VKB Gunfighter Pro w/MCG Pro Grip - Review

I received my Gunfighter MK1 Pro with extension in the Spring of 2017 in anticipation of the new MCG Pro Grip release. I had also purchased and received a Monster Tech Extended desk mount with Gunfighter Plate. Finally in July 2018 I was able to order the new MCG Pro Grip, and have now had it and flown with it for two weeks.

VKB has since updated the Gunfighter base and named it the MKII. Main change being in the pin orientation, the male pins rather than in the gimbal base are in the grip base. I am assuming this may have been done to help reduce the chance of bending the pins upon assembly - my guess anyway. The other change was making the dry clutch adjustments easier to get to, with the Mk I one pretty much has to take the gimbal out, with the MK II can get to the adjustment screws by just removing the top plate and dust cover. Easier to adjust and test that way. I would like to have a MK II, but can't justify buying another with just those small differences.

So my review is with the MK I Gunfighter, which I have had quite some time but never used, and the brand new MCG Pro Grip. Below is a pic with it full assembled and mounted on my Monster Tech Extended desk mount. ( love their mounts).

Ok so let's get on with it. The Grip and Gunfighter both arrived in excellent packaging and very well protected. I pulled the KG12 grip that came stock on my Gunfighter, and replaced with the new MCG Pro grip. I then proceeded to their website, downloaded the necessary files to flash and also the VKB Devcfg software. Now there are two options on the software, the aforementioned VKB Devcfg or a simpler Wizzo program. Wizzo one can easily calibrate, set done zones, maybe some curves, just very basis stuff. Devcfg - well let me tell you, it can do probably a hell of a lot more than my aging mind may comprehend. It is very, and I mean very powerful and extensive in what all it can do. I used it to calibrate of course, and also changed my Gate Hat ( the round hat on lower left), which was a relative axis, to reflect 4 button presses and using it as a POV hat for my exterior views.

The Base/Gimbal:

Top view with boot and collar off.

I can't stress enough how easy it is to remove the gimbal to work with it and re-install. I remember the days of replacing the TM Cougar Gimbal with the NXT gimbal, and even just replacing springs was a very lengthy and hard process. VKB has obviously designed this gimbal for ease of removal and working with.

The heart of the gimbal. You can see my pairs of springs, #50 and #20 each axis. You can also see the dry clutches,

the white industrial strength nylon with the two brass fasteners on top there. Tightening or loosening those fasteners will give of course more or less tension on the axis movement.

I am running just a very slight amount of clutch for my WWII bird flying.

Wow, I will say I am very impressed. Gimbal is of course all metal, and smooth as a baby's butt - and I mean very smooth. And the options one has with it. First it comes with two sets of cams - #10 ( installed) soft center, and #30 Hard Center. Then the springs, you get several of the different spring tensions. I got a small bag of #10, #20, #30, and#40 springs with the Gunfighter. And with the Pro Kit with Extension I got a bag of #50 Springs. All individually bagged and labeled on bag - nice.

So I certainly have extra springs.

Springs removal - once I came across the zip tie trick for removing and installing springs, piece of cake. Also one can use a pair of springs per axis to get even a more defined feel to what one wants. I have settled on #50 and #20 on each axis, feels about right for my tastes. VKB recommends no more than #80 combined in the pair of springs.

The Cams are very nice and highly polished.

The gimbal is very easy to pull out , and both spring replacement and cam replacement is very easy. Warning however - those cams are installed with specific washers and placement, very important the orientation along with washer and nut placement be done exactly as it was. I learned the hard way, thought something was wrong with my gimbal as I was not getting full left deflection, but have since correcting it and all is well again . Best to take a picture of the exact orientation prior to removing the cam. I will say this, #10 cam is soft center ( feels very, very soft to me) and #30 is hard center ( I have read it is pretty hard). I wish they had a #20 as I think in between would be my ideal, but I understand is this is not likely.

So between the varying spring tensions and combinations, along with the cams and the dry clutches, there is quite a bit of adjustability in the gimbal one can do. I have taken that thing apart probably a dozen times by now, just tweaking and feeling to get the best feel for me. I can't say enough how easy it is to take out, change things out, and get back together. I can easily accomplish this in about a half hour.

The MCG Pro Grip:

An up close pic of the MCG Pro Grip: 24 buttons baby, some of which can be changed within the VKBDevcfg software.

