B said:

@imacken My goodness that is so comprehensive. Excellent that you took the time to post that information here. Sorry I did not see it on the Virpil forum. That  @dburne reckons the information so good is like a star of approval ! I really appreciate your posting, I was starting to fear that I was not going to succeed in getting the best from the CM3.... now I look forward to applying your technique this morning... I will grab a coffee and get on with it. Thank you again.

Update: Well, success ! As an aside, I must repeat what has been said elsewhere in response to various posts of yours - I just don't know how you manage to figure that all out - but damn I am glad you did and that you are happy to share that in your posts. Thanks again. 

I do hope that the Virpil folk get their documentation updated to match the software. Its a trap for new users when doco and YT vids address old versions - something, for me at least, to watch out for.

 

Congrats!!

I think I like the way I set up the CM3 throttle better. The weakness of imacken's approach is you are signing up to only use the travel between the detents for the mdoules that don't need it. Virpil have so nicely provided an easily swappable detent system that can be placed or removed probably faster than it takes to load into a mission, so I think it should be used. The only problem? Even if you physically remove the detents, you haven't configured the axes values any different to not include idle/off positions. The solution I went for adds two virtual axes that are only active in a shift state (2nd mode) on the joystick. I won't be as detailed unelss there's a lot of interest but here's some general details how I operate:

• When I fly helis or anything with no detents installed, I'm in mode A. The throttle axes values are on the full range.
• When I fly a jet with engine idle/cutoff detent in, and possibly my preferered afterburner detent (or not for A-10) in, I'm in mode B.
• This approach won't work if you need different jets tied to different shift modes. You can have more than one shift mode for jets because the full travel is always available on all shift modes.
  • If you're using shift modes to control different button presses in DCS, I'd suggest moving off of shift modes and using modifiers in game for a latched switch or  mode dial (your preference).
• Though I have little high fidelity jet experience other than drilling their cold start procedures, this set up worked with F/A-18, F-16, and F-15C without adjustment in terms of activating the afterburner at the right point when I used the Classic Detent+ pushed as far up as it goes. Afterburner is never triggered if I don't use the finger lift, and it is never shutoff if I come down to the soft detent position in-afterburner. I don't see myself needing to be picky about exact activation point in or out as long as it's clearly between the two.
• Before afterburner, I do see a discrepancy that someone else has reported where typically one throttle stick will see 66% and the other 68%. Again, i haven't tested significantly but I don't foresee this causing any problems.

General steps:

1. Create two new axes to mirror each of the throttle axes (neet to use the same sensor type; main port, sub port, and
2. Calibrate the entire joystick again after axes creation
3. Go to each axes' configuration and set begin an end input values based on the min position right before idle-cutoff, and the max position pushed through to max (through afterburner if that detent is in). Set the shift mode to something.
4. Assign button to activate the shift mode.
5. On the same shift mode, use existing tutorials to set up engine off/idle/start buttons (2 buttons per axes) so the same jet mode will work for all jet engine start procedures -> even FC3.
   1. Note: the off-idle/start buttons you assign to low throttle need to be applied to the original axes not the new ones. The new ones won't cover values on the low detent travel range at all.
   2. This is also why the original full travel axes has to remain on and should NOT be put on any shift mode. Only one shift mode is active at a time 
6. In DCS you can no longer use the Axis Assign auto-detect functionality and have to assign manually because when you physically move your stick in jet mode, DCS will see both the original axis and the shifted one move and won't be able to tell which you want. 

After writing this guide, I thought through the two shift mode limit I have with my set up realize that I shouldn't be using the 5-way mode dial for just two positions. I I can use T1 or T2 and free up that mode dial for a dial entirely! Happy flying every jet or heli with only moments to swap between!

To use the old cliché, whatever works for you is what's right for you.  Personally, the idea of adjusting/removing/replacing etc. the physical detents and shift states etc. every time I changed module types is too much hassle.  'My' method works really nicely, and your comment about restricting the movement for modules that don't use AB is kind of a moot point.  I mean in practice, that makes no difference, and you're only using the section between detents for jets with AB in normal use all the time anyway.

Also, your point about discrepancies in throttle %ages is easily resolved in the software, and is completely eliminated when the throttles are linked anyway, which they are almost all the time when flying jets, except for start up.

