Next possible module that has no MFD

Attention. The Q-5II in the poll, I actually meant Q-5III.

Before you start get all excited, I am not connected with Deka and this is only a wishlist thread for friendly discussion and a place to express our desire for certain planes. The choice is still Deka's.

While Deka hasn't decide their next project or module yet, some of their members did express some desire of making an older plane which has no MFD, and it should be a unique plane.

So I dug around and came up with the following:

1：J-12 Li Xiangyang

In the late 60s, China wanted to have a new fighter that can out match the MiG-19 and MiG-21 (mainly MiG-21F-13 since it was the only variant known to the public) in all aspect. It should be able to outmaneuver the MiG-19, at the same time must be able to out-accelerate and out-climb the MiG-21.

At the time, the Chinese Air force was experimenting a new type of air battle doctrine know as "People's Air War", a spin off of the "People's War" Doctrine. In People's War doctrine, in case of invasion, the military should give weapons such as rifles and grenades to the people to arm the people. So when situation needed or when opportunity present itself, people can take arms against invaders. This doctrine worked well during the WW2 and the Civilian war. Whenever enemy enters a location, the people are civilian by day, guerrillas fighters by night. Since most of the Communists pilots were once upon a time such an guerrillas fighter, they came up with this People's air war doctrine where the state will design a simple, easy to maintain fighter that can take off from farms and must be small enough to hide in the barn. And the state will distribute those fighters to the people so whenever an foreign fighter enters Chinese air space, people can just take off and intercept them. The enemy won't even know where did the interceptors come from.

Since the fighter is design to fight this new air guerrilla war, it was named Li Xiangyang, a well know WW2 communist guerrilla war hero on one of the well known TV series at the time. Li Xiangyang is actually an artistically created composite character mainly based on the life of war hero Guo Xin (please see pictures below)

Picture 1: Li Xiangyang on the popular TV series

Picture 2: Guo Xin

Since Li Xiangyang always uses 2 Mauser C96 pistols, he was giving a nicky name "Twin gunner". Therefore, J-12 was giving 2 cannons, 1 in 23mm (120 rounds) and another in 30mm (80 rounds). 2 wing tip pylons was also giving for the PL-2B missiles (probably the equivalent of the AIM-9E).

Later, the design requirement was changed since it was obvious, in contemporary warfare, an aircraft must have BVR search capability is essential for all weather operations, a radar was added to the design.

The aircraft has a climb rate of 180m/s, a ceiling of 17410m, but due to its small size and weight (3.1 ton), it only has a max speed of 1.5 mach and a max range of 1167km without external tanks. (And even with all external tanks, it can only have a range of 1358km). And it only need less than 500 meters for take off. It had fulfilled all the initial requirements. However, the People's Air War doctrine was eventually gave up be the air force because it is highly unpractical and uneconomical. Since the range is so short, if you give this plane to villagers, it can only be used to protect the village and maybe a few other villages and towns close by. Spending millions of yuan just to protect a few villages isn't considered a good way to use tax payer's money. If you want to protect the whole nation with fighters like those, even the US today probably doesn't have that kind of money. At the same time, a few J-8s with professionally trained pilot can do the job better with much lowered cost by comparison (Due to J-8's long-range and 2.2 mach top speed, 2.4 mach if you ignore the safety protocal). Therefore, the air force eventually gave up on the J-12. But nevertheless, it was still a cool concept. Just image if it was implemented and everybody has their jet fighters. That is some good world setting for the future Final Fantasy Game right there.

2: La-11

This is probably the first fighter aircraft that had entered the PLAAF service in mass. It was used in Korea War by Chinese Air force against US P-51s and F4Us. Say, someone is making F4U as we speak, right?

3: IL-10

Good old beast used by PLAAF in Korea War. If PLAAF had started to use Q for their attacker designation at the time, this will no doubt to be the Q-1.

4: Tu-2

Used mainly in Korea War, withdraw from the service after H-5 entered the service.

Now the following planes I had already mentioned in my previous thread. If you want more info about them please see the link https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=249861

5: J-5A

The Chinese variant of MiG-17PF.

Unlike the Soviet MiG-17 variants, between the radar, missiles, and cannons, you can only have 2 of them, but never all of them. For example: MiG-17F has missile and cannon, but no radar; MiG-17PF has radar, cannon but no missiles; and MiG-17PM has missile and radar but no cannon.

