[REPORTED]Misaligned Eyes on HP-Reverb

Hi!

This is somehow a follow up to https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=228586.

I have a HP-Reverb for about 3 days now. A new one without the blanking out issues. Somehow DCS shows the same misaligned eye problem as it was in the Samsung Odyssey+. It seems, as if the left and right eyes are not aligned properly. The problem only occurs in DCS, any other VR application is working properly.

It's most apparent, when an overlay like fpsVR is used or when a Windows related info is display on the screen (like the discord popups). It's nearly impossible to focus on them.

Unfortunately I cannot get the debug tool which Alex O'kean provided here to run. https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3782971&postcount=53 (or the later posted fixed version)

Any suggestions, what I can try?

Switching back an forth the HMD Hertz did not help. Software IPD settings also showed no changes.

Thanks in Advance!

Can you run vrcmd and post the results?

Open a CMD box and navigate to the drive with your steam folder and to

steam\steamapps\common\SteamVR\bin\win64

then run vrcmd > reverb.txt

This will create a text file reverb.txt in the same folder which you can then post.

Hi!

vrcmd gave me the following output

D:\Games\Steam\steamapps\common\SteamVR\bin\win64>vrcmd

SteamVR Runtime Version: 1.7.4

vrcmd Version: 1.7.4

 

Device 0 - holographic.WindowsHolographic - HP Reverb VR Headset VR1000-2xxx0 by WindowsMR - HMD - generic_hmd

D3DAdapterIndex: 0

RecommendedRenderTargetSize: width=2520, height=2468

Left Projection: left=-1.103946, right=0.944334, top=-1.000583, bottom=1.009488

Right Projection: left=-0.943893, right=1.114435, top=-0.994813, bottom=1.020621

Lens Center: (0.000000, 0.000000), (0.000000, 0.000000)

Tracking universe: 24540007339700

Driver gamepad : 0 displays

Driver holographic : 0 displays

Driver htc : 0 displays

Driver indexcontroller : 0 displays

Driver indexhmd : 0 displays

Driver lighthouse : 0 displays

Driver oculus : 0 displays

Driver oculus_legacy : 0 displays

Driver null : 0 displays

The different values for the projection might be the problem? I'm just curious ;-) Why does this pose a problem in DCS but not in any other software?

Regards,

Huzzle

The variances aren't much different to mine

Left Projection: left=-1.083885, right=0.951912, top=-0.996697, bottom=1.008892

Right Projection: left=-0.949111, right=1.102133, top=-1.000185, bottom=1.012700

I take it you have been all over this thread?

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=228586

Hm, thats weird.

Can you describe better what it looks like?

 

I take it you have been all over this thread?

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=228586

Yes, as mentioned in my first post. I didn't find any solution in the thread. The Visualizer.dll might help, if it would work for the Reverb. Wasn't able to get it to run in the current OpenBeta

Hm, thats weird.

 

Can you describe better what it looks like?

Sure: Some examples for proper alignment. Dependent on the eye-focus, the overlay or the DCS image are aligned. Due to the way the eye work, the movement of the out-of-focus plane should be only horizontal. In the first image the focus is on the DCS part, in the second image the focus is on the overlay.

In these next cases, the DCS images are out of plane skewed to each other. Again in the first image the focus is on the DCS part, in the second image the focus is on the overlay.

Hope that helps to show the problem. It's feasible to align this with the eyes, but it causes real strain. The face on the left shows how the eyes have to move to handle this alignment. It's not natural to move one eye up, and in parallel the other one down to focus on something.

Somehow this only happens in DCS. No other SteamVR dependent software I tested.

This is exactly the same that I just found occurring on Valve Index. It is not only Reverb problem!

An easy way to see the issue is to click SteamVR menu using hand controller when in DCS main menu and check the bottom row of icons that are dimmed but visible through the transparent menu layer of SteamVR. One can easily see that the icons have vertical offset between left and right eye displays.

No other VR software on my computer shows this effect.

