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F-14B : OPERATION CAGE THE BEAR


kaba

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The long-awaited cold start version has also now been included.

Co-op version to follow as soon as possible.

Great to hear :thumbup:

Intel i7-12700K @ 8x5GHz+4x3.8GHz + 32 GB DDR5 RAM + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

 

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

First of all thanks for creating this campaign!

Now I would like to say that Mission 3 got very frustrating for me. I have tried it several times from cold and dark. The last time I really tried hard, but before I could attack the airfield two bandits took off from that airfield. Me and my wingman could kill them, but then another group appeared, while we were engaged and I think there was a third group coming for us as well. There was no time to drop a single bomb. In the end I had to quit that mission, because my frames came down to 3-6 FPS and I had really bad stutters even though my CPU, RAM and GPU were not working at their capacities at all. Probably some lua script is causing that lag.

Anyway, I just wished there was some escort, because in reality even a Tomcat group on a bomber mission would not operate without some escort in this kind of situation. If you are lucky, then the bandits do not get too close to you before you drop your bombs, but luck is not a good thing to rely on.

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First of all thanks for creating this campaign!

Now I would like to say that Mission 3 got very frustrating for me. I have tried it several times from cold and dark. The last time I really tried hard, but before I could attack the airfield two bandits took off from that airfield. Me and my wingman could kill them, but then another group appeared, while we were engaged and I think there was a third group coming for us as well. There was no time to drop a single bomb. In the end I had to quit that mission, because my frames came down to 3-6 FPS and I had really bad stutters even though my CPU, RAM and GPU were not working at their capacities at all. Probably some lua script is causing that lag.

Anyway, I just wished there was some escort, because in reality even a Tomcat group on a bomber mission would not operate without some escort in this kind of situation. If you are lucky, then the bandits do not get too close to you before you drop your bombs, but luck is not a good thing to rely on.

Hey Tiramisu - thanks for the feedback. Sounds like you're having trouble with the 3rd mission, it's a tough one. For me the trick is timing - getting in late enough that SEAD mission is complete, but quick enough that any hostile CAP can't catch you.

 

 

Annoying about the performance issue - a few people are having similar issues. I can confirm I've got no scripting running in the mission, only standard triggers. This sounds like a bug with either DCS or the tomcat. Do you have a track file we could look at?

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Hmmm... I will try, but probably I will fail, because the window of opportunity is small even when you are lucky. I am able to drop bombs on two or three grounded aircraft in only one bombrun in order to be as quick as possible, but in the end the bandits catch up after I have dropped 2-8 bombs. In one of my tries I almost made it, but then I had about 6 bandits on my back until one of them killed me after pursuing me for about 40 miles.

Honestly, I was thinking about taking 2-4 phoenix missiles instead of the sparrows to deal with the bandits. That seems more suitable for this kind of mixed mission.

 

This sounds like a bug with either DCS or the tomcat. Do you have a track file we could look at?

 

Yes, of course. Here is the tacview replay: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ienor8k8oa_mfP5W63qEm9AcKXcjndJh/view?usp=sharing

There were some framedrops already when I was engaging the first bandit, but the biggest lags started when I was starting to attack the second group at around 00:37:30 in that trackfile. It became a real slideshow without getting any better.

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Honestly, I was thinking about taking 2-4 phoenix missiles instead of the sparrows to deal with the bandits. That seems more suitable for this kind of mixed mission.

It's very rare config to mix Phoenix with bombs although I found one:

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Fea1/101-200/Fea198-F-14B-Kettenis/Fea1981.jpg

 

 

Like others said the idea behind mission #3 is the right timing. Get there in time, do one or two quick drops and get the hell out.

 

 

btw: Kaba, can you look into the later missions with KC-135MPRS tanker being high and slow? You can read the discussion on the forum lately:

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4097246&postcount=212

🖥️ Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060   🥽 Rift S   🕹️ T16000M HOTAS   ✈️ FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E   ⚙️ CA   🚢 SC   🌐 NTTR, PG, Syria

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Tiramisu if it helps you here is my playthrough of mission #3

 

I think there is time for one or max two bomb passes if you are quick.

 

sTbKcEREc0k

 

Very well flown! :thumbup:

At first both of us have the same timing when leaving WP 1, but this changes after you got spiked by the SA-10. You do not crank like I do and apparently you even catch up with the SEAD-group. Isn't that very dangerous? In my tacview replays I saw that the whole SEAD-group got splashed by the SA-10.

 

It's very rare config to mix Phoenix with bombs although I found one:

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Fea1/101-200/Fea198-F-14B-Kettenis/Fea1981.jpg

 

Yeah, but this mission is so dangerous that you need an unconventional payload. :D Like you guys said, it is better to make only one or two bomb runs, which only requires 4 bombs for me, because I do not need to use the ripple mode for those large vulnerable targets. So the other stations can be used for Phoenixes.