But for J-5A (please see picture below), it has 3x23mm, a radar and 2 hardpoints for PL-1(K-5) and PL-1B(K-55) missiles.

6: J-6III

A unique variant of Chinese MiG-19 with redesigned wings and air intake to increase climb rate, maneuverability and speed.

7: J-8I

It is the first true Chinese designed plane. It is a high-altitude, high-speed interceptor that was designed to go after any strategic recon planes like the U-2 and any strategic bombers that may threaten the nation's safety.

It has amaximum speed of Mach 2.2, a service ceiling of over 20,000m, a sea-level climb rate of 200m/s, and a combat radius of 750~1,000km.

The J-8E is the final variant of the the J-8I series and all domestic variants of J-8I have been upgraded to J-8E standard.

J-8E is equiped with a type 204 (JL-7) mono-pulse fire-control radar, SM-8A aeronautical optical gun-sight, onboard computer, new cockpit panel, and redesign ejection escape system and oxygen supply system. The original two Type 30-I 30mm cannons were replaced by two Type 23-III 23mm cannons. The four under-wing stores stations are capable of carrying the more advanced PL-5 series short-range AAM. These aircraft were also fitted with an improved electronic countermeasures (ECM) suite including KJ-8602B all-aspect radar warning receiver (RWR).

8: Q-5III

Q-5 is an attacker plane design by China during the cold war.

Q-5III is the most iconic and internationally most widespread version. And it is the first variant equiped with an all aspect RWR.

Crew: One

Wingspan: 9.68m

Length: 16.727m

Height: 4.19m

Empty weight: 6,400kg

Normal take-off weight: 9,530kg

Max take-off weight: 11,317kg

Max weapon payload: 2,000kg

Max speed: Mach 1.12 (sea level) or Mach 1.5 (10,975m)

Range: Ferry range less than 2,000km with two drop tanks, combat radius 400km on a lo-lo-lo attack mission with maximum warload, or 600km on a hi-lo-hi attack mission with maximum warload

Service ceiling: 16,500m

9: Q-5D

The best variant in service.

introduced during the 1996 Taiwan Strait Crisis, the separate doppler navigation system and GPS of the Q-5C was replaced by the DG-1 integrated doppler navigation/GPS system. Other systems included the ALR-1 Laser rangefinder/Marked Target seeker and QHK-10 Head Up Display. A new weapon aiming sight, the SH-1II, replaced the older SH-1I, and No. 5311 Factory managed to successfully integrate this sight with the new laser range finder and Type 205 navigation radar.

Some unconfirmed images indicates that this variant of Q-5 is upgraded to equip a new targeting pod to guide laser guided bombs.

10: H-5

If this is made, it will be the first dedicated bomber of the DCS series.

It can be used to simulate a variety of scenario from 60s to 90s.

Since it is long out of service, there wouldn't be any issues from the government.

Now, I know some of you may want to ask, where is J-7. Well, J-7G is most iconic variant in Chinese J-7 designs now. And it has a lot of MFDs :P

So if you love that one, feel free to leave a comment here and vote in this link below.

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=249861

i would love to vote my friend but i would love to see more modern fighter

JF-17 / F-16c / F-14 / F/A-18c / M-2000c ( EF coming )

AV-8B / Viggen / A-10c / ( F-15E coming )

Cold war

Mig-19P / F-5E / Mig-15bis / Mig-21bis / F-85F / ( Mig-23 coming and more i think )

8 WWII planes

i would vote for more modern fighters

but for Fun i would Vote for Q-5

J-5A seem to be the best option for now.

I’m always on the minority it seems .. my vote is for the La-11 .. easier to develop and would be a good adversary to Fw-190A and Bf-109 on the Caucasus .. hopefully Deka could provide a few ww2 redfor ground assets, to enable the creation of believable missions.

I’m always on the minority it seems .. my vote is for the La-11 .. easier to develop and would be a good adversary to Fw-190A and Bf-109 on the Caucasus .. hopefully Deka could provide a few ww2 redfor ground assets, to enable the creation of believable missions.