Comparing the magnitude of offset to HUD in aircraft so that focusing eyes to the overlay (e.g. fpsVR), one can tilt his head so that the horizontal green line of the HUD on both eyes reaches the same vertical position by a tilt of 2-4 degrees.

Coincidentally, this is the typical gyro sensor horizontal calibration error found in most Rift CV1 headsets and matches the tilt caused by the small IPD adjustment knob on the bottom of Rift CV1 when it is placed on a table. Coincidentally.

In any case, I believe this is a bug that should be fixed quickly to reduce eye strain.

Excellent images above, by the way. Kudos, Huzzle.

This is exactly the same that I just found occurring on Valve Index. It is not only Reverb problem!

 

An easy way to see the issue is to click SteamVR menu using hand controller when in DCS main menu and check the bottom row of icons that are dimmed but visible through the transparent menu layer of SteamVR. One can easily see that the icons have vertical offset between left and right eye displays.

 

No other VR software on my computer shows this effect.

 

Comparing the magnitude of offset to HUD in aircraft so that focusing eyes to the overlay (e.g. fpsVR), one can tilt his head so that the horizontal green line of the HUD on both eyes reaches the same vertical position by a tilt of 2-4 degrees.

 

Coincidentally, this is the typical gyro sensor horizontal calibration error found in most Rift CV1 headsets and matches the tilt caused by the small IPD adjustment knob on the bottom of Rift CV1 when it is placed on a table. Coincidentally.

 

 

In any case, I believe this is a bug that should be fixed quickly to reduce eye strain.

 

 

Excellent images above, by the way. Kudos, Huzzle.

Bugger - so the problem might really be bigger and indeed SteamVR and not WMR related! Thanks for the kudos RedX :-). I wonder, if the problem really only occurs on a few headsets, or if some people just can filter this out.

In the Odyssey+ thread concerning this issue, at least a tool was released to play with the projection settings. Would be great, if it would be released for any SteamVR headset, not only the O+.

I had this issue with the Reverb, i.e. couldn’t focus on overlays like fpsVR, but not on my Index.

Yep getting it also on gen 2 Reverb with fpsvr. Funily enough I didnt even think of reporting it and just ignored it as I was only checking Fpsvr occasionally. If it was onscreen permanently for me then I would have been bitchin'.

I think what we need as a temporary fix is something like the tool that was put up in this post.

I wonder if it can be adapted to work with the Reverb?

I hope so. The tool looks pretty generic, but is restricted to the Samsung Odyssey+. You can totally wreck your settings with this, so from support point of view I wouldn't offer this in general ;-)

Just to make it clear, the problem is not restricted to fpsVR. DCS does the rendering skewed, any overlay just makes it apparent. It just isn't that visible when looking at DCS alone but nevertheless fatigues your eyes.

I wonder whether this misalignment issue is on any of the to-do-fix or bug lists? Is there any known way to get the views aligned, i mean is there any configuration file or similar in DCS that can be tweaked to align the views? The vertical misalignment seems to be there for both wmr and non-wmr systems.

Or if someone can confirm that the effect is definitely not there, i would be interested in comparing all the config files. Any non-DCS overlay screen seems to confirm the misalignment at least on my system.

I also have this bug... It's weird it doesn't seem to impact every Reverb HMD...

I have the odyssey and it seems this is the same problem we had. I cannot help but conclude that it is a problem with dcs itself (if not dcs then why do no other games have this issue?). I have wondered if it’s a problem with convergence, ipd, fov, and how dcs handles their relationship... but I have no idea really. Even the tool provided for odyssey users doesn’t really fix it... just makes it tolerable. But overlays are still out of focus (or more likely dcs is out of focus and overlays are correct). Anyway... if I set the tool to have the cockpit in focus far away objects are still a strain... which makes me think that there is a problem with convergence. Idk what the problem is but obviously there is a solution because other games don’t have this problem.

Hi I just bought a Reverb and have this same problem of image misalignment. DCS is unplayable because of eye strain. I still have my Odyssey plus and it doesn't do this. The reverb works fine in every other steamvr game. It must be some issue with DCS VR, and also mine is one of the new fixed Reverbs.

