Delight to Fly (after the Dora)

Have to disagree with many in this thread. The DCS version of the Spit is, without a doubt, the worst plane I have ever flown in a flight sim.

What's the data behind this statement, what is wrong broken or inaccurate, without specifics its really difficult to fix...

Have to disagree with many in this thread. The DCS version of the Spit is, without a doubt, the worst plane I have ever flown in a flight sim.

 

(I have flown it, and enjoyed it, in other sims, though.)

maybe the problem is the other sims? i cant think of any modern sim that has the spitfire in it excluding IL2, i find the spitfire in dcs an absolute delight to fly

the worst plane I have ever flown in a flight sim

No, the plane's OK. You just haven't flown too many realistic sims before, it seems.

Have to disagree with many in this thread. The DCS version of the Spit is, without a doubt, the worst plane I have ever flown in a flight sim.

 

(I have flown it, and enjoyed it, in other sims, though.)

Did you try the joystick pitch curves I suggested?

Did you try the joystick pitch curves I suggested?

Yes, I did, and thank you.

But the thing is just completely unpleasant to fly. The only flight sim model of any aircraft in any sim I have ever actively loathed. If it had been possible, I would have gotten my money back a long time ago.

I keep going back to it, though, because I really WANT to like it. But each time I do, my irritation with it and contempt for it just grows and grows.

It's a shame, really, because the Spitfiire is such an iconic warbird, and the actual pilots loved it.

Interestingly, my FAVORITE plane I have ever purchased in a flight sim is the Mig-15bis, and it has all sorts of issues: poor roll rate, all around awful performance at altitude, and a tendency to wallow at slower speeds...and yet, I still frickin love it.

What's the data behind this statement, what is wrong broken or inaccurate, without specifics its really difficult to fix...

I don't think anything's broken. I think I just can't stand the plane. I'm sure the plane is as accurate as any sim can make it.

For me, it is just as far from being "a delight to fly" as any plane I have ever flown.

No, the plane's OK. You just haven't flown too many realistic sims before, it seems.

lol

maybe the problem is the other sims? i cant think of any modern sim that has the spitfire in it excluding IL2, i find the spitfire in dcs an absolute delight to fly

A2A Simulations did a nice version of it for FSX, with all of its systems as accurately modeled as possible, and even managed to circumvent a lot of FSXs inherent limitations.

But yeah, not exactly modern.

But again, I'm sure the DCS version is as accurate a representation of the actual plane as is possible in a simulation... So my complaints, I am sure, are with the plane itself. I pity the poor pilots that had to fly it. And into battle, no less.

And this is coming from someone who actually likes the I-16 in DCS. That thing is actually fun to fly. Just the other day I was flying it around in mp wishing someone else in the server owned it so we could get an air race going.

No, the plane's OK. You just haven't flown too many realistic sims before, it seems.

The second only to DCS is probably the Spitfire in FSX. And if A2A makes one for MSFS, that'll probably be a new par.

I don't think anything's broken. I think I just can't stand the plane. I'm sure the plane is as accurate as any sim can make it.

 

For me, it is just as far from being "a delight to fly" as any plane I have ever flown.

hmm... ok ... i love to fly it, but i have always been a stick and rudder guy, if you don't it will eat you... i hate to taxi it though:)

Yes, I did, and thank you.

 

But the thing is just completely unpleasant to fly. The only flight sim model of any aircraft in any sim I have ever actively loathed. If it had been possible, I would have gotten my money back a long time ago.

 

I keep going back to it, though, because I really WANT to like it. But each time I do, my irritation with it and contempt for it just grows and grows.

 

It's a shame, really, because the Spitfiire is such an iconic warbird, and the actual pilots loved it.

 

Interestingly, my FAVORITE plane I have ever purchased in a flight sim is the Mig-15bis, and it has all sorts of issues: poor roll rate, all around awful performance at altitude, and a tendency to wallow at slower speeds...and yet, I still frickin love it.

I don't know, you still didn't say what is wrong or why you don't like spitfire.

In my opinion DCS spitfire is the best, When you slam throttle on the ground to +18 lbs boost this bird is in the air in matter of couple seconds so power full plane, turning ability is crazy, and handling in the air you just do what every you want. Since ED increased precision on rudder trim you can fly off hands you can trim it perfectly in every condition. Oh and climb rate even bf-109 k4 has hard time with it.

If ED would provide us with +24lbs version it would be the king of MP

You should try fw190 d9 this one is tough

Yeah I'm the original poster and I'm sorta wondering why you hate it so much.

