Unrealistic landing and emergency air system doesnt work. - Page 2 - ED Forums
 


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Old 07-04-2019, 06:51 PM   #11
Svsmokey
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Originally Posted by zhukov032186 View Post
Ummm... if you're locking the brakes that means you're braking too hard. That isn't a 'brake quality' thing. If the pressure being exerted is too high, it overcomes the road friction and the wheel stops spinning. That applies to ANY aircraft, car, whatever.

That is NOT an example of 'bad brakes' it is an example of
1. Poor braking habits. I.e. a pilot/driver issue, not a plane/car issue. Exacerbated by it being a light aircraft.

Other contributing factors in-rl :

2. Tires are poorly suited or bald. For example racing tires are not 'better quality' than econo-tires... they are SOFTER than econo-tires, which means they grip the road better than the harder, longer lasting typical tires. Racing tires are often WIDER than regular tires, too, which increases surface area contact and traction (particularly when hot).

3. The road/landing surface is slick or unsuitable.

The Yak may be stopping too quickly, but I'm afraid your understanding of brakes, tires, etc is entirely wrong. I find people have issues by trying to fly/drive like an on/off switch with no finesse. Throttle wide open or closed, brakes off or fully applied, etc @@
It is possible for poor brake design to give the effects mentioned . Ask any Yamaha rider with a rear drum . I rode the RD350 . That sucker acted like an on-off switch . We filed a taper into the leading edge of the shoe friction material to mitigate .
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Last edited by Svsmokey; 07-04-2019 at 06:53 PM.
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Old 07-04-2019, 11:48 PM   #12
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Ok... so, here's my reasoning:

On thinking, I can see how, for example, a brake design that has too much contact area could lock up with relatively light control application, but seems it would be the same approximate braking force actually being applied, regardless of whether the controls themselves were touchy or not. For example, reducing the area, or increasing the bite, or whatever, where perhaps you have to apply more input to achieve a given effect, kind of like reducing the sensitivity of a setting.

However, whether the vehicle actually skids or not is dependent on tire vs surface interactions, not just the control application. That's my point.

I fly the Yak-52 quite a lot ingame, first with a X-56 with the digital brake lever (on/off, no axis), even though the control is instantaneous, ingame there is a lag as the pilot squeezes the lever meaning you can still feather it. Now I have a MCG Pro with a brake axis, and can apply graduated braking with more precision. If it was ''too sensitive'' as with other controls, that would be a curvature you could introduce to fine tune it to taste.

In any case, skidding around is caused by being too heavy handed, regardless of the particular method being utilised.
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Old 07-05-2019, 04:30 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by zhukov032186 View Post
I fly the Yak-52 quite a lot ingame,
But you do notice that we are talking about the real airplane, not the game plane.
I wouldn't even remotely think about comparing the game brakes with the real Yak/CJ brakes.

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Old 07-05-2019, 05:28 AM   #14
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Isn't that the point? Real airplane is like this, DCS airplane is like that? Otherwise what difference does it make? My only point was that locking the brakes is from overapplication, regardless of brake design
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Old 07-05-2019, 05:34 AM   #15
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The point is that I tend to believe a real Yak/CJ owner and pilot much more if he states that the brakes are crap, instead of an armchair pilot who says the RW pilot doesn't know how to operate the brakes correctly on his own plane!
Svsmokey already wrote that brake design plays a significant role.

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Old 07-05-2019, 09:38 AM   #16
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Could we come back to the original post ? Everybody there knows that as flightsimmers and whatever our good or bad flying habits/uses we do expect the "pixalized" yak52 do behave as close as possible from its real life counterpart .
BTW and IMHO the more you fly an aircraft out of its limits the more you learn from it.


Now, the OP was about the excessive braking strengh in DCS Yak-52 compared to a real CJ6 Nanchang.
-First thing to be sure of is: Does a real CJ6 brake exactly the same way as a real Yak52?
-Although I do not question motoadve's expertise, it would also be useful to get some info from other real pilots on that point.
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Old 07-05-2019, 01:27 PM   #17
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Could we come back to the original post ? BTW and IMHO the more you fly an aircraft out of its limits the more you learn from it.
Besides the fact that I strongly disagree with this statement, what does this have to do with the original post?
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Old 07-05-2019, 04:11 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Woodbuster View Post
[I]BTW and IMHO the more you fly an aircraft out of its limits the more you learn from it.
You will only learn how to "Buy the farm"
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Old 07-05-2019, 04:30 PM   #19
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If someone wants to believe you can land and stop a real Yak 52 in 100 meters, go believe it.
Case of Arm chair pilot thinking PC game is correct but , real life experience is wrong.

I fly my CJ6 about 3 times a week, it has same kind of brakes and plane as a Yak 52.

The flight model I have no complains, just the landings are super unrealistic if you can stop this plane in a 100 meters in the game, it is just wrong!
Go search all over the internet for Yak52 short field landing and find one can stops in 100meters, maybe with a 50knt headwind it can.
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Old 07-05-2019, 04:32 PM   #20
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Ahahah ! Err guys I was talking about simulation, you understood that uh ?


Anyway this was just a digression amongst many others here and there (that's why I used italics for this sentence)...and of course I agree you can disagree...that's the beauty of forums !

I don't want to feed any polemic neither look for quarrels. I just humbely seek to learn from those who know. Once again few very simple question : Are we sure the real YAK52 brakes the same way as CJ6 ? Once this question sorted we could partially or totally reply to the next one : Does the DCS YAK52 brakes the same way as its real life counterpart. Motoadv is certainly an experienced person that's not the point but I think we need a more infos. Specially from pilots who praticed short landings on Yak52. And then we will adress a report to devellopers with strong arguments. That's it.
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