Aluminum Donkey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Greetings Earthlings Has anyone had any luck playing with the damper? I know the key combo is LAlt+1, but all it does is press the upper left button of the 6 autopilot buttons. The light on the button stays on, and nothing happens, the plane doesn't handle any differently. Autopilot Reset has no effect either. I haven't had any luck pulling Cobras in the MiG, and figured the damper is the culprit, but I can't seem to turn it off :) Any ideas? Is this a feature to be implemented in the future, or am I ignoring/forgetting something? AD Kit: B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller. --Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way! If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Hold L-ALT+9 (iirc) for 3 seconds. All the lights will go out and the warning will kick in. It's no fun, trust me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aluminum Donkey Posted October 12, 2018 Author Share Posted October 12, 2018 Hold L-ALT+9 (iirc) for 3 seconds. All the lights will go out and the warning will kick in. It's no fun, trust me. Woohoo, thanks so much! I was figuring it was something like that right after I posted the message :) AD Kit: B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller. --Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way! If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aluminum Donkey Posted October 12, 2018 Author Share Posted October 12, 2018 It's no fun, trust me. You kidding me, that was a hoot :) Kit: B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller. --Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way! If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyforDCS Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Is it on or off by default? Current specs: Windows 10 Home 64bit, i5-9600K @ 3.7 Ghz, 32GB DDR4 RAM, 1TB Samsung EVO 860 M.2 SSD, GAINWARD RTX2060 6GB, Oculus Rift S, MS FFB2 Sidewinder + Warthog Throttle Quadrant, Saitek Pro rudder pedals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vatikus Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 ON Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icebeat Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 why L-ALT+9 instead of LAlt+1, and what is the name of the keybinding command? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow KT Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 why L-ALT+9 instead of LAlt+1, and what is the name of the keybinding command? Go to your settings and press L-Alt + 9 and you will find out how it is called 'Shadow' Everybody gotta be offended and take it personally now-a-days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Jockey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 (edited) Hello again, When one engages: "stick deflection limiter" (key Y) "Reset / DAMPER disable" (keys LAlt + 9, for more than 3 secs.) I can't quite understand what exactly happens in therms of: - pitch ; - Angle of Atack limits ; - instantaneous turn-rate. edit: Is the "Y" function for the MIG-29, the same as the "S" for the Su-27 ? Edited October 12, 2018 by Top Jockey Hangar FC3 | F-14A/B | F-16C | F/A-18C | MiG-21bis | Mirage 2000C ... ... JA 37 | Kfir | MiG-23 | Mirage IIIE Mi-8 MTV2 system i7-4790 K , 16 GB DDR3 , GTX 1660 Ti 6GB , Samsung 860 QVO 1TB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Hello again, When one engages: "stick deflection limiter" (key Y) "Reset / DAMPER disable" (key LAlt + 9, for more than 3 secs.) I can't quite understand what exactly happens in therms of: - pitch ; - Angle of Atack limits ; - instantaneous turn-rate. Open the controls indicator (RCTRL-ENTER) and watch what happens when you pull the stick right back - you'll see the plane pushing back against the stick. Disabling the deflection limiter turns this off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Jockey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 (edited) Open the controls indicator (RCTRL-ENTER) and watch what happens when you pull the stick right back - you'll see the plane pushing back against the stick. Disabling the deflection limiter turns this off. Very good reference to understand what this system does! I believe it tries to limit the maximum AoA to 26º or something. In my case there must be some kind of bug, as to keep the limiter disabled, I must keep the key pressed all the time... Edited October 12, 2018 by Top Jockey Hangar FC3 | F-14A/B | F-16C | F/A-18C | MiG-21bis | Mirage 2000C ... ... JA 37 | Kfir | MiG-23 | Mirage IIIE Mi-8 MTV2 system i7-4790 K , 16 GB DDR3 , GTX 1660 Ti 6GB , Samsung 860 QVO 1TB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Same here - I think it's supposed to be a temporary override (which suggests the real-life control might be found on the HOTAS), and if we want to shut it off completely it's RALT-9 for 3 seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Jockey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Same here - I think it's supposed to be a temporary override (which suggests the real-life control might be found on the HOTAS), and if we want to shut it off completely it's RALT-9 for 3 seconds. Now I'm confused here... Shouldn't it be Left Alt instead ? Either way are you