I don't do much combat so is it limitations there?

As for flying I find it incredibly easy to fly, take off isn't hard and in the air it seems more responsive and less vice prone than any of the other warbirds.

Landing and taxi-ing are a bit tricky, but the Kurfurst is IMHO a far trickier proposition especially to land straight.

Sums up my thoughts. Not hard, but not easy! I haven't managed hands off trim though, that's beyond me. I find all the trims unbelievable in DCS, my experience in a light aircraft is that it tries to fly straight and level and you basically are the thing that upsets it.

Yeah I'm the original poster and I'm sorta wondering why you hate it so much.

 

I don't do much combat so is it limitations there?

 

As for flying I find it incredibly easy to fly, take off isn't hard and in the air it seems more responsive and less vice prone than any of the other warbirds.

 

Landing and taxi-ing are a bit tricky, but the Kurfurst is IMHO a far trickier proposition especially to land straight.

Sums up my thoughts. Not hard, but not easy! I haven't managed hands off trim though, that's beyond me. I find all the trims unbelievable in DCS, my experience in a light aircraft is that it tries to fly straight and level and you basically are the thing that upsets it.

And ppl who actually have flown warbirds are saying that trim works very accurate. Someone posted comparison of TF-51 vs DCS p-51 and other so called sims, and he said that trim works best in DCS

I find rudder trim very settable - it's the pitch trim that's difficult if not impossible to set to a hands off state but given the Spitfire has nearly neutral static stability that's exactly how it should be.

Love the Spitfire. I fly it more than anything else.

As for flying I find it incredibly easy to fly, take off isn't hard and in the air it seems more responsive and less vice prone than any of the other warbirds.

 

Landing and taxi-ing are a bit tricky...

I'll agree with that. The P-51 is wobbly with a mean stall at low speeds for example. I don't find spit landings difficult either. Taxiing isn't hard except one cannot look away for more than 3 seconds ...

It has a learning curve. It's a little funny to read the long threads from when it was just released, the frustration, one post "I refuse to fly it until the fm is fixed!!!".

I'll admit i pulled my hair for a month before I "got it". I absolutely couldn't taxi, takeoff or land. Now I can't believe I ever found it difficult.

I find rudder trim very settable - it's the pitch trim that's difficult if not impossible to set to a hands off state but given the Spitfire has nearly neutral static stability that's exactly how it should be.

Just curious, what physical controller do you use to set up trims? I operate them using keyboard, and in that case both wheels rotate sloooooooowly enough to fine-tune the trim with a combination of longer presses and short taps.

I suppose DCS Spit handling would be almost a non-issue if all players had access to full scale, or close to full scale replicas of its outrageously long control column. Obviously that's impossible, but I admit even my 30 cm DIY Warthog extension was enough to make flying this plane much more fun.

Just curious, what physical controller do you use to set up trims? I operate them using keyboard, and in that case both wheels rotate sloooooooowly enough to fine-tune the trim with a combination of longer presses and short taps.

 

I suppose DCS Spit handling would be almost a non-issue if all players had access to full scale, or close to full scale replicas of its outrageously long control column. Obviously that's impossible, but I admit even my 30 cm DIY Warthog extension was enough to make flying this plane much more fun.

I use buttons on my stick for trim and since ED reduced rudder trim rate via button use i find no problem in triming spitfire

Yes with standard warthog stick you need nice precision in your hand :)

I find it an absolute joy in the air - combat wise the only issue is lack of power for much of the time - got used to it's ground handling somewhat but I'd not say it's something I enjoy taxiing around. I do have a Virpil base & some Crosswind rudder pedals though.

Anyone complaining about the IX is going to have a shock if we ever get a XIV...

I find it an absolute joy in the air - combat wise the only issue is lack of power for much of the time - got used to it's ground handling somewhat but I'd not say it's something I enjoy taxiing around. I do have a Virpil base & some Crosswind rudder pedals though.

 

Anyone complaining about the IX is going to have a shock if we ever get a XIV...

lack of power?? I think you haven't flown p-51 with 100% fuel

Anyone complaining about the IX is going to have a shock if we ever get a XIV...

I did read in one of the two main Spitfire test pilots books, Henshaws or Quill that "the magic" had begun to be lost with the Griffin engine. It was too powerful.