On 7/13/2022 at 1:23 AM, imacken said:

To use the old cliché, whatever works for you is what's right for you.

Apologize for the percieved jab. Let's distill the offerings and I'll be a bit more careful to not add characterization. Only a matter of choices and preferences:

Your approach is designed around having a singular configuration for all aircraft and helis. The convenience is zero effort on your device while switching. Players can add/remove afterburner detents if they wish, or leave them on between fixed wing aircraft. The throttle/collective travel for all aircraft is 0% before bottom detent start (while pulling back), and 100% after the afterburner (pushing forward).

My approach is for those who are wanting and willing to change, add, or remove detents when they switch aircraft and they want to maximize stick travel (particularly for helis) reclaiming off-idle-start space at low end of the throttle. As with the other set up, removal of afterburner detents is optional between fixed wing aircraft.

Is that better?

Sorry, there was no jibe taken, or need to make your point ‘better’. I was simply saying that whatever works best for you is what is right for you.

I have my idle detent set so that there is just barely enough room for the roller to drop in behind it and I have afterburner detent set with the tactile bump so that I can ignore it if it's not applicable. This gives maximum versatility without messing with detents (getting the AB detent back into the same position each time seems like a nightmare...)

Yes, it gives up a tiny bit of throttle travel for modules/games that don't use the idle detent but it's very small. I fly a bunch of different modules and use my pit for other games as well (and have a collective) so messing with the detents doesn't seem worthwhile for that extra little bit of travel. If you fly one module exclusively for months (some people do seem to) then YMMV.

Hi,

Perhaps someone can help me. I  had E1 and E2 configured for com1 and com2. When you turn the dials you change the volume, when you push and turn them you change the channel.

I had to update everything and had to remap & redo everything. But I can't remember how I made the push of E1/2 switch appear as modifier in DCS. Can anyone that knows please send me a PM? Thanks!!

As I replied to your query in the other thread:

Yes, you just go to DCS Controls, click on Modifier, add in your E1 and E2 press buttons, then just bind the modifier and the cw/ccw turn on E1/E2 and you have what you want to do.

The last date on the manual post is June 19, 2019. Is this the current one? 

I'm amazed everyone thinks TARGET software is difficult.... GUI portion is child's play compared to VPCs. I'm going to get the #2 and #3 CB's and the the CM3 base, then the CM3 throttle. Keeping the TMWH HOTAS, BlackHog and GVL trim box on the current computer setup. The wife doesn't know so I'll hunt down who ever spills the beans.......

Cheers

Hoss

I've got to say that having spent roughly 1000 Euros on Virpil gear about a year ago I'm more than a little disappointed with the lack of useful documentation for the software. It's great kit, but it's only great if you can take advantage of all of its features, and sadly the software to make that possible is virtually impossible to decipher. I messaged their support team a few days ago asking if they had any plans to update the documentation (such as it is), and this is the response I got:

"Sorry about that. Currently we are working on the manual update. Unfortunately I don't know when it will be finished and uploaded. If you need an assistance please let me know."

It's a bit of a let down.

16 hours ago, frostycab said:

I've got to say that having spent roughly 1000 Euros on Virpil gear about a year ago I'm more than a little disappointed with the lack of useful documentation for the software. It's great kit, but it's only great if you can take advantage of all of its features, and sadly the software to make that possible is virtually impossible to decipher. I messaged their support team a few days ago asking if they had any plans to update the documentation (such as it is), and this is the response I got:

"Sorry about that. Currently we are working on the manual update. Unfortunately I don't know when it will be finished and uploaded. If you need an assistance please let me know."

It's a bit of a let down.

 

There are some pretty knowledgeable folks over on the Virpil forums that can be quite helpful with this.

16 hours ago, frostycab said:

I've got to say that having spent roughly 1000 Euros on Virpil gear about a year ago I'm more than a little disappointed with the lack of useful documentation for the software. It's great kit, but it's only great if you can take advantage of all of its features, and sadly the software to make that possible is virtually impossible to decipher. I messaged their support team a few days ago asking if they had any plans to update the documentation (such as it is), and this is the response I got:

"Sorry about that. Currently we are working on the manual update. Unfortunately I don't know when it will be finished and uploaded. If you need an assistance please let me know."

