Сoncept NATO vs USSR die?

Hello guys!

No secret for anyone that to create the dynamic server with concept NATO vs USSR impossible and at the moment we see mixed NATO vs NATO...:(

So still and F16 will.I really like planes such as F4 Fantom 2,F/A-18C,SU27,SU25,Panavia Tornado.

Would you like to see in DCS aircraft such as SU17M4,SU24,SU25SM,MIG27,MIG23?

What do you think about it?

Thanks!:pilotfly:

rest assured there is much desire for full fidelity russian aircraft

however, obstructions exist between desire and reality

the illfated tu-22m mod should give you some clues as to how serious things can be:

I quit working on the project for two reasons. First, although I was very open and honest about everything, the project still became a bureaucratic security issue for my employer, as a US Air Force contractor. I ended up resigning partly because of it. But more importantly, I had established a relationship with some Tu-22M people in Russia who were happy to contribute to the project, but eventually had to ask me politely to cease my research efforts. I won't say exactly why, but the request was reasonable, they had been very fair with me, and I agreed to drop the project.

 

While I was trying to make the Air Force job work, the best thing for me to do was cease all communication about the project while I was investigated. I resigned in March, but remained silent while I looked at other work (the security headaches would potentially follow me to any government related job), but I ended up getting out of engineering entirely. I have moved to Alaska to fly professionally, and can say something now.

rest assured there is much desire for full fidelity russian aircraft

however, obstructions exist between desire and reality

 

the illfated tu-22m mod should give you some clues as to how serious things can be:

That's too bad

"Немного прояснил ситуацию с документами по советским литакам. На лекции по Су-24 в музее Задорожного, а также после нее, задал представителям-конструкторам КБ Сухого вопрос по поводу доступа к документам по самолетам Су-15/Су-17/Су-24/Су-25/Су-27 и сотрудничества с компаниями, которые занимаются разработкой симов. Вопрос касался секретности и открытости к сотрудничеству. В кулуарах задал еще дополнительные вопросы про модификации Су-24 с пумой и кайрой и конкретно их секретности в купе с БРЭО в целом. Ответы следующие. КБ открыто к сотрудничеству со всеми заинтересованными лицами. Распоряжения сверху по поводу блокировки иниациатив по рассекреченным документам нет, а также само КБ не препятствует. В 91 году был снят гриф по огромному ряду самолетов и их модификаций. Я, например, уточнял конретно про Су-15, Су-17 и Су-24 (простите, что не уточнил про 27) – все их модификации полностью рассекречены, включая БРЭО. Конкретно спросил про вариант с кайрой в том числе – тоже без грифа. Ответили, что если не получается найти что-то в открытых источниках, то по запросу КБ вполне может передать копии документов. Единственная сложность, которая может возникнуть, так это то, что по совсем старым самолетам, вроде Су-15, какие-то документы могли затеряться. Выводы делайте сами."

But this post the man says that he was at a lecture on su-24 and there were the engineers of the Sukhoi company.

They told him that the company was open to cooperation and in ' 91, declassified with the large number of aircraft.

He also asked about secrecy about su17,su24.They said that they were completely declassified.

so...The Sukhoi company is open for cooperation)

P.S.the post very well translates with Google

I think the discussion has not centre build a URSS aircraft to reach a "balance". The discussion need centred on start a project, move on the different steeps, maintain them and release a module.

A project has plausible if someone has a solid plan and can build a 3rd party to reach to the finish line a project. First need get a "solid" info from a company with a licence to make them, get a "approval" to build a module from ED with a proper project, get the SDK and learn them and of course, build them with a "solid" team with the proper knowledge and experience, to make a hardcore Su-15/-17/-24/-25 with systems, avionics, weapons, 3d models, damage model, etc.

Actually from 2012, we see "hundreds" of plans to build modules (east and west, helos and aircraft's), only some has reach the start line to form a 3rd party and only a little quantity has maintain the work to make a release. The rest, has only "dead" projects on a graveyard. And of course, dont expect ED make them. They have yours proper projects.

Of course.F18 vs F18 and etc.

The creators of the server forced make it.To balance the number of people.

But it looks very funny....

Honestly still I don't really get the reasons behind the whole "can't do aircraft of home country" thing, even tho it I think it was mentioned in some of the podcasts again and it kinda confirmed my suspicions where the gridlock is but not much what it is about, unless there's some hugely technical or "fate of world stability" reason with Russian Govt and/or Arms companies I'm going to think it's just ridicolous, but I didn't dig into the depths of specifically that, yet, I could, I brush it a bit every now and then, like right now is right about again ... probably like the 10th time.

