FA-18C Aggressors BFM Campaign

The first engagement mission feedback

Hi,

I enjoyed this campaign with F-15C so I wanted to give it a go with F/A-18C module.

I understand it is a port from your previous campaigns and I don't have a problem with that, yet I still think there should be a little more effort to this version as Hornet and Eagle are two different types of modules.

• You have got radio presets in Hornet and yet, missions are built in a way that one would need to tweak this in Mission Planner or use manual radio inputs - which seems to be a bad use of the available feature.
   
   
  
• I liked the fact you gave waypoint name in the FAM flight, but why only INDIA is given in the combat mission. All missions should utilize waypoint names really.
   
   
  
• AI Hornet gives unrealistic fuel calls too, so a little thought to the voiceover should be given as well.
   
   
  
• BFM01 Mission Data.pdf lists wrong threats - 3x F/A-18C and not what we meet in the air.
   
   
  
• Mission briefing says that I am allowed to drop my tanks - this isn't realistic - based on what real pilots say.
   
   
  
• Mission briefing says I am allowed to refuel at the end of the exercise, but should really say I am allowed to refuel at the end of an engagement, so I know I can indeed refuel before killing all three targets without failing my mission.
   
  
• Unlimited guns?!? WHY?
  

Off-topic - I know, that it is not your fault but I really miss the boat while flying in NTTR :) -- it would be so cool to train with the UAEAF or RSAF back in the Persian Gulf!

 

[*]Unlimited guns?!? WHY?

 

Off the top of my head, I'd say it's because the scenario is intended as a teaching tool for basic fighter maneuvering skills and 5 seconds of firing time simply wouldn't be useful for what they're teaching.

 

• You have got radio presets in Hornet and yet, missions are built in a way that one would need to tweak this in Mission Planner or use manual radio inputs - which seems to be a bad use of the available feature.
   
   
  
• I liked the fact you gave waypoint name in the FAM flight, but why only INDIA is given in the combat mission. All missions should utilize waypoint names really.
   
   
  
• AI Hornet gives unrealistic fuel calls too, so a little thought to the voiceover should be given as well.
   
   
  
• BFM01 Mission Data.pdf lists wrong threats - 3x F/A-18C and not what we meet in the air.
   
   
  
• Mission briefing says that I am allowed to drop my tanks - this isn't realistic - based on what real pilots say.
   
   
  
• Mission briefing says I am allowed to refuel at the end of the exercise, but should really say I am allowed to refuel at the end of an engagement, so I know I can indeed refuel before killing all three targets without failing my mission.
   
  
• Unlimited guns?!? WHY?
  

Thanks for the feedback. We will consider the changes for the next update.

With respect to unlimited guns we decided it would be less frustrating for new users. You can always count the number of 3 sec bursts and call "Terminate" when you think you are empty.

Mission 2 first bfm...ran outta gas after the first tussle. 3 is too many imho. Need a tanker nearby.

One more thing I noticed -

When you get a kill, SHOWTIME calls COPY KILL, however, if you damage your target so that it plunges to its death, SHOWTIME does not seem to register that. I noticed I was given points, and when recycled to INDIA everything else worked as normal.

When AI crosses hard deck, no TERMINATE is given neither.

I wonder if this is the actual DCS limitation or a thing within your campaign.

 

• 
   
  
• I liked the fact you gave waypoint name in the FAM flight, but why only INDIA is given in the combat mission. All missions should utilize waypoint names really.
   
   
  

This, really caught me off guard.. After having seen all the WPTs laid out nicely in the FAM flight, i went lazy mode and put my pen and paper away just to discover that i probably should have not done so.

Also agree on the fact that radio presets should be utilized, and about missing the boat very much... glad NTTR is pretty beautiful itself though.

Unlimited ammo would be sorta realistic in a training environment since IRL you’d put the stores in SIM. In that mode the hud traces out the path of your bullets on the display. However it’s most likely impossible to do this in DCS and still register kills against the AI.

With respect to unlimited guns we decided it would be less frustrating for new users. You can always count the number of 3 sec bursts and call "Terminate" when you think you are empty.

I would prefer it to be as realistic as possible and restrict the number of rounds, i.e. no unlimited ammo please.

On top of that, Simshaker (haptic feedback device) does not work with unlimited ammo as per DCS restrictions (number of bullets does not change).

When is this campaign going to have it's own sub-folder here?