The fold up trigger and the brake lever paddle, are both made of metal. Yep, all metal and very solid and smooth. Very nice touch.

I do love me buttons. It can seem a little daunting at first getting into the meat of the software, but even I was able to figure out how to turn that previosly mentioned hat into a 4 way button press hat. The software also shows a POV2, pretty sure I could also change it to a full POV hat with 8 positions if I dig a little deeper.

The shell of the grip is made from ABS, and is very stout. I hear no groaning or creaking in the grip shell even when moving my 200 mm extended Gunfight to all extremes with #50 and #20 springs. Mounting to the stick extension or base is done with same mounting mechanism, fairly easy and locks it in tight. And all those buttons, this is the shining star for me. The 4 ways plus push, the versatility of changing behavior of some of them. The Master Mode ( POV Hat by default upper middle) can serve a couple of functions. Press and Hold for three seconds, it turns into two relative axis. Press and Hold for three seconds again, it turns into POV hat again. Pretty dang swift. Plus one could with the software change it to just plain buttons, or regular axis, whatever.

Speaking of software, check out the screen shot of the axis tab. This was after me moving the stick all around.

Axis returned to exact center each time. Very nice.

The software also puts everything into the device memory, so no need to have software running. If you are a profile kind of guy, just set up a profile and load it, then shut the software down. I like that, I prefer as few programs running when I game as can.

And the black box is pretty neat ( though it is really not black lol). I just leave the black box connected to my stick, and unplug the usb cable at the end of the day from the box.

I have logged probably around 12 hours or so now flying with this new stick, and I am loving it. The versatility along with all the button options make this one a real winner in my book. I am sure I will be using it quite a bit going forward.

Now for a couple of very small negatives - I mean I have to find something to nit pick right?

The current VKBDevcfg software for the MCG grip has a little bug. If one spends some time during a session, phantom button presses can appear. These are like press and hold phantom presses. They typically start way down in the higher numbers which are not really used currently, but gradually can work up into numbers that you happen to use. This has happened to me once so far where it affected my controls I had assigned in a several hour gaming session ( or just leaving stick plugged in for several hours). A restart of the device clears them out. I understand they are well aware of this bug and are working on a fix which will hopefully come before too much longer. Not a big deal, but if stick plugged in for a length of time best to check it in the software on occasion to see and clear out if they are showing. In the meantime I am making it a habit of viewing the buttons in VKBdevcfg to insure they are not happening and clear out if are.

The previously mentioned grip locking mechanism. It is basically two round pieces ( metal ), with a v cut out in the middle (each piece has half a V). So one needs to line them up, have them vertical and facing grip, and then slide into the hole in the shaft. Sometimes for me they can be a little tough to slide in and have to work with it a bit. I have gotten now where I just loosened the screw a little to remove grip, then loosen slightly more to install grip and tighten. Not too bad really. But those pieces need to be lined up right in order for the grip to slide onto the shaft fully or it can get frustrating.

Lastly the extension - It is curved and offset to the rear to allow for mounting and having full throw forward. I believe the weight of the part of the extension that is behind the center point of the gimbal, gives a little pull on the Y axis. Not much, but just enough to appear to have a very small amount of slop right around center in that axis only. With no dry clutch dampening on that axis, it still centers perfectly. But I can feel just a little more free play area than in the X axis. This is not a problem at all for me, just an observation on my end. I thought it might be cam related, but I swapped x and y axis cams and it was still the same on the pitch axis. And again, these soft center cams I would call very soft center. So I do believe it is the weight from the part of extension behind the gimbal center point contributing to this "feel". When I am flying, I don't even notice it. Again very small thing.

The VKB Pro setup with extension coupled with the MCG Pro grip is outstanding and a fantastic piece of equipment.

I mean really fantastic! I know the delays can get long when one wants to get one on order, but they are certainly very well worth it. I would not hesitate in recommending this setup - especially with the MCG pro grip to anyone. Trust me, they are worth the wait.

And I want to tip my hat to VKB sales and support ( North America ). Dealing with rrhode has been a real pleasure, goodness knows I about wore him out with my questions I am sure, but he was always very fast to respond and answer and offer assistance even over weekends. That is top notch in my book! I hope VKB knows what a valuable asset they have with him.

If anyone has questions on any of my comments feel free to ask and I will do my best to answer. I hope this info is beneficial to anyone in the market for a stick or just curious about the Gunfighter and MCG Pro.