I thought it be the opposite, I thought it be harder to do stuff from foreigners like wouldn't they want to protect their stuff from "da Russians!" ... or maybe that's just showing how easy the information leaks from the West. Like a sieve.

Either Russian Govt does a good job of protecting military data, which I would say good job in that case, or something's really not going right in their heads judging by the fact most of the stuff is like +30 year old and tech that's everyone else already knows about it or doesn't need to, since it's old and it's going to be obsolete soon in active use as modernization efforts are going at blazing speed, why on earth keep it "secret" for so long, for what, the only group left screwed out only remains the innocent public, and taxpayers.

Or, there's another reason ... I've seen physical simulators being developed by Russian Arms manufacturers the ones you can sit in, they showcased it in the arms expos and even Putin sat and flied in one of them, maybe they're just greedy and want exclusivity for their own stuff :mad:

I mean seriously, Russia Today (RT/Ruptly) and other news channels can get their cameras (with horrible audio quality) strapped on those jets pretty much on a regular basis, they get access to various S-300 / S-400 launches and all the other drills and tests, there's going to be another parade in Russia soon and you'll going to have live camera feed from the jets and bombers, just like all the recent years before. So while obviously that it's not a lot to build a fully fledged module with but it appears a lot more transparent, at least for media purposes, there's been so much transparency in the syrian operations with weekly battle reports, whole map, no other country does this, it's amazing ... but then when we just want to fly, not even advanced weapons, no advanced radar, just proper flight at least, nope it's somehow a 180' degree turn around, sealed shut, it's so confusing and frustrating!

the illfated tu-22m mod should give you some clues as to how serious things can be:

 

 

I quit working on the project for two reasons. First, although I was very open and honest about everything, the project still became a bureaucratic security issue for my employer, as a US Air Force contractor. I ended up resigning partly because of it. But more importantly, I had established a relationship with some Tu-22M people in Russia who were happy to contribute to the project, but eventually had to ask me politely to cease my research efforts. I won't say exactly why, but the request was reasonable, they had been very fair with me, and I agreed to drop the project.

 

While I was trying to make the Air Force job work, the best thing for me to do was cease all communication about the project while I was investigated. I resigned in March, but remained silent while I looked at other work (the security headaches would potentially follow me to any government related job), but I ended up getting out of engineering entirely. I have moved to Alaska to fly professionally, and can say something now.

See see this just boggles the mind, it boggles the mind! heh. I did follow that mod and drama but that's the first time I see that post.

This has so many questions up ... I can't even think all of them.

1. Why on earth would the any US agency be concerned about someone from their own ranks basically doing FREE espionage, why would they be bothered on something they have to spend money on, but they aren't bothered by DCS A-10C module, this is getting really comic now. They aren't bothered by real pilot playing DCS and talking about Hornet and sharing video. No they're bothered by a Tu-22 mod, not even a commercial product.

2. What the heck does the employer even have with this, why would anyone go public who they are where they work and what mod they're working on ANYWAY.

3. So "some people from Russia" (read: random people on the internet) were happy to contribute but then they, under what authority, asked you to stop research? Were they really russian anyway? Were they threatened by Russian Govt or the manufacturer or it was just made up drama nonsense? Couldn't the RGovt or Manufacturer have directly contacted you to officially solve this? Plus even if they were official, you're not under Russian law anyway, so why the heck would you have to take it seriously anyway. IMO that was a mistake. Request was reasonable? After they wasted XYZ months of your free time, if they got a real cease and desist only they have to respect it in their area where the law applies, not you!

4. Resigned? So it was like a company that was making a mod, weird, probably not, but you know, making a mod while using the internet does not require one to not be anonymous, it's like we're in kindergarden, these are the basics, my gawd.

I mean seriously, what the heck is the purpose of these shadowy networks organizing the harrasment of developing a MOD, can't the govt or manufacturer just officially make a statement and clear out all the dust and nonsense and we would all understand and there be no drama and BS.

So here's the theory, either it's done because all they want to do is to scare you off, they have no authority or legal basis to stop you. The particular info in question might be in the public domain all along and it just needs to be compiled into a module, and someone's playing dirty and for some unknown reason wasn't to stop, it could be some ex-military people that never turned on a computer before thinking they're protecting something, come on, what the hell is a Tu-22M Mod going to reveal to China and USA ..etc that they don't already know, people, they don't need to know the details anymore above certain timeframe (and other params) they can smoke it down with freaking laser sats(edit: great timing) or railguns in seconds if they really want to, come on people!

Which brings it to another theory, it may be an op from other simulator makers or the manufacturer them selfs, posing as some fake "security agents" scarring you people off, oh come on, aren't we better than that to fall for these childish attempts.

