DCS: F-14 Air to Air Refueling Tutorial

This is before plugging up. Throttle work is fine. In the controls display I can see the trim diamond moving with every trim input I make, but I don't get a discernible flight-path change until the third press. It's gotten milder since I added more curves to my pitch axis, but I still cannot trim for a relatively neutral pitch position in any flight regime. It's an issue I have with all the older jets, but none of the other DCS aircraft, including helos and warbirds.

Trim only helps a little, though.

Trim is everything, if you don't think it helps you're getting something seriously wrong.

You may have something up with your stick, perhaps adding a deadzone would help you out, or increasing your deadzone if you already have one as the trim on the aircraft works perfectly and does not act as you describe if done properly.

Don't try to fly the aircraft by trimming, you make your corrections on the stick and then trim so you don't have to make any more stick corrections.

Eg.. if you have to constantly hold the stick aft to maintain a stable attitude then you should be adding in trim up tabs until you no longer have to hold back on the stick.

I've yet to miss the basket since the aircraft was released, this isn't down to some high level of skill but simply down to preparing the aircraft properly before attempting to connect with the basket.

Preparation Prevents Poor Performance... take your time behind the basket, like I said, even if you're back there for 5+ mins its essential you trim the aircraft out so its stable before you start to move forward.

Currently deadzone 5 curve 15 on the pitch axis. X52. Most recently I'll be trimmed for stable formation flight with the basket out in front of me, then close at around 1-3kts. When I get close, the probe may be off by a couple of feet, so I hit trim to correct, but then I end up in the above scenario. Trying to adjust manually, and I can't seem to get my stick to respond to minor movements like it should.

Don't trim to correct on approach, use the stick for corrections sir and then trim, never the other way around.

I'd maybe try turning your deadzone down a touch then good man to be a bit more precise with your stick corrections. A deadzone of 5 is pretty high and might be why you're either going one way or the other.

Up your curve to 20 and set your deadzone to 2 and see how you get on.

It sounds like your doing the basics right but you're maybe just guilty of trying to fly by trim, always fly by stick and then trim so you don't have to constantly hold the stick back or forward to stay level.

Harrier probably ruined me on the trim. It seems to prefer the reverse trimming techniques when tanking. I'll try those curves.

I try to trim it but .. with very little trim input, it overreacts. So I have to hit trim up and down constantly

Keep in mind, that trim is a constant thing. If you change power settings, then your trim will also change. Once trimmed and behind the tanker, I wouldn’t touch the trim as you pull in to connect. If you trim as you connect, then once back on speed the trim will be off again. Once trimmed I manually fly it, connect then relax and use my throttle to stay on speed and only trim if needed. If you are having trouble connecting then I recommend to just practice holding formation with the tanker. If you aren’t proficient at formation flying, then refueling will be extra difficult. My issue is the basket not staying connected but popping out with little to no input from me.

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sounds you need to learn how to check oscillations then before you even get into trimming

every input can enter an oscillation, from speed oscillations (probably the biggest secret killer because this will be 9/10 what prompts pitch pio) to roll oscillations to the familiar pitch oscillation, and the biggest trouble i see people run into for gassing is they let themselves get into multiple oscillations and they have no way to damp out any of them

trim is for maintaining a setting after you've damped out the oscillation. you can trim as you're damping it out but if you're finding yourself porpoising you need to fix that with your own two hands. its exactly as the veterans have said, you need to make three inputs -- input for change, counterinput to arrest, and neutralizing input to arrive at the desired steady state. if its not apparent, the action of cancelling out an oscillation is a controlled oscillation in itself which should make sense to anyone who has ever learned anything about waves.

learn to assemble the three actions together as a single unit and use that for any inputs you want to make. anytime you want to accelerate, decelerate, shift your nose around, you need to be making moderated inputs that have a beginning (input) and an end (counterinput and neutralization). once you actually understand how to correctly make moderated three-action inputs instead of runaway single action inputs, then you will never be taken by oscillations, or if you do, you'll be able to cancel it out immediately and at that point you can stare at the basket all you want and you'll still fly rock solid

i managed to refuel from 50% to 100% with a single connection. But it is still very far from ideal.

Wake turbulance always gets me. Tanker still releases the hose late and it doesn't seem to be helping with aligning the basket. I enabled info bar to see my speed crtl+y. After i connected, didin't look at my speed, just maintained the distance between the green light and my plane.

I will be doing more practise and thanks to all for your help.

Next time i will not enable info bar

you're ascending too high if you're getting hit by wake turbulence

theres no turbulence if you're tucked in under the wing where the drogue naturally settles

anticipate the natural ascent every time power is added with your pitch inputs

Thank you for nice explanation.

3:40 You say to set manually the "tacan" frequency to 61. I´m new in sim fly so my question is how this frequency is determinate (set)?

Thank you.

3:40 You say to set manually the "tacan" frequency to 61. I´m new in sim fly so my question is how this frequency is determinate (set)?

It'll depend on what the mission creator has the tanker Tacan set to so could be anything from 01-99. You'll probably see it in the briefing section you get before the mission loads. The tanker radio and Tacan settings are usually given there.