Btw. does it make any difference how many or which kind of targets you bomb?


Edited by Tiramisu
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Nothing is dangerous when you are in Tomcat :)

 

I remember SEAD got SA-10 very nicely so when I arrived at enemy airport it was gone - just stack of smoke. So one to quick passes to release bombs and run for safety. You are not supposed to dogfight in this mission.


Edited by ataribaby
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Meh, I got splashed by the SA-10. The SEAD group made their Magnum-call pretty much 2 minutes before I got splashed, so even though they had a long time available to destroy the SAM, the HARM missiles did not reach the SA-10 radar in time before its missile reached me.

I think the timing in this mission must be calculated very exactly in order to accomplish what it is designed for. Simply loitering at waypoint 1 until 16:14 and then flying towards waypoint 2 is no guarantee to survive the SA-10 safely. So we would need a prebriefed and precise time to destination to waypoint 2.

Since we don't have it, it is safer for me, when I wait long enough like I used to do. The bandits should be no problem, if I take 4 Phoenixes. That will still allow me to carry 6 bombs in my tomcat.


Edited by Tiramisu
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@Tiramisu: Do you ingress low as you're supposed to? Even if you're there too soon stay away from SA-10 as long as it is operational. I remember a mountain nearby, you can hide there if you're being locked. Cut the Phoenix idea. It's not only fighters but there's also mobile SA-6 that'll prevent you from further bombing runs.

 

 

@Nealius: just 10 on RWR.

🖥️ Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060   🥽 Rift S   🕹️ T16000M HOTAS   ✈️ FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E   ⚙️ CA   🚢 SC   🌐 NTTR, PG, Syria

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The SA-6 is always present when you arrive there, no matter how early or how late you are. Actually the presence of SAMs in the area makes it more important to use Phoenixes, because you can launch them and then fly defensive against the SAMs. When I defended myself with sparrows I either broke lock too early or I got splashed by a SAM.

 

@Tiramisu: Do you ingress low as you're supposed to? Even if you're there too soon stay away from SA-10 as long as it is operational. I remember a mountain nearby, you can hide there if you're being locked.

 

In my first few trials I actually ingressed low like the mission briefing told me, but near the SA-10 the terrain becomes more flat. By the time I arrived there, I could only mask my approach behind small hills, which is not totally safe. Also it takes time to crank defensive against the SA-10, which decreases your time advantage and costs valuable fuel.

 

The real problem is not my altitude I believe. It is finding out the optimal timing to ingress, which has become a cumbersome trial and error for me. So instead I will rely on good old Phoenixes. If you use them correctly, you can splash 2-4 bandits in one go.

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So instead I will rely on good old Phoenixes.

It's your game - you can play it however you want but it was not the point of that mission. Maybe the recent changes made it different - I'd have to play it again and see.

🖥️ Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060   🥽 Rift S   🕹️ T16000M HOTAS   ✈️ FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E   ⚙️ CA   🚢 SC   🌐 NTTR, PG, Syria

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It's very rare config to mix Phoenix with bombs although I found one:

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Fea1/101-200/Fea198-F-14B-Kettenis/Fea1981.jpg

 

 

Like others said the idea behind mission #3 is the right timing. Get there in time, do one or two quick drops and get the hell out.

 

 

btw: Kaba, can you look into the later missions with KC-135MPRS tanker being high and slow? You can read the discussion on the forum lately:

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4097246&postcount=212

 

Not true whatsoever- in OEF and OIF Tomcats flew with an AIM-54 until the air threat was confirmed gone- the AIM-54 was retired in 2004 and the Tomcat did its last cruise without it

VF-2 Bounty Hunters

 

https://www.csg-1.com/

DCS F-14 Pilot/RIO Discord:

https://discord.gg/6bbthxk

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Maybe the recent changes made it different - I'd have to play it again and see.

I tried again yesterday and failed :) Indeed, the mission was changed lately and is not exactly like I remember it and also different than shown in ataribaby vid (nice fly btw).

 

I arrived behind the DEAD flight, SA-10 was still active, so I had to defend, Wingman crashed during the maneuvers, after SA-10 was down, I tried to run the attack, but the bandits scramble from Maykop now and eventually got me... I should've RTB IRL.