So it's all fishy, the public that awaited that mod shouldn't take anything seriously at this point, as I think some people aren't experienced with basics and probably are understanding things differently depending on their background, so you'll have 10 versions of the story of what really happened, , security, as if the guy was using Air Force computers to develop the Tu-22M mod, I hope that's not true for crying out loud. I would have believed more easily that some Air Force interns and PR folks flipped on Tu-22M mod because of the anti-russian hysteria more than some valid and technical security issue.

All the mods and all the copyright stuff always, well, at least in the west, gets a real DMCA or Cease&Desist, so post a real Cease&Desit letter (redacted), in Russian or whatever equivalent, did the Cossacks paid you a visit to the door, or was someone raided by the FSB even, or a real letter (redacted) from the Russian manufacturer saying they want their stuff in their own simulators or whatever the heck their reason is, then we can have something hard to believe any of this kindergarden drama. Can't even make a mod now, ... jeez.

This whole military copyright isn't clear enough, different laws, different interpretations, where it's the taxpayers that paid it as the government ordered and commissioned it then IP shouldn't apply (fully at least) for the stuff manufacturers didn't do by them selfs and if it does it's not fair. If the govt comes and asks for a new project, I want the most meanest double barreled tank on freaking rails, then that's government's IP I would assume, and the taxpaying people are the government in the end, when declassified then it's public domain, manufacturer is just a contractor that does the hard work, they shouldn't be blocking in this case, unless govt buys something "off-the-shelf" the manufacturer spent it's own money researching/developing, and some of it may be partially declassified already but I understand that's sometimes hard to figure out even for professionals let alone modders, you'd have to access the whole law sites in the target country, probably hire lawyers to subpoena govt for detailed docs not available on the web. So with that in mind, don't tell me that every single Russian jet and bomber is "off-the-shelf" and the manufacturers own all the IP of everything, I'd have a hard time believing that so easily, a pity if law works like that there.

/rant

The TLDR point I was trying to make with the initial post before the quote is, if RT/Ruptly and others can get so much access, so can most other media, so that means why ED couldn't for a similar purpose ...

Well for god sake then ED should try to get some access to use proper audio recording equipment so we would have higher quality audio of some of the aircraft even if they don't allow or not possible to simulate, it could be included in the FC3 and MAC then at least, and the other lesser but still important stuff is the missile/rocket sounds, particularly S-300/S-400 and other Anti-Air stuff, AA guns, misc etc.

I cannot phantom enough how horribly cringe the audio quality is in some of these media videos, even if they hold a real camera they release a crappy encoded version, and youtube does yet another re-code as per default to lower the quality further, stomach turning, it's like downright insulting to the glory of these aircraft, probably because they use the darm GoPro, not suppose to use it on anything else except near water, you could drill a hole where the microphone is or just remove the stupid water seal. I can't understand how can people stand such ridicolous audio quality.

I feel so strongly about this that if I had the budget I'd fly to russia ASAP and set up a whole company and hire people to fly with the best equipment to all of the drills and tests and film the thing from 5 angles and rool a whole mobile audio studio truck with the best biggest meanest microphones and hardware processing to get some super full-spectrum recordings man!

I played with a few modules in one session, and the difference is massive when you pay attention, F/A-18C's engine sounds are awesome in comparison, great job!

The point about availability of newer Russian full fidelity modules has already been discussed many times. We will be getting the Mi23 from Razbam and clearly already have the 19 and 21, both of which I rather like flying.

So maybe the discussion would be more productive by looking at how to create more balance between the available NATO aircraft and existing Russian.

I had a look at that a little while ago, and it’s very easy to change weapon availability of NATO aircraft to restrict some of their capabilities, e.g. no availability of laser guided munitions, mavericks, Aim120s, 9x, targeting pods.

I had a look at that a little while ago, and it’s very easy to change weapon availability of NATO aircraft to restrict some of their capabilities, e.g. no availability of laser guided munitions, mavericks, Aim120s, 9x, targeting pods.

The Lantirn I IOC was on on 87, Lantirn II from 99, GBU-10, -12, -16 coming from 76, GBU-24 from 83, GBU-27 from 87, GBU-28 from 91, GBU-30/-31 1999, GBU-32/-35 2001. GBU-38 2004, Mavericks from 72, AIM-120A 1991, AIM-120B 1994, AIM-120C on 1996, AIM-9X on 2003.

To get a "balance" and drop all weapons need move to a 70-80 scenery, including depleted some URRS, Russian weapons and aircraft's as Su-25T, Su-33, Ka-50, etc.

I don't want or need "balance". I am in DCS for the simulation experience. If I have a challenge to overcome, then I adapt to meet it. I personally do not like to see historically friendly aircraft fighting each other unless it's a training type scenario.

But that is just me.