Even more is that the Fighter Collection bought a La-11. There’s a picture from the 90s that shows it wasn’t in good condition. It would be amazing if it was able to be restored

Only thing about J-5A is K-55 missiles, it’s such an unusual loudout with the three 23mm and radar, it’s like a jack of all trades and master of none.

I voted Q-5D becuase I think it would be the most flexible attacker, however if I voted again I would change to J-8I. however without BVR missiles it is limited to PL-5. Hopefully it would come into its own once there is A-7 and A-6 released, as it’s speed will be great for intercepting attackers, and the western planes will have to protect and escort these attackers. I’m pretty sure it’s manueversbilty is not so good, but it has twice the guns of the MiG-21bis, just 23mm but still a lot of firepower in a short burst. I used to think it was quite ugly, but some pictures make its fuselage neck look long and slender and perhaps even elegant

Q-5D or Q-5III

Its a bit like a PLAAF Jaguar in a sense would certainly be the most popular

the H-5 would be so usefull to so many scenarios and missions.. besides a true bomber, twin engine, old school.. so, so cool!

Before you start get all excited, I am not connected with Deka and this is only a wishlist thread for friendly discussion and a place to express our desire for certain planes. The choice is still Deka's.

 

While Deka hasn't decide their next project or module yet, some of their members did express some desire of making an older plane which has no MFD, and it should be a unique plane.

 

So I dug around and came up with the following:

 

 

 

1：J-12 Li Xiangyang

 

In the late 60s, China wanted to have a new fighter that can out match the MiG-19 and MiG-21 (mainly MiG-21F-13 since it was the only variant known to the public) in all aspect. It should be able to outmaneuver the MiG-19, at the same time must be able to out-accelerate and out-climb the MiG-21.

 

 

 

 

 

 

At the time, the Chinese Air force was experimenting a new type of air battle doctrine know as "People's Air War", a spin off of the "People's War" Doctrine. In People's War doctrine, in case of invasion, the military should give weapons such as rifles and grenades to the people to arm the people. So when situation needed or when opportunity present itself, people can take arms against invaders. This doctrine worked well during the WW2 and the Civilian war. Whenever enemy enters a location, the people are civilian by day, guerrillas fighters by night. Since most of the Communists pilots were once upon a time such an guerrillas fighter, they came up with this People's air war doctrine where the state will design a simple, easy to maintain fighter that can take off from farms and must be small enough to hide in the bar. And the state will distribute those fighters to the people so whenever an foreign fighter enters Chinese air space, people can just take off and intercept them. The enemy won't even know where did the interceptors come from.

 

 

 

Since the fighter is design to fight this new air guerrilla war, it was named Li Xiangyang, a well know WW2 communist guerrilla war hero on one of the well known TV series at the time. Li Xiangyang is actually an artistically created composite character main based the life of war hero Guo Xin (please see pictures below)

 

Picture 1: Li Xiangyang on the popular TV series

 

 

 

 

Picture 2: Guo Xin

 

 

 

 

Since Li Xiangyang always uses 2 Mauser C96 pistols, he was giving a nicky name "Twin gunner". Therefore, J-12 was giving 2 cannons, 1 in 23mm (120 rounds) and another in 30mm (80 rounds). 2 wing tip pylons was also giving for the PL-2B missiles (probably the equivalent of the AIM-9E).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Later, the design requirement was changed since it was obvious, in contemporary warfare, an aircraft most have BVR search capability is essential for all weapon operations, a radar was added to the design.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The aircraft has a climb rate of 180m/s, a ceiling of 17410m, but due to its small size and weight (3.1 ton), it only has a max speed of 1.5 mach and a max range of 1167km without external tanks. It had fulfilled all the initial requirements. However, the People's Air War doctrine was eventually gave up be the air force because it is highly unpractical and uneconomical. Since the range is so short, if you give this plane to villagers, it can only be used to protect the village and maybe a few other villages and towns close by. Spending millions of yuan just to protect a few villages isn't considered a good way to use tax payer's money. If you want to protect the whole nation with fighters like those, even the US today probably doesn't have that kind of money. At the same time, a few J-8s with professionally trained pilot can do the job better with much lowered cost by comparison. Therefore, the air force eventually gave up on the J-12, and not many of those were made (who cares, so is the Ka-50 in DCS)

 

 

 

2: La-11

 

This is probably the first fighter aircraft that had entered the PLAAF service in mass. It was used in Korea War by Chinese Air force against US P-51s and F4Us. Say, someone is making F4U as we speak, right?

