Huey Engine Failure? - Page 3 - ED Forums
 


Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-15-2018, 09:29 PM   #21
cordite
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 215
Default

Hear, hear.
cordite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2018, 09:37 PM   #22
Robert31178
Senior Member
 
Robert31178's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 1,236
Default

Shag is right, a running take off, as it is called, is the only way to get a loaded up Huey off of the ground. I've weighed in a bunch on this, and even though I'm not a real helicopter pilot I feel qualified in speaking here by virtue of having flown the Huey damn near exclusively for close to 3 years.

Twice.

That's the number of times I've EGT'd. One of those was more or less on purpose. My flying habits didn't really change on the Caucasus map post EGT failure implementation, I always flew 50% fuel, mini's on the doors, and flew within published torque limits. It's a bit more challenging on the desert maps, but you can use it!!!!

Yesterday I flew an op on the PG map with my new unit (yes Blackley, it's me, Gunfighter). Good morning gentlemen, the temperature was 110 degrees.....I flew with 50% fuel and mini's in the doors, per usual. I was able to make 75kia consistently, moved crates via CTLD by hovering over them at our required height of 12-29ft for 10 seconds, went and picked up two pilots, and I was able to not smoke an engine, nor did I feel the need to run a repair.

Every time I turn around someone is complaining about EGT limitations. Listen, it's flyable, and to be frank I think it's better now than it was because the bird has limitations that must be observed, where before there were NO consequences for bombing out carrying a red line for torque at 125kts. I've learned, after experiencing my only actual surprise failure, that if you just fly like you did previously, and instead of first looking at your torque gauge look first at your EGT, then you'll be fine. You just have to trade some fuel for cargo/weaps. While I agree the EGT failures are over modelled, I think this is better than before.

~Rob

Last edited by Robert31178; 08-15-2018 at 09:40 PM.
Robert31178 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2018, 10:35 PM   #23
shagrat
ED Translator
 
shagrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 8,852
Default

Just to mention, if you feel the need for more power, there is an Option in the Mission Editor to adjust the engine tear&wear (basically how old the engine is). You could get a brand new one, with a tad bit better performance, if you wanted to model a Vietnam mission with a brand new Huey fresh from the production line.

The standard is more of a 50 odd year old helicopter as we have today in reality.

As Belsimtek has acknowledged already there is a slight deviation in the EGT modeling they need to adjust, but it is nowhere as dramatic or "unrealistic" as some people try to make it.

The Huey is a very old machine. There is a reason why todays UH-1 variants like the Venom have two(!) turbine engines and four(!) rotorblades.

Even when they put rocket pods, miniguns and ammo galore on a Huey in Vietnam they needed to trade a lot of fuel for it.

The next issue is "Hot and high won't let you fly." Nevada is not exactly 100 ft MSL and that together with temperatures above 25°C makes it problematic for a loaded two bladed helicopter from the 70ies to hover.

I am pretty sure after BST have fixed and adjusted EGT and torque, people will complain about torque warnings and ripped of rotors.
The root cause does not go away, as performance at high altitude and high temperature is a real life issue for such a helicopter.

Currently you simply need to closer monitor the EGT than torque, but you need to learn monitoring the engine, keep the limitations in mind and adjust the way you fly, as well as learn to thoughtfully plan your loadout.
You can bend the limitations a little with the tricks we all read about in those books.
Running take off, circling in ground effect to translational lift, or max performance lift of to clear an obstacle, then plunge nose down into an acceleration dive. That is what the real life pilots did. They adjusted their flying and got creative to circumvent the limitations of the hardware.
__________________
Shagrat

- Flying Sims since 1984 -
Win 10 | i5 7600K@4.0GHz | 32GB | GeForce GTX 1080 8GB - Acer XB280HK 28" 4k | TrackIR5 | Simshaker & Jetseat | TM HOTAS Warthog custom build extension | MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals | TM Cougar MFDs |a hand made UFC and an AHCP | Oculus Rift & controller
shagrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 07:00 AM   #24
BlacleyCole
Senior Member
 
BlacleyCole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,457
Default

Where is this option to select the engine wear and tear? Condition?
__________________
BlackeyCole 20years usaf
XP-11. Dcs 2.5OB
Acer predator laptop/ i7 7720, 2.4ghz, 32 gb ddr4 ram, 500gb ssd,1tb hdd,nvidia 1080 8gb vram


New FlightSim Blog at https://blackeysblog.wordpress.com. Go visit it and leave me feedback and or comments so I can make it better
BlacleyCole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 07:44 AM   #25
shagrat
ED Translator
 
shagrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 8,852
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlacleyCole View Post
Where is this option to select the engine wear and tear? Condition?
In the ME click on the Huey Group, last Tab there are two sliders. First is for the AI gunner accuracy (default 90%)
Second is for engine "age" / performance.

EDIT this is set for each individual aircraft, like the loadout and skin. It cannot be changed in the mission while playing.