saying that it's the same as keeping the key "Y" pressed all the time ? Hangar FC3 | F-14A/B | F-16C | F/A-18C | MiG-21bis | Mirage 2000C ... ... JA 37 | Kfir | MiG-23 | Mirage IIIE Mi-8 MTV2 system i7-4790 K , 16 GB DDR3 , GTX 1660 Ti 6GB , Samsung 860 QVO 1TB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Something-ALT :) Either way are you saying that it's the same as keeping the key "Y" pressed all the time ? Yes, but if you do the plane will start complaining at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Jockey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Something-ALT :) Yes, but if you do the plane will start complaining at you. Yeah it also disables every auto-pilot and some sort of flight stability modes. Hangar FC3 | F-14A/B | F-16C | F/A-18C | MiG-21bis | Mirage 2000C ... ... JA 37 | Kfir | MiG-23 | Mirage IIIE Mi-8 MTV2 system i7-4790 K , 16 GB DDR3 , GTX 1660 Ti 6GB , Samsung 860 QVO 1TB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aluminum Donkey Posted October 12, 2018 Author Share Posted October 12, 2018 Now I'm confused here... Shouldn't it be Left Alt instead ? Either way are you saying that it's the same as keeping the key "Y" pressed all the time ? Nope. Pressing Left-Alt +9 for 3 seconds disables the pitch damper, which a part of the autopilot that's normally always on by default. There will be a constant "beep-beep-beep" warning tone, and the red caution light will stay on--you have to mute it by pressing R_Shift +N. Now, the MiG will be very 'twitchy' in pitch response. Tiny fore-and-aft movements of the stick, especially at low speeds, result in the plane trying to bite its own tail off :) Pretty entertaining, but not well-suited for normal flight, including dogfighting. Pressing Y (or a mapped button) to disable the stick deflection limiter has nothing to do with this--its an entirely different function. It overrides the stick kicker--a device which bumps the flight stick forward when exceeding a certain AoA, about 25-28 degrees I believe. You have to hold Y or the button down to override it--in the real MiG-29, it's accomplished by the pilot pulling back very hard on the stick to force it past the limiter. So, the two functions are entirely separate. AD Kit: B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller. --Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way! If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Ah, so 'Y' just disables the 'kicker' thingy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Jockey Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Nope. Pressing Left-Alt +9 for 3 seconds disables the pitch damper, which a part of the autopilot that's normally always on by default. There will be a constant "beep-beep-beep" warning tone, and the red caution light will stay on--you have to mute it by pressing R_Shift +N. Now, the MiG will be very 'twitchy' in pitch response. Tiny fore-and-aft movements of the stick, especially at low speeds, result in the plane trying to bite its own tail off :) Pretty entertaining, but not well-suited for normal flight, including dogfighting. Pressing Y (or a mapped button) to disable the stick deflection limiter has nothing to do with this--its an entirely different function. It overrides the stick kicker--a device which bumps the flight stick forward when exceeding a certain AoA, about 25-28 degrees I believe. You have to hold Y or the button down to override it--in the real MiG-29, it's accomplished by the pilot pulling back very hard on the stick to force it past the limiter. So, the two functions are entirely separate. AD Ok, indeed I did get the impression that it were two different functions, but didn't understood the exact nature of each one. About the "stick deflection limiter", Lixma 06 already explained. Regarding the "pitch damper", I didn't know what it did exactly. Yes the red caution light appears, and the audio warning tone does also. So we can say that the disabling the "pitch damper", allows an higher instantaneous turn rate ? Part of the doubt is because these two functions are in some ways similar, they both allow to "push" the limits of normal flight - something that in an F-16 for instance is somewhat restrained. Hangar FC3 | F-14A/B | F-16C | F/A-18C | MiG-21bis | Mirage 2000C ... ... JA 37 | Kfir | MiG-23 | Mirage IIIE Mi-8 MTV2 system i7-4790 K , 16 GB DDR3 , GTX 1660 Ti 6GB , Samsung 860 QVO 1TB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lixma 06 Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 So we can say that the disabling the "pitch damper", allows an higher instantaneous turn rate ? It's basically the 'Let me do a Kobra' switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svend_Dellepude Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 IRL you just pull harder on the stick to override the deflection limiter. To simulate this in game you have to hold 'Y' while having the stick past the threshold. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Win10 64, Asus Maximus VIII Formula, i5 6600K, Geforce 980 GTX Ti, 32 GB Ram, Samsung EVO SSD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aluminum Donkey Posted October 12, 2018 Author Share Posted October 12, 2018 Ok, indeed I did get the impression that it were two different functions, but didn't understood the exact nature of each one. About the "stick deflection limiter", Lixma 06 already explained. Regarding the "pitch damper", I didn't know what it did exactly. Yes the red caution light appears, and the audio warning tone does also. So we can say that the disabling the "pitch damper", allows an higher instantaneous turn rate ? Part of the doubt is because these two functions are in some ways similar, they both allow to "push" the limits of normal flight - something that in an F-16 for instance is somewhat restrained. Disabling the pitch damper doesn't allow you to turn tighter. What the damper does is reduce the pitch 'wobbling' (oscillating) by damping it out using the control surfaces. So, the plane flies more smoothly when making pitch inputs. Like the Flanker, it's on by default. The MiG is capable of a very high rate of pitch change, and it oscillates a lot without it, so it's normally left on all the time when the plane is being flown. That's why you hear the warning when it's off. The only reason to disable it is if there's a problem with the autopilot. But if you want, you can fly without it--L_Alt+9 for 3 seconds. The 29 is really 'hairy' in pitch without it :) AD Kit: B550 Aorus Elite AX V2, Ryzen 7 5800X w/ Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 SE, 2 x 16GB Kingston Fury DDR4 @3600MHz C16, Gigabyte RTX 3070 Windforce 8GB, EVGA SuperNova 750 G2 PSU, HP Omen 32" 2560x1440, Thrustmaster Cougar HOTAS fitted with Leo Bodnar's BU0836A controller. --Flying is the art of throwing yourself at the ground, and having all the rules and regulations get in the way! If man was meant to fly, he would have been born with a lot more money! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VC Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 Is the pitch "kicker" the cause of the nose bouncing around a turn? E.g. if I hold the stick hard back I get a very fast instantaneous turn, followed by a pause, then hard turn resumes, repeat. Also, are either of these functions restricting pitching down? It seems once you go above ~1,000 km/h IAS you can hold the stick all the way forward and the plane barely reacts, you can just about get it into a slow dive after holding the stick forward for a dozen seconds. I assume this is a feature but I want to understand better what's going on. VC =X51= Squadron is recruiting! X51 website: https://x51squadron.com/ Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/d9JtFY4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironhand Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 ... Also, are either of these functions restricting pitching down? It seems once you go above ~1,000 km/h IAS you can hold the stick all the way forward and the plane barely reacts, you can just about get it into a slow dive after holding the stick forward for a dozen seconds. I assume this is a feature but I want to understand better what's going on. From Yo-Yo. It's about the 5th or 6th sentence down... https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3651693&postcount=22 YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCU1...CR6IZ7crfdZxDg _____ Win 10 Pro x64, ASUS Z97 Pro MoBo, Intel i7-4790K, EVGA GTX 970 4GB, HyperX Savage 32GB, Samsung 850 EVO 250 GB SSD, 2x Seagate Hybrid Drive 2TB Raid 0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudikoff Posted October 14, 2018 Share Posted October 14, 2018 (edited) From Yo-Yo. It's about the 5th or 6th sentence down... https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3651693&postcount=22 I'm no expert, but I don't see a direct explanation on why the plane gives only a few degrees of negative pitch deflection on the horizontal stabilators. There's this line: IAS and altitude dependant gear ratio from the stick to stabilator;, but I've experienced the same limits at different speed and altitudes. Edited October 14, 2018 by Dudikoff i386DX40@42 MHz w/i387 CP, 4 MB RAM (8*512 kB), Trident 8900C 1 MB w/16-bit RAMDAC ISA, Quantum 340 MB UDMA33, SB 16, DOS 6.22 w/QEMM + Win3.11CE, Quickshot 1btn 2axis, Numpad as hat. 2 FPH on a good day, 1 FPH avg. DISCLAIMER: My posts are still absolutely useless. Just finding excuses not to learn the F-14 (HB's Swansong?). Annoyed by my posts? Please consider donating. Once the target sum is reached, I'll be off to somewhere nice I promise not to post from. I'd buy that for a dollar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VC Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 (edited) From Yo-Yo. It's about the 5th or 6th sentence down... https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3651693&postcount=22 This is fine, but I release the stick and the nose doesn't pitch up. I know there's another post much more recently in that thread about trim taking up the available travel of the stabiliser, but as far as I'm aware I wasn't trimmed or on autopilot. Edit: looks like yo-yo was talking about low altitude, I wasn't low. Edit 2: re-read and got the explanation on page 15 of the main FM thread. Edited October 15, 2018 by VC VC =X51= Squadron is recruiting! X51 website: https://x51squadron.com/ Join our Discord: https://discord.gg/d9JtFY4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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