An extra 5 minutes from startup to takeoff would be nice. 10 minutes isn't really long enough if you start the bird properly following the correct procedures and bit tests. Otherwise, I'm enjoying it so far :)

An extra 5 minutes from startup to takeoff would be nice. 10 minutes isn't really long enough if you start the bird properly following the correct procedures and bit tests. Otherwise, I'm enjoying it so far :)

I agree. This is my pet peeve. I don't even think you get a full 10 minutes. It seems like the mission starts time the second engine comes online.

It's no worry if you miss your takeoff time and take a longer start-up.

UZI 2-1 (AI) will circle waypoint 2 until the player is airborne and the engagements won't start until you are at the range and call 'READY'. We needed to get the AI airborne before the player so it's timed off the autostart.

Are you saying you would like to see a 15 min STEP to Takeoff time? Getting earlier to the range won't be a problem either (if you choose to use the autostart).

Yeah 15mins to takeoff would be better. Btw, in the combat operations fence in checklist, what does VTR- check mean?

Starting up the plane and getting it to runway slightly behind Uzi 2-1 isn't hard. If it took 15 minutes for him to start taxiing it would be a little odd to me. The AI waiting for the player is probably better than the player waiting for the AI in this case.

I've completed the campaign now and one of the things that I thought I was playing through is I'm fighting the F-18 4 times and in no way is this a DACT.

I'd be tempted to change 1 pair of the F-18s to a pair of Pakistani JF-17s once it becomes available to use or maybe a pair of F-14Bs now. This can also be said of the F-15 version of the campaign where you fight 3x 15C at the start and then 2 F15E and then 2x15C near the end(although if you change the first mission to be like the start of the 18 campaign this reduces the problem somewhat, and it could be argued fighting the 15E is dissimilar, sort of).

Pre-set radio channels would definitely be a good thing. Whether or not you'd want to make use of the radio ladder for a campaign such as this is questionable and would involve having to make all new recordings for ground, tower and approach which I don't think would be needed here.

There are a few other attention to detail things I've noticed. When Uzi 2-1 is flying the F-18 when you fence in his fuel state is 12.0. There is no way that a Hornet with a single bag is still at 12.0. The 10.0 call on the fence out call could be possible as there is nothing to say he's not hit a tanker whilst we've been doing our thing. These calls would be fine for the F-15, I don't think its very accurate for the 16 either. This isn't in anyway shape of form game breaking and its probably me being a bit picky.

I mentioned previously about perhaps having blue arriving back at Nellis for those of us not exiting when we're told we can would be a neat touch.

Like I said when I completed the F-15 version of this campaign you notice EDs quirky flight model for the AI less than when you get behind the targets compared to in the F-5E and they start looping like they have infinite energy. They still have this behaviour but like the 15 its easy enough to deal with. I appreciate this being an ED problem and not something that can be sorted by campaign creators.

Overall its a fun little campaign and I'm looking forward to seeing something more from you guys.

Yeah 15mins to takeoff would be better. Btw, in the combat operations fence in checklist, what does VTR- check mean?

Ok we will update the missions to provide a 15 min STEP to Takeoff time.

The VTR - check I believe that means the HUD Tape (Video Tape Recorder).

Starting up the plane and getting it to runway slightly behind Uzi 2-1 isn't hard. If it took 15 minutes for him to start taxiing it would be a little odd to me. The AI waiting for the player is probably better than the player waiting for the AI in this case.

 

I've completed the campaign now and one of the things that I thought I was playing through is I'm fighting the F-18 4 times and in no way is this a DACT.

 

I'd be tempted to change 1 pair of the F-18s to a pair of Pakistani JF-17s once it becomes available to use or maybe a pair of F-14Bs now. This can also be said of the F-15 version of the campaign where you fight 3x 15C at the start and then 2 F15E and then 2x15C near the end(although if you change the first mission to be like the start of the 18 campaign this reduces the problem somewhat, and it could be argued fighting the 15E is dissimilar, sort of).

 

Pre-set radio channels would definitely be a good thing. Whether or not you'd want to make use of the radio ladder for a campaign such as this is questionable and would involve having to make all new recordings for ground, tower and approach which I don't think would be needed here.

 

There are a few other attention to detail things I've noticed. When Uzi 2-1 is flying the F-18 when you fence in his fuel state is 12.0. There is no way that a Hornet with a single bag is still at 12.0. The 10.0 call on the fence out call could be possible as there is nothing to say he's not hit a tanker whilst we've been doing our thing. These calls would be fine for the F-15, I don't think its very accurate for the 16 either. This isn't in anyway shape of form game breaking and its probably me being a bit picky.