The most recent beta firmware solved the ghost presses for me, but I have seen reports that it still happens, just less often.

Also, I agree Rrhode is awesome... as is the rest of VKB staff. They have to be insanely busy.

The most recent beta firmware solved the ghost presses for me, but I have seen reports that it still happens, just less often.

 

 

Also, I agree Rrhode is awesome... as is the rest of VKB staff. They have to be insanely busy.

Yeah rrhode had pointed me to that also, I may have to give it a try thanks.

Thanks for the kudus, guys! I appreciate it.

Great writeup, dburne! :thumbup:

I notice it looks like you have both the grip and extension twisted all the way to the left, presumably providing nearly 30' of twist (I believe it's 15'). I fussed with it meticulously to get the stick centered (or almost) and only twisted the grip itself. You don't find it too much? And more importantly, it doesn't bother you that it isn't straight? :P Or did you just only twist the extension?

I did the same thing on mine - rotated both the grip and the extension fully to the left; for me, that's the most comfortable wrist position. :)

I notice it looks like you have both the grip and extension twisted all the way to the left, presumably providing nearly 30' of twist (I believe it's 15'). I fussed with it meticulously to get the stick centered (or almost) and only twisted the grip itself. You don't find it too much? And more importantly, it doesn't bother you that it isn't straight? :P Or did you just only twist the extension?

Hmm well ok let me think here.

I already had the grip mounted and locked to the extension at an angle. Can't remember if it was full left as has been a while since I did this. When I would remove for working on gimble I just removed the whole thing as one piece from the base. And yes when I put back on I would always twist all the way left, so I suppose you are likely correct.

I did try it with it not twisted all the way, but found for me with it all the way was most comfortable with my stick mounted in center. So I guess it is maybe 30 degrees or close.

I think it being straight would bother me as my hand is naturally coming it at an angle.

Well, yeah, that's the point of the twist for a center mounted stick. It just bothers me that it curves out to the side like that :) I can see how it might be more comfortable, though.

Very good review. I've also had one of these since release. I notice the same tendency with the grip extension for the stick to want to lag slightly rearward on the Y-axis, which concerned me at first but doesn't seem to have any practical impact in flight. Even hands off stick I see no issue.

One thing that did happen to mine recently was the base of the grip became loose and it gained about 10 degrees of clicking back and forth. Not good. This turns out to be a documented issue of a screw inside the grip backing out over time. It can be fixed in about 10 minutes (assuming you have a screwdriver that is long enough and narrow enough, I had to go get one) but it's a shame such a basic problem is occurring on a high-end piece of gear like this. In any case support was very forthright and helpful about this and any other issue I've seen.

I also have the Mk IV pedals plugged into the black box and highly recommend those as well. Super solid.

Yeah you just need to put a split washer on it. Only the early batches had that problem, they come with them now.

Yeah you just need to put a split washer on it. Only the early batches had that problem, they come with them now.

Maybe I should check, mine was out of the first run.

This turns out to be a documented issue of a screw inside the grip backing out over time. It can be fixed in about 10 minutes (assuming you have a screwdriver that is long enough and narrow enough, I had to go get one) but it's a shame such a basic problem is occurring on a high-end piece of gear like this. In any case support was very forthright and helpful about this and any other issue I've seen.

Yeah you just need to put a split washer on it. Only the early batches had that problem, they come with them now.

Could either of you post pics/video/link the the part(s) in question? Thanks.

I have the slight loose grip as well. l tried tightening up the recessed screws but was afraid to put too much force on them because I saw a report on the internal VKB forum from a guy who broke the head off one of the screws.

Edited first post to include up close pics of the Gimbal, had it apart just a bit ago to do some adjusting.

It is truly a work of art.

Could either of you post pics/video/link the the part(s) in question? Thanks.

This is the page I found that covered it all in detail and was exactly right.

http://forum.vkb-sim.pro/viewtopic.php?t=2883

If mine backs out again (this took about 50 hours of use to manifest in the first place) I'll just Locktite it.

Oh, you're talking about a different part than what I thought you were (I think?). Not sure if what I said applies to it, then. I just remember the early batches were "loose" in certain spots and they rectified it with split washers, of which mine has several. I haven't taken those structural screws out or messed with them, but I also don't have any looseness or wobble, she's rock solid for me.

