Can fuel gauge always be on?

Hi

My fuel gauge always shows empty. If I click the test button it works.

Is there a switch that I'm missing?

Cheers!

CptT

That gauge only shows the level of the bottom tank.

I think he's asking if there is a way to have it always "active" instead of having to press it. I'd like to know too.

Nope, there's no way. That's how the gauge works.

I think he's asking if there is a way to have it always "active" instead of having to press it. I'd like to know too.

Ahh right got it. I tried to set it as an axis but it did not work. I guess we are stuck with it.

So there was no way for pilots to monitor their fuel use "passively"?

That seems like a weird way to design it. I guess they would have their fuel usage running through their heads according to how long they were up?

Seems like such an obvious gauge to have.

Kinda weird thats true, it is a british plane after all, they used to build stuf different haha.

Or it was what was technically possible/cost efficient 75 years ago :)

Seriously? You have to push a button to see how much fuel you have? I cannot think of any way that makes sense.

Seriously? You have to push a button to see how much fuel you have? I cannot think of any way that makes sense.

You've got to realize that ergonomics were born after WWII from these kinds of anomalies. Someone had a great engineering idea, or it was just more reliable this way with the components they had back then. During and after WWII people realized that mishaps might get reduced by designing the cockpit for an actual human being.

In the Mk. I they had to throw rocks out the cockpit to check their altitude. The clock is a residual altitude gauge.

The gauge is labelled as only being accurate when level - maybe it's to stop the mechanism being damaged by wild fluctuations in level as the plane manoeuvres - or so you have to consciously check it, which means you'll consciously orient he aircraft to allow a correct reading.

I still don't get why the mustang and spitfire

have mirrors and the Dora does not ?

Clearly it wasn't an operationally critical issue as this was a developed version of the Spitfire. I have a feeling the matter might have had considerably more attention if it was an issue.

It could also be said that if you took off on a sortie not knowing what your expected fuel usage was going to be you ought to be staying on the ground until you'd done your planning properly, and knew exactly when you would reach bingo fuel! It's why there's a clock - which wasn't provided so you'd know when the bar opened.

Clearly we don't do much mission planning in DCS World, but does that mean we should cheat with stuff like fuel gauges?

I still don't get why the mustang and spitfire

have mirrors and the Dora does not ?

Because the dora was always the hunter and not the prey :lol:

Because the dora was always the hunter and not the prey :lol:

Or because if it had Spit or Mustang on its six it was a lost cause anyway. Better to have a quick death than hopelessly watching it coming and claiming its prey :lol:

On the topic of the fuel gage. I guess it wasn't a real issue to hit that button. Another point is a part of the fuel gage I guess the same as maybe not even more important was keeping a track on the time of the flight.

Regarding the Fuel Contents button debate, I'm going to quote two interesting posts from the A2A forums talking about it:

The Spitfire is quite an old design by WW2 standards (first Type 300 flew in 1936) and the accelerated development and tight budget Reginald Mitchell and Joe Smith were under forced them to take design decisions that may just have been common practice at the time. Keep in mind that back in those days, there were no norms nor unified design standards, which ironically makes WW2 one of the richest (and most fascinating) periods of history in terms of aircraft design diversity. I distinctly remember funny design choices in other aircraft of the time (like the infamous Yak-1's fuel quantity gauge being placed ON the wing itself or the Tiger Moth's fuel quantity indicator looking like some kind of thermometer placed on top of the biplane's upper wing).

1. The fuel gauge is electric and therefore a "consumer". The Early Spitfires had a "live" system..the Accumulator (battery) was hard wired to the system without a master switch and so any active consumer ...fuel gauge... would drain the accumulator if left "on" all the time. Every single consumer has a switch of its own. Which leads to the second part...why not an on off toggle?

 

2. Necessity....you don't need it as any more than a guide Many WW1 Scouts had no fuel gauge.. this era of aircraft were designed by pilots/designers familiar with that generation of aircraft. .the pilot knew what time he took off and how long he could fly for. The big spinning thing at the front and the "Absence of Sound Indicator" tend to give ample notice that you have run out of fuel. IMHO no sane pilot trusts a fuel gauge as any more than as a guide in any case. Cessna specifically acknowledge this by making their fuel gauges accurate to within +/- 500 Gallons on their light aircraft.