 

I mentioned previously about perhaps having blue arriving back at Nellis for those of us not exiting when we're told we can would be a neat touch.

 

Like I said when I completed the F-15 version of this campaign you notice EDs quirky flight model for the AI less than when you get behind the targets compared to in the F-5E and they start looping like they have infinite energy. They still have this behaviour but like the 15 its easy enough to deal with. I appreciate this being an ED problem and not something that can be sorted by campaign creators.

 

Overall its a fun little campaign and I'm looking forward to seeing something more from you guys.

Thanks for the feedback. We did want to go up against both the Aussies and Canadians so those could be considered ACT instead of DACT missions. We can update those missions to represent that. As new planes are added to DCS we will consider growing the mission set.

We will be making more use of the PRESET radio settings and will update the mission data cards with the settings for the tankers, Nellis Tower and others.

We will also consider adding some additional traffic around Nellis if you decide to fly back.

Let us know if there are any other changes desired.

A few things I noted on my first flights:

Tanker needs the speed increased, very difficult to connect at 180 indicated.

A pre-vul tank on the tanker to the west prompts harassment from the AI wingman about being off course, and should turn for GARTH.

Panther was faster :)

I have a very strange problem. My waypoints are waaaaay off. Waypoint 1 is something like 220 miles away and in the wrong direction. And I do the correct startup and INS alignment and wait for the OK before putting it into NAV. I never had this problem before. I wonder what I do wrong? Should I enter my coordinates?

The INS bug where the GPS won't align for OPFOR and aggressor Hornets is back (or under investigation).

This is a reported work around for Open Beta 2.5.5.34108 :

Hi all, we have a work around while the team investigate this INS align issue.

 

Update INS via TCN

 

1. Coordinates of the first waypoint can be used to set own coordinates after INS align completed

a) on HSI page choose wpt 0 using PB12 "up" or PB13 "dn", then press PB14 "WPDSG"

b) on HSI page press PB7 "UPDT", press PB7 "DSG", press PB6 "ACPT"

 

2. In the case the plane has moved since start of the mission: you can use TCN position update after INS align completed

a) TACAN beacon data must be saved in MC

b) turn on the TACAN and set channel and band of the beacon, set T/R mode; you must receive bearing and range

c) on HSI page press PB7 "UPDT", press PB6 "TCN", press PB6 "ACPT"

So I have just got this Campaign..

I have complerted 1 mission but cannot complete any further missions due to the Way point all being in the wrong place in the f10 map all looks good but in the Plane WP1 is like 212.nm away from end of Nellis runway..

So I have just got this Campaign..

 

I have complerted 1 mission but cannot complete any further missions due to the Way point all being in the wrong place in the f10 map all looks good but in the Plane WP1 is like 212.nm away from end of Nellis runway..

Look at the post directly above yours for the solution.

With respect to unlimited guns we decided it would be less frustrating for new users. You can always count the number of 3 sec bursts and call "Terminate" when you think you are empty.

Will you change that for the other BFM Campaign also? F-15C and F-5E don't have unlimited guns as of yet.

So I have just got this Campaign..

 

I have complerted 1 mission but cannot complete any further missions due to the Way point all being in the wrong place in the f10 map all looks good but in the Plane WP1 is like 212.nm away from end of Nellis runway..

Hi Targanon,

Solve like that:

Update INS via TCN

 

1. Coordinates of the first waypoint can be used to set own coordinates after INS align completed

a) on HSI page choose wpt 0 using PB12 "up" or PB13 "dn", then press PB14 "WPDSG"

b) on HSI page press PB7 "UPDT", press PB7 "DSG", press PB6 "ACPT"

 

2. In the case the plane has moved since start of the mission: you can use TCN position update after INS align completed

a) TACAN beacon data must be saved in MC

b) turn on the TACAN and set channel and band of the beacon, set T/R mode; you must receive bearing and range

c) on HSI page press PB7 "UPDT", press PB6 "TCN", press PB6 "ACPT"

Or watch the preparation I make for the campaign. It works.

Good luck,

Sydy

I bought F-5E BFM and ACM Campaign and they were great.

but I did not buy FA-18C version BFM Campaign, because it is simple change F-5E to FA-18C. just a few mouse clicks in Mission Editor can make this with F-5E version. And that is why startup timing and voices are not proper in FA-18C version.

Quite a easy way to make money ED & Maple Flag! Very disappointed!