Black Shark 3?

Look at the upper left console in the BS, there is already a switch for the MWS.

I know. But as I understand the PLAN was to have MWS in the aircraft so the cockpit was designed for it, then it wasn't implemented until a later model.

Either way...

I just felt like the tone of the thread was a bit off and I don't think we need that in any way, shape or form when it comes to devs/producers/anyone who actually knows telling us news. Essentially... I think we need to take great care to not rake anyone over the coals for sharing info with us.

MWS and IRAAMs - not worth a paid upgrade.

New 3d interior and exterior model, lighting fixed, bugs squashed - not worth a paid upgrade.

MWS and IRAAMs, AND New 3d interior and exterior model, lighting fixed, bugs squashed - not worth a paid upgrade.

All of the above AND not a single baked in reflection - TAKE MY MONEY

not a single baked in reflection

Just an aside, but CP glass reflections are actually a good thing - albeit perhaps a tad overdone in their current form.

Just an aside, but CP glass reflections are actually a good thing - albeit perhaps a tad overdone in their current form.

I often moan about cockpit reflections looking terrible but it's not because I'm being inconvenienced by them. I love the way light, dust, shadows, dirt, water all conspire to make visibility a dynamic variable. My complaint is that the 'baked on' reflection has outlived it's utility.

Back in the late 90's/early 00's 'baked on' reflections weren't the liability they are now. That's because back then there wasn't any 6DOF head movement; our virtual head was stuck fast in the cockpit.

But nowadays we can move our head around the cockpit and any illusion the 'reflections' once had has evaporated. What once appeared to the player as, say, the reflection of an ejection handle, now presents itself very obviously as a texture painted on the canopy.

Yeah, maybe, but I'd still want some reflections in there. Because there's nothing dafter than a glass that isn't - makes you think you're sitting in an open cockpit.

not a fan of the proposed systems enhancement. this reminds of a little french developer named eugen who ruined their promising wargame franchise by falling down the slippery slope of including fantasy prototype vehicles. hope the devs remember this game is meant to be a simulator after all

The thing with Black Shark is, it is basically a Fantasy helicopter. I believe only 12 were ever built, and in the end, it was scrapped for the Ka-52. Many variations of it were built, probably some we'll never even know about. It was an experiment.

I would definitely like to see a Ka-50 with everything the Ka-52 can do. FLIR, six pylons, R-73 or at least Igla V capability. The switch for AA is on the collective, so I don't think it's a "fantasy" to have it.

The thing with Black Shark is, it is basically a Fantasy helicopter. I believe only 12 were ever built, and in the end, it was scrapped for the Ka-52. Many variations of it were built, probably some we'll never even know about. It was an experiment.

 

 

 

I would definitely like to see a Ka-50 with everything the Ka-52 can do. FLIR, six pylons, R-73 or at least Igla V capability. The switch for AA is on the collective, so I don't think it's a "fantasy" to have it.

I think the main problem here is that there is no information on how these systems were implemented. ED is not in the habit of doing guesswork or making stuff up.

The thing with Black Shark is, it is basically a Fantasy helicopter.... I would definitely like to see a Ka-50 with everything the Ka-52 can do.

+1

It's a great and highly capable chopper with some outdated systems. If it's upgraded for us like some of the airframes were, I would see nothing wrong with that. My main wants are FLIR and MWS (and maybe RWR) but of course only such stuff that was actually developed. These would provide it a modern attack capability while not being a sitting duck for the hunters. Two "simple" upgrades that provide a large increase in situational awareness.

I think the main problem here is that there is no information on how these systems were implemented. ED is not in the habit of doing guesswork or making stuff up.

ED also has a habit of doing contract work for armed forces of various countries. Ka-50 and A-10C are exactly such projects that started as military simulator contracts. I'm certain that there is very concrete knowledge and good contacts with the right people. Ka-50 is also not operational anymore, which simplifies it's use in commercial products.

It has more to do with the era Black Shark was made in. It was post Soviet, pre-revanchist Russia and they were more cash strapped and generally more cooperative. Remember, at one time they'd sell anything to anybody just about if they were paying cash. It's not like that so much now.

ED also has a habit of doing contract work for armed forces of various countries. Ka-50 and A-10C are exactly such projects that started as military simulator contracts. I'm certain that there is very concrete knowledge and good contacts with the right people. Ka-50 is also not operational anymore, which simplifies it's use in commercial products.

Hopefully not straying too far off-topic. Just what was the motive of the Ka-50 contract? Was that with Kamov for promotion (and maybe somebody will still want to buy that Ka-52 down the road)?

Also, the Ka-50 is already the most powerful helicopter in the game, the Gazelle only outmatches it in some niches.

It has more to do with the era Black Shark was made in. It was post Soviet, pre-revanchist Russia...