This is the page I found that covered it all in detail and was exactly right.

 

http://forum.vkb-sim.pro/viewtopic.php?t=2883

 

If mine backs out again (this took about 50 hours of use to manifest in the first place) I'll just Locktite it.

Thanks!

Oh, you're talking about a different part than what I thought you were (I think?). Not sure if what I said applies to it, then. I just remember the early batches were "loose" in certain spots and they rectified it with split washers, of which mine has several. I haven't taken those structural screws out or messed with them, but I also don't have any looseness or wobble, she's rock solid for me.

Interesting, I got in on the first batch of Gunfighters - however only started using it when I got the MCG Pro grip couple of weeks ago.

So far I have not noticed this issue, at least will know what is going on now if it does creep up.

The mentioned structural issues are with MCG grips - and ghost buttons due firmware issue, not due DevCfg software.

Gunfighter base has trouble with a bolt a bit longer in first batch - corrected in the next, and some users manage to bend follower bearing bolt using two #50 springs combined with extension.

The mentioned structural issues are with MCG grips - and ghost buttons due firmware issue, not due DevCfg software.

Certainly just DevCfg is where you see what is going on with the buttons showing pressed.

In any event they happen, and viewing in DevCFG is where you can tell when it is starting to happen and restart the device to clear them out before they get up into used button numbers which would cause a problem.

Certainly just DevCfg is where you see what is going on with the buttons showing pressed.

In any event they happen, and viewing in DevCFG is where you can tell when it is starting to happen and restart the device to clear them out before they get up into used button numbers which would cause a problem.

I keep hearing about this and it must suck, but funny enough my MCG (not pro) on my Gladiator MKII base works perfectly. I've probably spent at least 8 hours flying with it in DCS and never once had an unwanted button press. Only issue I had was with the 16-tempo limit (I'm using 24) causing weird things to happen, but with the C version firmware that's no longer an issue.

I would have thought if there would be any serious problems with firmware it would have been the Gladiator, as it is older and has a ton of it's own buttons where as the Gunfighter is just a gimbal.

I'm curious if you've ever tried changing USB ports/types or a powered USB hub. I had ghost presses with my X-55, and using a powered USB hub solved that problem (before that, working the USB ports like a 1940s telephone switch-board sometimes worked).

I keep hearing about this and it must suck, but funny enough my MCG (not pro) on my Gladiator MKII base works perfectly. I've probably spent at least 8 hours flying with it in DCS and never once had an unwanted button press. Only issue I had was with the 16-tempo limit (I'm using 24) causing weird things to happen, but with the C version firmware that's no longer an issue.

 

I would have thought if there would be any serious problems with firmware it would have been the Gladiator, as it is older and has a ton of it's own buttons where as the Gunfighter is just a gimbal.

 

I'm curious if you've ever tried changing USB ports/types or a powered USB hub. I had ghost presses with my X-55, and using a powered USB hub solved that problem (before that, working the USB ports like a 1940s telephone switch-board sometimes worked).

I don't want this little issue to sound like a bigger deal than it is and overshadow my very positive review, cause it really is not that big a deal. And it should absolutely not give hesitation to anyone considering buying the Gunfighter and/or MCG grip. When it happens it starts out at the highest of button numbers which does not affect anything and sometimes it gradually works up toward the lower numbers that may be used. So far there has been only one time that it actually effected one of my assigned buttons, and that was when I had spent several hours in a gaming session and had not paid any attention to it. And I use the thing pretty much on a daily basis so I have many hours in with it already. Probably I am in a minority in how much time I spend in combat flight sims on a weekly basis.

Yes I do run my controllers through a powered USB Hub. It is an acknowledged issue which I know they are already making progress on in some beta firmware.

Base on my usage with it I would highly recommend to anyone looking to get a great stick and grip to seriously look at the Gunfighter with the MCG pro grip. I love the Pro grip for all the extra buttons. I would absolutely not let this small issue give any hesitation on a decision to get one, and I am confident here in the near future there will be a firmware update that totally takes care of it.

Agreed. When you wait many months for a product you paid a chunk of money for, any issue is frustrating -- but on the whole I've been more than satisfied with my GF/MCG Pro and the level of customer support.

I should mention the latest firmware by VKB (1_94_B) so far seems to have fixed the phantom button press issue I was seeing. Have had it several days now and not had them again.