 

 

🖥️ Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060   🥽 Rift S   🕹️ T16000M HOTAS   ✈️ FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E   ⚙️ CA   🚢 SC   🌐 NTTR, PG, Syria

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Thanks for your field report, draconus! Maybe Kaba will consider adjusting this mission a little bit now. In my opinion it is sufficient if he uses four Phoenixes for the preset loadout of this mission. No other changes are needed. I was able to splash 3 bandits and maneuver kill another bandit only using my Phoenixes and win this mission on my first attempt without really needing my wingman. Also I had enough time dropping my 6 bombs. It was really fun. :)


Edited by Tiramisu
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Thanks for the comments . If you could send over a few tacviews from your recent attempts it would be helpful. A lot of time went into getting balance right so it would be best to know which areas are challenging you the most before I make changes.

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I was successful last night and I'm against Phoenix load for this mission (#3).

 

Like usual ingress low over mountains from WP1, behind the SEAD flight, keeping distance from SA-10 until it goes down, bandits took off from far away bases this time, then quick bomb run (risky because of SA-6 active), ordered Wingman to do his run too, then quick AB egress, Colt and ships engaged bandits following us

 

Kaba, are the Maykop bandits random or triggerred in some way?

 

btw: It is indeed BigBird/ClamShell SA-10, Nealius.


Edited by draconus

🖥️ Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060   🥽 Rift S   🕹️ T16000M HOTAS   ✈️ FC3, F-14A/B, F-15E   ⚙️ CA   🚢 SC   🌐 NTTR, PG, Syria

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Air threats are random. Sa6 is timer triggered. AAA and MANPADS switch on in stages if you spend too long loitering.

 

Air threats are a new inclusion. Reason for this change is the feedback from first version that this mission was too easy and a bit stale.

 

I'm not going to change loadout to phoenixes. If the air threat is consistently too heavy to the extent that this is not coming across as a fun mission then I am happy to tweak - but i need your tacviews or more specific feedback (preferably both).

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  • 3 weeks later...

Pretty new to DCS, First real flight sim, been flying the Tomcat primarily. Felt I was ready to tackle some missions.

 

Mission 1, once I understood what I had to do, no biggie. Fly CAP, Kill bombers and fighters, RTB.

 

Mission 2, protect strike forces. Little harder, but again, no biggie.

 

Mission 3, oh lordy. Shit just got real. Fly in, bomb airfield, bug out. Took me about 6 tries. First 5 ended in disaster. 6th attempt, I get a couple bombs on target, BUT my starboard engine is shot to pieces. I get the option to call RTB so I do and head for the coast. Problem 2, no nav on the VDI or the HUD or HDD. The Compass is all I got left. So I snake my way through the mountains but I'm hemorrhaging fuel. Starboard thrust lever all the way back, and into idle. Port engine at half thrust, and the fuel flow stabilized. Jester and my RWR are SCREAMING radar spikes and popups looking for me. Snaking through the mountains.... finally.... OCEAN! Where's the carrier..... radio..... dead. ****! and then I notice the TACAN arrow in the heading indicator.... Jester you BEAUTY! I jettison my remaining bombs, missiles and tanks, and limp home.... 2000 lbs.... 1500 lbs.... 1000 lbs..... WHERE IS THAT GODDAMN BOAT!! And then..... Is that?.... IT IS! 700 lbs of fuel left.... I line up, drop gear, drop hook, flaps,...... STALLING! MORE POWER! BUT FUEL!..... Gear up, flaps up, power down.... at the last possible second I drop the gear and flaps and activate DLC....... I catch the 1 wire and I sit there what felt like an hour. Breathing heavy, smiling, Mission Complete pops up. I look at my fuel gauge.... 400 lbs left. Goddamn. And all this was in VR. Tomorrow, mission 4.

 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

 

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

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  • 2 weeks later...

Mission 3.

 

Got shot down the 1st time after getting hit by what I believe were a couple of MANPADS, both engines out, safely ejected. I did manage to hit a couple of the planes.

 

Second time. I approached it differently and was able to take out several on the first pass. Got hit by something(probably AAA), with no serious damage.

 

Wingman went in and did some more bombing and got hit. Then I went in and bombed several more going the opposite direction. I had one bomb left after, which I dumped in the country and then hauled it out of there on burner, until I reached the mountains.

 

As for the wingman. I told him to rejoin, but he refused and crashed shortly after. Managed to get back to the ocean without any issue. Then back to the carrier. While watching all the large collection of 23's and 25's on the RWR. Then landed and caught the two wire with 4700lbs of fuel left.

 

That was a pretty cool mission. Although somehow the game didn't consider it a success because in my haste I forgot to use the F10 RTB thing...


Edited by CommanderRabb

Modules - F-18, F-16, Spitfire, F-5, Supercarrier, F-14, A10-C, MiG-21, Huey

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Mission 3.

 

Although somehow the game didn't consider it a success because in my haste I forgot to use the F10 RTB thing...

 

 

Thanks for pointing this out - I've tweaked so it should automatically succeed if you RTB after hitting some targets. Should be coming in an update soon.

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