Personally I prefer to leave it as it is, as we fly old iconic helicopters in the late 90ies and beyond, most of the time...
__________________
Shagrat

- Flying Sims since 1984 -
Win 10 | i5 7600K@4.0GHz | 32GB | GeForce GTX 1080 8GB - Acer XB280HK 28" 4k | TrackIR5 | Simshaker & Jetseat | TM HOTAS Warthog custom build extension | MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals | TM Cougar MFDs |a hand made UFC and an AHCP | Oculus Rift & controller

Last edited by shagrat; 08-16-2018 at 07:47 AM.
shagrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 08:02 AM   #26
Quadg
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 411
Default

here is me doing some take-off, landing and shooting practise.
in a reasonably heavy huey. (mini guns and m60 door gunners, half a tank of gas. 15-20c air temp. with a good head wind.)
using an interesting controls indicator
10 minutes of landing and 10 minutes of shooting In the same helicopter.

if you learn the belsimtek limits then the model flies fine. you just have to take full advantage of ground effect.
and even better. when belsimtek gives us more power. you will have the skill to take proper advantage of it.

the mission is by reflected, called huey playground.
https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=178909
great for muscle memory flights.
because you can practise what you feel like practising.
i.e. scales when learning guitar..




edit: I need to use external view... it also has 7 rockets a side so its a full gunship config. not just m60 and minis on the front.
so heavier than I thought.. should have opened the door and leaned out to check
__________________
My Rig: i7 4930k 4.5Ghz, 16GB DDR3 2400, 2x SSD, EVGA 1080 Superclocked, Warthog Throttle and Stick, MFG Crosswinds, Oculus Rift.

Last edited by Quadg; 08-16-2018 at 09:47 AM.
Quadg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 12:31 PM   #27
Robert31178
Senior Member
 
Robert31178's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 1,236
Default

You know what would be really helpful is if someone could make a mod similar to Quad's controls mod, but instead of the controls it shows the EGT temp gauge. Not sure why Bell decided that some of the more important gauge needed to be the smallest gauges, but there we go. Either a separate gauge mod or maybe even something as simple as a better, brighter marker for the yellow portion?

The gauge unless zoomed in on it is hard to read, maybe that's some of the cause for the repeated postings? I find myself having to "zoom in slow" at times, which does nothing for my hovering. With the "yellow" temp market being as small as it is it's tough to tell exactly when you're in it. Seems very easy to be either in the green or in the red.

Anyone up for this?
Robert31178 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 03:55 PM   #28
shagrat
ED Translator
 
shagrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 8,852
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert31178 View Post
You know what would be really helpful is if someone could make a mod similar to Quad's controls mod, but instead of the controls it shows the EGT temp gauge. Not sure why Bell decided that some of the more important gauge needed to be the smallest gauges, but there we go. Either a separate gauge mod or maybe even something as simple as a better, brighter marker for the yellow portion?

The gauge unless zoomed in on it is hard to read, maybe that's some of the cause for the repeated postings? I find myself having to "zoom in slow" at times, which does nothing for my hovering. With the "yellow" temp market being as small as it is it's tough to tell exactly when you're in it. Seems very easy to be either in the green or in the red.

Anyone up for this?
It is better to do what the pilots do. Remember the clock-position of the handles and listen and get used to the turbine sound at certain settings.

At typical cruise speed with safe collective settings the engine makes a distinctive sound. If you look closely at the EGT gauge it shows the needle in the green @ roughly 7 o'clock. Now remember what it looks and sounds like. Now pull more collective and listen to the change, glance at the EGT gauge and see it at 8-9 o'clock!? That is the sound you want to remember with a bad feeling and not hear for more than a few seconds.

After a while of listening and monitoring and getting used to normal cruise settings and sound, you can "feel" the turbine sound changing in your gut. A quick glance to the EGT gauge to confirm, what you already know should be it.
The beauty of all this analogue and simple equipment is, it really supports seat of your pants flying.
__________________
Shagrat

- Flying Sims since 1984 -
Win 10 | i5 7600K@4.0GHz | 32GB | GeForce GTX 1080 8GB - Acer XB280HK 28" 4k | TrackIR5 | Simshaker & Jetseat | TM HOTAS Warthog custom build extension | MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals | TM Cougar MFDs |a hand made UFC and an AHCP | Oculus Rift & controller
shagrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 10:47 PM   #29
BlacleyCole
Senior Member
 
BlacleyCole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,457
Default

Thanks you have to select a user huey not an ai one
__________________
BlackeyCole 20years usaf
XP-11. Dcs 2.5OB
Acer predator laptop/ i7 7720, 2.4ghz, 32 gb ddr4 ram, 500gb ssd,1tb hdd,nvidia 1080 8gb vram


New FlightSim Blog at https://blackeysblog.wordpress.com. Go visit it and leave me feedback and or comments so I can make it better
BlacleyCole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2018, 10:53 PM   #30
shagrat
ED Translator
 
shagrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Germany
Posts: 8,852
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlacleyCole View Post
Thanks you have to select a user huey not an ai one
Yes, of course. AI uses a simplified flight model and no engine modeling at all.
You would need a PC for each AI to calculate the whole detailed flight and systems modeling to the level we have in the DCS modules.
__________________
Shagrat

- Flying Sims since 1984 -
Win 10 | i5 7600K@4.0GHz | 32GB | GeForce GTX 1080 8GB - Acer XB280HK 28" 4k | TrackIR5 | Simshaker & Jetseat | TM HOTAS Warthog custom build extension | MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals | TM Cougar MFDs |a hand made UFC and an AHCP | Oculus Rift & controller
shagrat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT. The time now is 10:30 AM. vBulletin Skin by ForumMonkeys. Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.