 

 

 

 

3: IL-10

 

Good old beast used by PLAAF in Korea War. If PLAAF had started to use Q for their attacker designation at the time, this will no doubt to be the Q-1.

 

 

 

 

4: Tu-2

 

Used mainly in Korea War, withdraw from the service after H-5 entered the service.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now the following planes I had already mentioned in my previous thread. If you want more info about them please see the link https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=249861

 

 

 

5: J-5A

 

The Chinese variant of MiG-17PF.

 

Unlike the Soviet MiG-17 variants, between the radar, missiles, and cannons, you can only have 2 of them, but never all of them. For example: MiG-17F has missile and cannon, but no radar; MiG-17PF has radar, cannon but no missiles; and MiG-17PM has missile and radar but no cannon.

 

But for J-5A (please see picture below), it has 3x23mm, a radar and 2 hardpoints for PL-1(K-5) and PL-1B(K-55) missiles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

6: J-6III

 

A unique variant of Chinese MiG-19 with redesigned wings and air intake to increase climb rate, maneuverability and speed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

7: J-8I

 

It is the first true Chinese designed plane. It is a high-altitude, high-speed interceptor that was designed to go after any strategic recon planes like the U-2 and any strategic bombers that may threaten the nation's safety.

 

It has amaximum speed of Mach 2.2, a service ceiling of over 20,000m, a sea-level climb rate of 200m/s, and a combat radius of 750~1,000km.

 

The J-8E is the final variant of the the J-8I series and all domestic variants of J-8I have been upgraded to J-8E standard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

8: Q-5III

 

Q-5 is an attacker plane design by China during the cold war.

 

Q-5III is the most iconic and internationally most widespread version. And it is the first variant equiped with an all aspect RWR.

 

 

 

 

Crew: One

 

Wingspan: 9.68m

 

Length: 16.727m

 

Height: 4.19m

 

Empty weight: 6,400kg

 

Normal take-off weight: 9,530kg

 

Max take-off weight: 11,317kg

 

Max weapon payload: 2,000kg

 

Max speed: Mach 1.12 (sea level) or Mach 1.5 (10,975m)

 

Range: Ferry range less than 2,000km with two drop tanks, combat radius 400km on a lo-lo-lo attack mission with maximum warload, or 600km on a hi-lo-hi attack mission with maximum warload

 

Service ceiling: 16,500m

 

 

 

 

 

9: Q-5D

 

The best variant in service.

 

introduced during the 1996 Taiwan Strait Crisis, the separate doppler navigation system and GPS of the Q-5C was replaced by the DG-1 integrated doppler navigation/GPS system. Other systems included the ALR-1 Laser rangefinder/Marked Target seeker and QHK-10 Head Up Display. A new weapon aiming sight, the SH-1II, replaced the older SH-1I, and No. 5311 Factory managed to successfully integrate this sight with the new laser range finder and Type 205 navigation radar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Some unconfirmed images indicates that this variant of Q-5 is upgraded to equip a new targeting pod to guide laser guided bombs.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

10: H-5

 

If this is made, it will be the first dedicated bomber of the DCS series.

 

It can be used to simulate a variety of scenario from 60s to 90s.

 

Since it is long out of service, there wouldn't be any issues from the government.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, I know some of you may want to ask, where is J-7. Well, J-7G is most iconic variant in Chinese J-7 designs now. And it has a lot of MFDs :P

 

So if you love that one, feel free to leave a comment here and vote in this link below.

 

 

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=249861

Thank you for your post, very informative.

, i would vote the q-5D

if I voted again I would change to J-8I. however without BVR missiles it is limited to PL-5. Hopefully it would come into its own once there is A-7 and A-6 released, as it’s speed will be great for intercepting attackers, and the western planes will have to protect and escort these attackers. I’m pretty sure it’s manueversbilty is not so good, but it has twice the guns of the MiG-21bis, just 23mm but still a lot of firepower in a short burst. I used to think it was quite ugly, but some pictures make its fuselage neck look long and slender and perhaps even elegant

I remember back in the Sino-West honeymoon period, China invited US experts to come to China and help upgrade Chinese aircrafts. There was this Bridgate General or Colonel or something like that from the US airforce come to help with the J-8 upgrade. After he saw J-8, his immediate reaction was loving it for its long and slender fuselage and can't wait to test it out himself. "You guys have designed one beautiful machine" he said. But as soon as he saw the cockpit, his smile faded away and replaced by this expression of disbelieve. After test fly, he told his Chinese counterpart "Flying this thing is like driving a Limo with willy Jeep's control. I can't believe you guys are still using such old avionics."