I'd like to know if someone from ED is aware of this problem? ...

How many ex odyssey users having the problem? Is it possible the original settings that fixed the O are now the cause? How did you reset them back to stock?

I don't know, if there was a fix. At last there was a tool given by ED that enabled the users to modify the projection settings. A config file was created which was used on startup. To reset the behavior, you just have to delete the config.

It would be be great if we would get the tool now for any SteamVR headset, so we can try if this helps a bit.

I deleted my config file that was setup up for my O+, unfortunately I still have the misalignment problem with the Reverb. I didn't have it with my O+ though. I also think it would be great to have the tool to help us with this a bit. I also tried uninstalling and reinstalling mixed reality and Steam VR. Nothing worked, the headset works fine in everything else just not DCS.

Thought I'd add my two cents. I bought the Samsung Odyssey about 6 months ago from Amazon.com (live in the UK and can't get it this side of the pond). After waiting a week or so I was pumped to finally crack open the box, install WMR and SteamVR etc and fire it up.

Like yourself and others, I immediately had double vision; I cannot express how many hours I spent trying to rectify the issue (uninstalling drivers, DCS, wiping temp settings, profiles etc) to no avail. The issue only occurred in DCS.

Eventually I cut my losses and sent it back and decided to live with the Rift CV1 and its relatively low res.

Needless to say I was excited to hear about the Reverb when it was announced and after monitoring the forums on here and other places, decided to place an order (again on amazon.com) for the second gen headset when it became available last week. I was pretty nervous to be honest as like the Odyssey, the Reverb is a WMR/SteamVR headset so was anxious to know if it I'd run into the same cross-eyed problems again.

Well, after cracking open the box and again going through the motions of setting up the software, I was pleasantly surprised by the cross-eyed issue not rearing its ugly head. Its important to note here that my PC hasn't changed at all; the hardware is the same as when I tried the Odyssey

Basically, thats my rather long winded way of saying that I firmly believe this issue is headset related and not caused any software. Sure, there may be software related issues but as far as I can work out, they haven't been able to totally fix the issue.

My advice would be to send back the headset and get another one.

I'm glad your Reverb is working out, I think I'm gonna take your advice. Here's to hoping the replacement doesn't have the same issue (or it'll go back too).

Cheers

Basically, thats my rather long winded way of saying that I firmly believe this issue is headset related and not caused any software. Sure, there may be software related issues but as far as I can work out, they haven't been able to totally fix the issue.

The screens for me are perfectly aligned in every application except DCS. Everyone else who had reported this issue with the Reverb has said the same thing afaik. This doesn't seem headset related to me, it seems like an issue with SteamVR/WMR and how it integrates with DCS.

I have this same issue in DCS with my HP Reverb. Very bad eye strain caused by mis-aligned left vs. right eye views. There is a definite up down mis-alignment which I would say is the worst issue. Your eyes can compensate for the mismatch, but the result is severe eye strain. You can see it right on the front menu screen as well as in the simulation itself. For reference, I have the stand-alone, non Steam version of DCS, although I have tried running DCS through Steam as a non Steam app, and that makes no difference.

The length of time it takes for my eyes to "return to normal" after using the Reverb in DCS is proportional to the time spent in DCS e.g. spend 5 minutes in DCS, it takes 5 minutes for my eyes to "uncross" after I take the headset off. I spent 45 minutes in game, and it took about the same amount of time for my eyes to readjust after that session.

I also have a Rift S, and that works perfectly with the same install of DCS as I am using with the Reverb. Unfortunately, the resolution is much lower with the Rift S. Also, the Reverb works fine with every other game I have.

As with many other people, I bought the Reverb specifically for the higher resolution in DCS. It does work great from that perspective, but it is unusable due to the eye strain issue from the mis-aligned views.

I have tried everything I can think of to correct the issue myself, but nothing has made even the slightest change to the mis-alignment.

I saw the Samsung Odyssey thread on what seems to be a similar issue, and I hope that this will be looked into for the Reverb as well. Thanks.