You can also just use Jester to tune to the tanker Tacan and radio for you rather than do it manually. Open Jester and go to radio and TAC radio and you should see the tanker radio frequency there - select that and Jester will tune the VHF/UHF radio to that.

Then open Jester again and go to Navigation, Tacan and tune TAC Tacan and you should see the tanker Tacan as an option there. Select that and then select Tacan on the right STEERING CMD panel (the one that has the options TACAN, DEST, AWL/PCD, VEC & MAN) and you'll see it come up on your HSD in a couple of seconds. Jester will automatically handle setting the Tacan to A/A for you so it hooks up to an airborne target.

It'll depend on what the mission creator has the tanker Tacan set to so could be anything from 01-99. You'll probably see it in the briefing section you get before the mission loads. The tanker radio and Tacan settings are usually given there.

 

You can also just use Jester to tune to the tanker Tacan and radio for you rather than do it manually. Open Jester and go to radio and TAC radio and you should see the tanker radio frequency there - select that and Jester will tune the VHF/UHF radio to that.

 

Then open Jester again and go to Navigation, Tacan and tune TAC Tacan and you should see the tanker Tacan as an option there. Select that and then select Tacan on the right STEERING CMD panel (the one that has the options TACAN, DEST, AWL/PCD, VEC & MAN) and you'll see it come up on your HSD in a couple of seconds. Jester will automatically handle setting the Tacan to A/A for you so it hooks up to an airborne target.

Thank you for the support..Yes i saw that by default the TANKER radio frequency is on 251.000. Yes Sear Jester can do it for me ;).

But for that works too frequency will need to be on the good one ;)

So if i do the way show on the two screens, setting the radio frequency set on 075.000 it will work?

You'd just set the tanker frequency to 075. No need to set yours to that frequency too (or I assume you'd hear all the tanker radio chatter).

Then to set the tanker Tacan go to the X tab two to the right of the default tab and in the dropdown actions there should be one for Tacan activation and you can set the Tacan number for the tanker.

Done ;)

One more time thanks a lot for the support....

If everything work, i will post a screen on refuel

Okay,

nothing is working fine.....

I can´t communicate with the TANKER using the "request refueling"

And TACAN, sure something is missing (and i´m following the video tutorial)

Here is the mission file if you want to have a look:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/c98mma9qij64xxl/M2000C%20F14%20REFUEL.miz?dl=0

Hey Phil, I'm certainly no expert but it looks like you haven't set either the TACAN up for the refueller or assigned it the radio channel.

These need to be in the advanced waypoint actions part of the tanker along with the instruction to act as a refueler (which you have added).

Okay,

 

nothing is working fine.....

 

I can´t communicate with the TANKER using the "request refueling"

 

Here's a quick one I made last week which will show you the correct setup for CVN and Tanker radio & TACAN. Also once you get Jester to tune to the Tanker radio channel make sure you're using the VHF/UHF radio communication button when trying to talk to the Tanker. You can map the button from the controls to your HOTAS.

Persian Gulf F-14B CVN Cold Start.miz

Same happend...

Here is the waypoint modified :

https://www.dropbox.com/s/c98mma9qij64xxl/M2000C%20F14%20REFUEL.miz?dl=0

By default the tanker have the 251.000MHZ on the COM

On the mission file have set it to 75 for the tacan...

Maybe this delete the radio communication with the tanker .....

A bit lost now :)

Here's a quick one I made last week which will show you the correct setup for CVN and Tanker radio & TACAN. Also once you get Jester to tune to the Tanker radio channel make sure you're using the VHF/UHF radio communication button when trying to talk to the Tanker. You can map the button from the controls to your HOTAS.

Ok thanks...I will have a look ..

Check your radio bindings sir.

RAlt+ Radio button = Radio 1

Rctlr+ Radio button = Radio 2.

If you just press the Radio button like FC3 aircraft it won't work.

The tanker will always give you the Left hose first if you approach solo. The only way he'll give you the Right hose is if someone else is already pre-contact or contact on it.

Here's a quick one I made last week which will show you the correct setup for CVN and Tanker radio & TACAN. Also once you get Jester to tune to the Tanker radio channel make sure you're using the VHF/UHF radio communication button when trying to talk to the Tanker. You can map the button from the controls to your HOTAS.

Ok, so:

Your tanker is set by default on 251.000MHZ in COM

Your F14 is set by default on 124.000MHZ in COM

This is way the F14 can communicate with the tanker and "JESTER" find it with the tacan .

So i comeback with my initial question .If RADIO COM can be "by default" for radio communication For the TACAN in the video tutorial made by 104th_Maverick (first post) on minute 3:37 he says:

"Tacan can be manualy set and the frequency IN THIS CASE is set to 061 X"

Why 61 has been choosen?

61 was chosen because that was the channel I set the TACAN at in the mission editor.

The tanker radio channel in that video was 251.0AM, the TACAN channel was 61X.

;3858199']61 was chosen because that was the channel I set the TACAN at in the mission editor.

 

 

The tanker radio channel in that video was 251.0AM, the TACAN channel was 61X.

Thank you for your help ;)

Hi,

ok, so the radio communication works ;) , thanks Maverick.

Now for the tacan, in that case the frequency is set to 64 on the tanker in the mission editor.

I apply manualy as explained in the tutorial ....But nothing comes up on the HSD .