By the way, what do you mean A-6? I heard about A-7 in the making for DCS. You mean somebody is making A-6 too? That's awesome.

Q-5D or Q-5III

 

Its a bit like a PLAAF Jaguar in a sense would certainly be the most popular

I don't know. Jaguar looks more like a tactical bomber than an attacker though.

Thank you for your post, very informative.

, i would vote the q-5D

Thank you. I am glad you are enjoying it.

There might be a slight possibility of having a SU-30MKK as next module, it seems Deka granted access to some ac documentation as they stated somewhere in the Russian forum. Chinese version of course, idk the differences against the Russian version

Yeah wouldn’t have mentioned A-6 lol, but I also forgot about there will be a Mirage F1.

There might be a slight possibility of having a SU-30MKK as next module, it seems Deka granted access to some ac documentation as they stated somewhere in the Russian forum. Chinese version of course, idk the differences against the Russian version

That would be awesome if Su-30MKK is ever made. The Red side could use a twin seat fighter now that the blue side has F-14.

I voted for the Q-5D, but honestly I'd be happy with any between the J-5/Q-5/H-5/J-8. The J-6 is a bit more eh to me considering we already have a Mig-19P and should get the -S at some point, I think there are more interesting possibilities right now.

Guys how about J7, F7PG

Guys how about J7, F7PG

That’s a lot like just a slightly older JF-17, UI cockpit very similar. Not to mention they don’t want to do anything with MFD, one that is older and analog would be nice but again we have other great fighters of that era and size in DCS like the MiG-21/23. I don’t see a modern or old J-7 as being something as different or unique as the other options. Or let me phrase it like this, J-7 would add the least amount of unique gameplay to DCS

It would be great to have it eventually, but I would be a little sad if turns out to be their next plane, and I don’t think I would be alone

Guys how about J7, F7PG

Read the topic before comment

There might be a slight possibility of having a SU-30MKK as next module, it seems Deka granted access to some ac documentation as they stated somewhere in the Russian forum. Chinese version of course, idk the differences against the Russian version

I'd be mighty excited for that where did they say it and can they give their response on if a Su-30MKK (or any flanker)

is indeed in the cards

That’s a lot like just a slightly older JF-17, UI cockpit very similar. Not to mention they don’t want to do anything with MFD, one that is older and analog would be nice but again we have other great fighters of that era and size in DCS like the MiG-21/23. I don’t see a modern or old J-7 as being something as different or unique as the other options. Or let me phrase it like this, J-7 would add the least amount of unique gameplay to DCS

 

It would be great to have it eventually, but I would be a little sad if turns out to be their next plane, and I don’t think I would be alone

J-7G and its unique wing can offer a huge amount of unique gameplay to DCS though.

Except it has a lot of MFDs though. I'd love to have J-7G once Deka decide to get back on that MFD horse. I choose J-7G over any of those MiG-21 variants any day of the month.

That picture is a F-15C cockpit

I much prefer any LATE variants of J-8 looks like a sleek challenging plane that needs even more speed than Mig 21 to land. Well...any J-8...still hoping for later variants of it.

Also its doable module.

That picture is a F-15C cockpit

Thanks for point that out. When I saw the picture, I was suspicious of it too.

Man I had hard time finding a cockpit picture of J-7G. So far the only one I can find is the civilian airshow version of it, which has no radar nor weapon.

I don't know but I see Tu-2 to be interesting for the whole WW2 era of DCS. And while I don't fly those, I am a sucker to twin engine aircrafts like Tu-2.

But considering there would come a cold war jet fighter too, difficult to choose.

How far was the J-12 developed and refined?

How far was the J-12 developed and refined?

The development of J-12 was completed. The only reason it was given up by the airforce was due to its short range and the impractical doctrine behind its creation.

I want to see them do a Mig-25PD or PDS