It was very much a Soviet attack chopper, not post. Development began in '82 or '84, depending on source. Flight testing occurred from '85 onward, and full production was ordered in Dec of '87.

It did make its public debut at Farnborough in '92, so that counts as post-Soviet, but the design and development is firmly rooted in Cold War Soviet Russia.

What I can't fathom is how anyone expects or thinks that ED would just do a minor update to the Shark and charge for it as a BS3 update... I mean... does that mean that you don't get a MWS if you don't buy the upgrade? We'll have some people flying the MWS version and some people not? Are they the same thing in the ME? It's dumb. Makes zero sense for ED to do that. Any comments supporting such an idea seem to be fear mongering and in somewhat bad taste to me.

That is EXACTLY what BS2 was. Exactly. It was borderline extortion. BS2 was a minor change to graphics, and compatibility to 1.5. If you didn't get BS2, you were stuck in 1.2. That was all it was. No new weapons, no new systems, no new missions, no new campaigns.

It's not fear mongering, nor in bad taste, if this is exactly something ED has done. As a community, we should vigilantly resist any attempt to make the cockpit updates for the Ka-50 (and A-10C) a paid update. If it is an appreciable change, i.e. a Ka-50N, then I would have no problem paying for a separate module, but expecting us to pay for the Ka-50 for a THIRD time, just so they can fix their screw up with the cockpit lighting, is totally unacceptable.

May be you guys prefer to not have it updated at all and eventually loose it with time instead of paying for an update to make it on par with the new modules ? I would glad to pay

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That's not what anyone wants, you missed the point.

I would pay $40 for another version of the Black Shark even if it was just an update for the original.

That is EXACTLY what BS2 was. Exactly. It was borderline extortion. BS2 was a minor change to graphics, and compatibility to 1.5. If you didn't get BS2, you were stuck in 1.2. That was all it was. No new weapons, no new systems, no new missions, no new campaigns.

IIRC, BS2 was a compatibility update to BS for the then new DCS World concept started with the Warthog, but, I remember being disappointed about needing to buy it since the BS was supposed to have been built with the DCS World compatibility from the get go as it hadn't been released *that* long ago before the DCSW IIRC.

But, nowadays, the module is quite old and expecting it to be constantly updated when the base system gets major graphical changes is simply not realistic at all as they're not really releasing new modules that often.

If they decide to release a "newer" version of the BS, that's all fine by me, I'll buy it.

The BS1 and BS2 copies are safe and sound in my vault, payed for and all. They enjoyment I get from the BS in its current form may be somewhat deprecated due to the lighting but it's doable.

How I would love a load of other helos in DCS, it's playing the waiting game that's realistic, regardless of the emotion it invokes. So, as one by one more helos become available, I'm just going to gobble them all up.

Looking back and be frustrated about the time passed doesn't help you. You can't influence it anymore so look ahead, pick your fights and if you look back, check out the cool things you did.

Iam also against paying for BS3 because BS1 and BS2 users, should get the update for free.

Gladly pay for a new variant and or just update.

i think the update of BS2 is free, but if BS3 is a new variant/model like alligator as an example then yea ill buy it.....after i have seen it running bug free :)

I do not know if I got my facts right but I think I am right.

If serial number 8798000025 was to be developed and deployed in DCS.

With its full RWR, laser and threat defensive suit included... (she was the test bed for the KA-52 defensive systems... I think). With its superior sensors and rotating missile defensive turrets aft of the rear wheels.... Then this BS3 would be an insta flip of the wallet for me.

360 degrees of raw threat information in the most heavily armed and agile weapon.... Fu£K yeah, if this came to be then it would be an insta flip of the wallet, no thought required and I would never look back.

But both the old and new must exist together because I think the test bed had no Abris nav system.......I think... but not sure.

What a horrible 2 team chopper squad that would be... fu£K yeah!

I do not know if I got my facts right but I think I am right.

If serial number 8798000025 was to be developed and deployed in DCS.

With its full RWR, laser and threat defensive suit included... (she was the test bed for the KA-52 defensive systems... I think). With its superior sensors and rotating missile defensive turrets aft of the rear wheels.... Then this BS3 would be an insta flip of the wallet for me.

Fingers crossed. My hope is along a similar notion, that BS3 (if it were to come) needs to offer something new operationally.

agreed, there is easy money right there for the taking!

And ED must now push the Russian tech development history in this sim like they do with the western world.

Personally, I want to see six pylons and Iglas / R-73.

Functionality on these please

By this yes I mean IRAAMs

Function for "special uplink" and addition of C-24 rockets (my favourite, there's a ballistic setting already) a happy bonus. Actually the words "No function" come up a lot in the manual so if that could get reduced that'd be swell.