I'd pay for a Seafire. A Spitfire with a hook. If another Spitfire is modeled, a late war pacific and Korea war Griffin Seafire would cover the biggest range. Lots of Griffin Spitfires still flying. No Spitfires landing on carriers anymore, but neither is there any Corsairs landing on carriers and we are getting a Corsair. Alternatively a second Spitfire should be a BoB Mk1. Not that I wouldn't take a mid war Seafire.

I did read in one of the two main Spitfire test pilots books, Henshaws or Quill that "the magic" had begun to be lost with the Griffin engine. It was too powerful.

 

I'd pay for a Seafire. A Spitfire with a hook. If another Spitfire is modeled, a late war pacific and Korea war Griffin Seafire would cover the biggest range. Lots of Griffin Spitfires still flying. No Spitfires landing on carriers anymore, but neither is there any Corsairs landing on carriers and we are getting a Corsair. Alternatively a second Spitfire should be a BoB Mk1. Not that I wouldn't take a mid war Seafire.

Isnt a seafire almost identical to MkIX?

A2A Simulations did a nice version of it for FSX, with all of its systems as accurately modeled as possible, and even managed to circumvent a lot of FSXs inherent limitations.

 

But yeah, not exactly modern.

 

But again, I'm sure the DCS version is as accurate a representation of the actual plane as is possible in a simulation... So my complaints, I am sure, are with the plane itself. I pity the poor pilots that had to fly it. And into battle, no less.

 

And this is coming from someone who actually likes the I-16 in DCS. That thing is actually fun to fly. Just the other day I was flying it around in mp wishing someone else in the server owned it so we could get an air race going.

A2A did a great job (as always), but I think they simplified the taxi part by using the same system as, for ex, a Mustang, by simply using the rudder pedals. Unless I missed an option to have the real behaviour. That isn't bad, though, I hate this part in DCS ;)

I'm not sure why you don't enjoy it, maybe the lack of feedback (FFB, accelerations) makes it less enjoyable but also more difficult to fly than in reality?

Do you have the same feeling with the Bf109?

Yeah I'm the original poster and I'm sorta wondering why you hate it so much.

 

I don't do much combat so is it limitations there?

 

As for flying I find it incredibly easy to fly, take off isn't hard and in the air it seems more responsive and less vice prone than any of the other warbirds.

 

Landing and taxi-ing are a bit tricky, but the Kurfurst is IMHO a far trickier proposition especially to land straight.

Let's see if I can articulate my trouble with it.

It has nothing to do with taxi, take-off or landing, or my ability to do those things. The I-16 is far more challenging in every one of those aspects, and I enjoy flying it. (Although, I do admit to some skepticism about the ground modeling of the warbirds in DCS. Like they took the RELATIVE challenges from pilot reports (i'm sure a Spit requires more care and control input than, say, the Tiger Moth or Stearman pilots of the period trained in, for instance) and cranked it up to eleven...you know, cuz it's one more than ten.)

For me, what irritates me the most about the Spit is that accelerated stall behavior. Any relatively rapid (and no matter how smoothly it's applied) deflection of the controls causes it. That vibrating stutter behavior. Freaking hate it. It doesn't drop a wing, or anything, just flutters rapidly like a sheet of crepe paper in front of a fan.

But more importantly, the thing doesn't "feel" like it's flying to me. It "feels" like a car on one of those slot car tracks you get as a kid. Like it's got it's little metal contact stuck in the groove, and is zooming around quite nicely...until you apply control pressure, then it pops it right out and goes skittering away across the track, trying to get its button back into the groove.

Compare that to the Mig15, which just seems to float. It "FEELS" like it's flying to me. (I absolutely LOVE that plane.)

But there are other things that irritate me, too. The sound of that big fan from inside the cockpit. Outside, it sounds fantastic, especially on flybys. But inside, it sounds like a little RC plane zipping around--ZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZ.

And now that I think about, THAT'S exactly how it "flies" to me. Like an RC plane. Not a heavier weapon of war, with wing mounted canons and machine guns. But like a little plastic plane with a tiny engine you have to start with a cordless power drill.

Ironically, though, I'm way better at dogfighting in it than in the Mustang, and even my beloved Mig15 (getting hits with its heavy canons and that awful sight is tough.)

Do you have the same feeling with the Bf109?

I haven't gotten either the BF109 or FW190... I haven't been able to bring myself to buy them.

The idea of 'flying' something with even an abbreviated swastika on it is way too distasteful for me, even if it is "just a video game." (And completing a campaign as one of those fellas...fuhgeddaboutit.)