It's a bit of a let down.

 

If you’ve got any specific issues, then just post them here or in the Virpil forums. 

I currently have the CM3 Throttle set up with the 5 way selector switch to give me options on the 6 adjacent buttons, I want to change it to be recognised as a 5 way switch but it looks like I have to set up all the axis again which is easier said than done. Am I missing something, is there no way to copy all the axis data and then create a new profile with the 5 way switch and import all the axis data again. Any help welcome

Are you talking about ‘real’ axes, or virtual axes? I don’t see any reason why it should make any difference to real axes. 

11 hours ago, Oilman100 said:

I currently have the CM3 Throttle set up with the 5 way selector switch to give me options on the 6 adjacent buttons, I want to change it to be recognised as a 5 way switch but it looks like I have to set up all the axis again which is easier said than done. Am I missing something, is there no way to copy all the axis data and then create a new profile with the 5 way switch and import all the axis data again. Any help welcome

So you currently have the 5 way mode switch configured as a modifier to B1-B6 buttons but you want the 5 way mode switch to work as 5 separate buttons (without modifying B1-B6 buttons)? But you don't want to create a new profile and re-configure everything, including axis from the scratch?
 

If I understood you correctly then you need to:

1: Configure 5 physical buttons of the 5 way mode switch as 5 logical buttons. In default profile there are logic buttons of that switch.

2. Delete Shift states.

3. Delete logic buttons for B1-B6 buttons in different shift states and only leave buttons with OFF shift states.

I don't think if you can easily "copy and paste" some part of a profile to another profile. Maybe it's possible to do so by manually editing XML profile file but I am no programmer so I don't know how's it's done, if it can be done at all.

11 minutes ago, Qsenox said:

So you currently have the 5 way mode switch configured as a modifier to B1-B6 buttons but you want the 5 way mode switch to work as 5 separate buttons (without modifying B1-B6 buttons)? But you don't want to create a new profile and re-configure everything, including axis from the scratch?
 

If I understood you correctly then you need to:

1: Configure 5 physical buttons of the 5 way mode switch as 5 logical buttons. In default profile there are logic buttons of that switch.

2. Delete Shift states.

3. Delete logic buttons for B1-B6 buttons in different shift states and only leave buttons with OFF shift states.

 

I don't think if you can easily "copy and paste" some part of a profile to another profile. Maybe it's possible to do so by manually editing XML profile file but I am no programmer so I don't know how's it's done, if it can be done at all.

Yep this is correct interpretation, I’ll try today the above as it looks straight forward

Yes, @Qsenox is correct, but I'd love to know why changing this will affect your axes setup.  It shouldn't affect 'real' axes at all. It could affect axis to button configs because of the extra new logical buttons which might put your additional axis to buttons out of sequence, but not the real ones.

29 minutes ago, Oilman100 said:

Yep this is correct interpretation, I’ll try today the above as it looks straight forward

@Oilman100
I forgot to mention that you need to export current profile into XML file (export profile to file button in vpc software) before making any changes, just in case something goes wrong

21 minutes ago, imacken said:

It shouldn't affect 'real' axes at all. It could affect axis to button configs because of the extra new logical buttons which might put your additional axis to buttons out of sequence, but not the real ones.

Apparently he has a lot of axis related configs (virtual axis, axis to button etc) that he doesn't want to lose to a new profile creation.

11 hours ago, Qsenox said:

So you currently have the 5 way mode switch configured as a modifier to B1-B6 buttons but you want the 5 way mode switch to work as 5 separate buttons (without modifying B1-B6 buttons)? But you don't want to create a new profile and re-configure everything, including axis from the scratch?
 

If I understood you correctly then you need to:

1: Configure 5 physical buttons of the 5 way mode switch as 5 logical buttons. In default profile there are logic buttons of that switch.

2. Delete Shift states.

3. Delete logic buttons for B1-B6 buttons in different shift states and only leave buttons with OFF shift states.

 

I don't think if you can easily "copy and paste" some part of a profile to another profile. Maybe it's possible to do so by manually editing XML profile file but I am no programmer so I don't know how's it's done, if it can be done at all.

Working perfectly, many thx