There were a lot of new design ideas and kit introduced into the Spitfire and Hurricane MkI's that had never been seen before in RAF fighters up to that point in time (mid 1930's).

 

It's easy to say "why wasn't that used..?" when you have an additional 80 years of hindsight in your favour!

 

Remember that the Air Ministry that governed the commission and supply of equipment to the RAF was not a flawless organisation (they gave the Boulton-Paul Defiant the go-ahead for production and squadron service for example) - it had to bow to pressures from government influences at times, and like everything else had to adhere to budget constraints.

The fact that you have to push a button to get a reading of a fuel tank contents may seem odd today, but it was the 'norm' back then. HOTAS and cockpit ergonomics didn't exist. Pilots pulled levers and pushed buttons. It was in the small print of their contract. It was the technology of the day.

 

They also had spare light bulbs to put in to the reflector gunsight if the current light bulb failed. Imagine having to deal with that in the middle of a dogfight so you can have a chance of shooting accurately again. Suddenly a fuel tank reading push button isn't such a big deal!

 

These were interceptors, short range defence aircraft. Standing patrols for hours on end weren't their intended business. They carried mere seconds worth of gun ammunition, so combat persistence wasn't in their design 'CV'. Short, quick missions with quick turn-arounds and back in the air was their forte. Plus, because of their range and how the RAF fighter defence network was set up around the coast of England, generally you were never that far from a military airfield of some kind (RAF, Navy, fighter, bomber, training or otherwise).

Some of their contemparies in other air forces elsewhere in the world had to put up with fuel gauges that consisted of a wrist watch worn by the pilot.

 

The original MkI's when delivered had WWI vintage ring and bead gunsights. They also had 2-blade fixed pitch props. The landing gear had to be pumped as it wasn't electric driven. Within 3 years all this had changed because technology had moved on and was readily available.

Most of the RAF pilots flying the early MkI's had never flown an aircraft with retractable flaps or undercarriage before - the indicators in the wings helped as a visual reminder (but sometimes failed as the pilots went in 'biplane mode' - i.e. thinking the wheels were always down!).

 

The original Spit's and Hurri's went through an incredible amount of mods and upgrades in their relatively short service life. New kit and upgrades were continuously introduced at a factory/manufacturing level, and eventually these enhancements would filter down to be added at an individual RAF squadron level. Some were introduced with ease and after only a few hours maintenance on the ground, while others had to wait till specific servicing schedules allowed due to the complexity of the work.

As a result, it was not unheard of to (for example) line up 6 aircraft for a formation training flight at the start of the day, and each aircraft would have differences in the instrument panel and cockpit controls to each other. There was no 'service standard'. All of this would be documented in the aircraft log (Form 700 Series) so the pilot signing for any aircraft would be aware of it's current state and equipment prior to climbing aboard though

Source: https://a2asimulations.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=49691

Thanks Charly for that superb explanation. I was one of those scratching my head about this oddity but now makes perfect sense in the contex of the era.

Talking about the battery being hard-wired, is that why there isn't a battery switch? It seems a little odd that there is no way of switching off the system. I take it that this is just another of those quirks of a developing technology?

Yup.

This guage was used on several different types of aircraft, e.g. Hurricane. you would select a tank, say port wing, then press the button. Then select stbd. tank and press the button and so on... This removed the need for multiple guages.

..

As a former owner of an Austin Mini (not this horrible new BWM junk thay call Minis these days), I prefer English made electrical systems to only be activated when needed.

OT - For what is used this "wiring harness smoke" in cars?

See a video of guy "recharging" the jar, but don't get a clue about the usefulness of this. :)

Is April fools? :D

When your wiring harness runs out of smoke you need to replace it. ;)

Back to the spit fuel gauge, I wonder if it was a bit worrying to have a live circuit always going to the tank? Anyone know the exact mechanism of the gauge?

I think it also true to say that the RAF was very poor on ergonomics. The compass is a prime example, look at a Bf109 and you will see the compass on the panel in front of the pilot. Now look at a Spit or Hurri, the compass is on the floor behind the stick so you have to lean sideways to see it. Same with all the switches and levers, in an RAF fighter they are all just jammed in to whatever space they found, maybe under the seat or hidden behind something else while the LW ones are neatly laid out where they can be accessed easily.