Absha Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) So, let's try to convince you with my broken english as to why the EC665 should be the next project. 1. : It's the next logical step from the Gazelle. As the Gazelle is the primary trainer (with the EC-120) for French Army pilots, the next logical step would be a Puma, a Caracal, a NH-90 or a Tiger. Plus, the Tiger being the Gazelle's (Bo-105's) brother-in-arms & replacement, it's an evident continuity for Polychop's work & it'd be a must-have co-op experience. 2. : OH-58 the best co-op helicopter ? Meh. Forget the OH-58, you'd do the greatest coop with the Tiger & Gazelle (or Bo-105), creating offensive action with up to many many players in an immersive & realistic experience. And just imagine having a BPC Mistral to complete the picture ? 3. : You could learn aviation to people from A to Z From the French Army's single-engine simple trainer to the bi-engine super-modern attack helicopter, you'd do the humanity some good by learning to people - how to destroy their neighborhood - the mighty science of flying an helicopter. And not only is it accessible to people (unlike those fighters or heavy helicopters), it's also fun & it contain weapons like in CSGO. Plus, see point 2 about coop. 4. : Learn about German, Spanish & French culture Yes. Our respective armies are somewhat ... cool when it comes to documents. Almost everything, not to say everything, is accessible on the very internet you use. And for other more secret-y things, you could always ask a german, spanishman or frenchman. Like me. (Yes, that's skis under the wheels) 5. : It's not that restricted Contacting the French, Spanish or the German army is not really that complicated and convincing them & Eurocopter to let us have this marvellous helicopter, only takes some wine. It's a small price to pay compared to jail. Edited October 29, 2017 by Absha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilWillis Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 I don't think the Tiger is a particularly well known airframe. It does tick boxes as far as flexibility is concerned, but when you compare it to the other helicopters it is up against, it falls short of being the right choice. I also think it would attract far less sales than other more widely used, and better known examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimitriov Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) It's more a matter of classified content, even if a Tiger would be a real nice addition, I'm afraid that it is entirely classified at the moment. There is a huge difference between the French and American way of thinking dealing with weaponry documents. While you'll be able to find the Ah-64 or the F-18 manual on internet in 3 clicks, the Dassault Mystere for example is still entirely classified. So don't count too much on our last high-end helicopter to appear in DCS soon, sorry to break hopes, everyone including poly devs would like to bring a tiger to DCS. Perhaps in 5 years. Not now. ;) Edited October 29, 2017 by dimitriov Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absha Posted October 29, 2017 Author Share Posted October 29, 2017 (edited) Why are you thinking ahead of developers and market ? The question is : what do you want ? Not : By a rational mind & taking economical event into account, what kind of non-fixed aircraft would commercialy-speaking concievable on a military flight simulation ? Especially when it comes to : I also think it would attract far less sales than other more widely used If you want it, others want it. Pretty simple. Guys, if the developpers said it's an option, it's an option. Don't overthink ahead of them. Dassault Mystere for example is still entirely classified Nope. And you know, french community really knows about how much Dassault can be a pain in the ass when it comes to flight simulator. They do not want any kind of products in our simulators. It stopped one famous FS dev from working (Roland Laborie, Rollus13). When he did the Rafale, Dassault put it to a complete & brutal stop. Also, there was this fan-made simulator in 2007. And some freeware projects about the Mirage IV, the 2000, and the list goes on. And still, what do we have here ? A Mirage 2000. And Restauravia did a complete & nice model of the Mirage III & F1. And those two planes are coming on DCS ... see ? Plus, we're not talking about Dassault but Eurocopter, and while it's still hard, they're way more open-minded than Dassault ever was. And yes, you can find technical manual, also tactical one and military documents on the internet. We even have an official source : http://www.dircam.dsae.defense.gouv.fr/ Again, say what you want, not what you think will work. Edited October 29, 2017 by Absha premature send Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueMax Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Please don t even think of such a thing, before there is a usefull COBRA in game. And will they implement the problems in real life, which this nonsense heli has, into the game too ? a clear : NO TIGER.. but an angry COBRA 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stryker2000 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Another up vote for the AH-1W Cobra. Hydra rockets, Hellfire missiles, 20mm cannon, proven battlefield record, a fearsome platform when you can't have an Apache. Team Red wish MiG-23/27, Su-17/22, Su-24, Su-30 C, Yak-130, Tu-16, Tu-95, Tu-22M Team Blue want AH-1W, AH-64, Alphajet, A-4, Jaguar, Tornado, F-16, A-6, A-7, F-111, F-15E, B-52, B-1B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esac_mirmidon Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Why dont you mention SPAIN. France, Germany and PLEASE, Spain has the Tiger also. Spanish culture is not cool enough? " You must think in russian.." [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Windows 7 Home Premium-Intel 2500K OC 4.6-SSD Samsung EVO 860- MSI GTX 1080 - 16G RAM - 1920x1080 27´ Hotas Rhino X-55-MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals -Track IR 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absha Posted October 29, 2017 Author Share Posted October 29, 2017 Why dont you mention SPAIN. France, Germany and PLEASE, Spain has the Tiger also. Spanish culture is not cool enough? ... or the Australia for that matter. No, it's just my ignorance, because i didn't know Spain had it & even the Bo-105. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esac_mirmidon Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 We are partners of the Eurocopter Tiger from the beggining. " You must think in russian.." [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Windows 7 Home Premium-Intel 2500K OC 4.6-SSD Samsung EVO 860- MSI GTX 1080 - 16G RAM - 1920x1080 27´ Hotas Rhino X-55-MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals -Track IR 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absha Posted October 29, 2017 Author Share Posted October 29, 2017 We are partners of the Eurocopter Tiger from the beggining. Corrected. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esac_mirmidon Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Thanks mate. " You must think in russian.." [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Windows 7 Home Premium-Intel 2500K OC 4.6-SSD Samsung EVO 860- MSI GTX 1080 - 16G RAM - 1920x1080 27´ Hotas Rhino X-55-MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals -Track IR 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindeye_03 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 If we don't get the cobra, I wouldn't mind the Tiger. I want a bluefor gunship and not another scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow KT Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 (edited) 2. : OH-58 the best co-op helicopter ? Meh. Forget the OH-58, you'd do the greatest coop with the Tiger & Gazelle (or Bo-105), creating offensive action with up to many many players in an immersive & realistic experience. And just imagine having a BPC Mistral to complete the picture ? Sooooo, having only 2(3) modules "co-operating" with each other only via voice communications is better than actually being needed and directly co-operating by scouting and lasing for literally all the modules that can use laser guided GBUs (F-18C, F-14B, AV-8B N/A, F-4E, M2KC, F-5E, A-10C), which is 7 modules. Not to mention any future gunship choppers like the AW-1. In a dynamic battlefiled (if not attacking static targets), most of these planes NEED an external laser designator and scouter to do their job. The Kiowa is much more than a scout. It can certainly enflict a lot of pain as well. I am all for a gunship after that But, hey I guess my logic is flawed xD Nice effort on the thread tho +1 Edited October 30, 2017 by Shadow KT 'Shadow' Everybody gotta be offended and take it personally now-a-days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FragBum Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 Yes but the emmm Mi-24. :thumbup: Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment. Gazelle Mini-gun version is endorphins with rotors. See above. Currently rolling with a Asus Z390 Prime, 9600K, 32GB RAM, SSD, 2080Ti and Windows 10Pro, Rift CV1. bu0836x and Scratch Built Pedals, Collective and Cyclic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuiGon Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 (edited) Nope. And you know, french community really knows about how much Dassault can be a pain in the ass when it comes to flight simulator. They do not want any kind of products in our simulators. It stopped one famous FS dev from working (Roland Laborie, Rollus13). When he did the Rafale, Dassault put it to a complete & brutal stop. Also, there was this fan-made simulator in 2007. And some freeware projects about the Mirage IV, the 2000, and the list goes on. And still, what do we have here ? A Mirage 2000. And Restauravia did a complete & nice model of the Mirage III & F1. And those two planes are coming on DCS ... see ? Plus, we're not talking about Dassault but Eurocopter, and while it's still hard, they're way more open-minded than Dassault ever was. And yes, you can find technical manual, also tactical one and military documents on the internet. We even have an official source : http://www.dircam.dsae.defense.gouv.fr/ Again, say what you want, not what you think will work. That's pretty naive. The Mirage2000C and even more so the III and F1 are older aircraft with older technology and they are not in service anymore in the french air force. The Tiger is a much more modern aircraft with highly advanced avionics. I very much doubt it will be easy to get enough information to create that bird and bring it to DCS standards, let alone a official license. Yes, Eurocopter is not Dassault, it's not even entirely a french company, but these kind of things are not easier on the german side. Having said that, I want to remind on this quote: Hi guys, About the license negotiations with Airbus I can not reveal any direkt info to anybody at the moment. What I can tell you though is, that I am in direct contact with the highest officials for such negotiations with Airbus. Next level would be the CEO himself ;) Well yes our primary is the gazelle at the moment and the main part of our negotiations but I can tell you that we talk about the bo105 and another helo of thier current product line at the moment too. I can not say anything about the 3rd helo, but if we get a full clearance you all will have something nice to play with ;) Enough said about that I guess Have an awesome day as we try to have that every day Sincearly Sven Edited October 30, 2017 by QuiGon Intel i7-12700K @ 8x5GHz+4x3.8GHz + 32 GB DDR5 RAM + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poly_Phil Posted October 30, 2017 Share Posted October 30, 2017 Plus, we're not talking about Dassault but Eurocopter, and while it's still hard, they're way more open-minded than Dassault ever was. And yes, you can find technical manual, also tactical one and military documents on the internet. We even have an official source : http://www.dircam.dsae.defense.gouv.fr/ Again, say what you want, not what you think will work. What does a NOTAM website become an official source to you? What kind of useful information do you think you are getting out of that? My question is genuine. Consultant - Beta Tester http://www.polychop-sims.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absha Posted October 30, 2017 Author Share Posted October 30, 2017 What does a NOTAM website become an official source to you? What kind of useful information do you think you are getting out of that? My question is genuine. It isn't a NOTAM website, it's the official website for all OAT flights & aircraft in France. Thus, you can ask information about everything that military flies to them and i can assure you they'll answer 99% of time positively, even for tech infos. I did it for some modders in the FSX/P3D french community for some french navy operational aircrafts (it may be why they answered positively, idk). The fact is you can even open some backdoors really easily with them. Some of them are simulation enthusiast flying on DCS or IVAO (if you know the network ?). It's one source to consider. That's pretty naive. The Mirage2000C and even more so the III and F1 are older aircraft with older technology and they are not in service anymore in the french air force. Mirage 2000C is still in service in the FAF. And the stories i'm telling you were from 2007, the F1 was still in service and the IV was just out from service. The III was indeed out of service for quite some time in the FAF ... but not in the Swiss Air Force. And still, we could negotiate with them for all of these projects. All you need is to ask them BEFORE, have some people in your contacts & pretty much anything is feasible. I'm not naive, you know i've been in this very business for quite some time. Searching for infos in France is really not that difficult, and asking the CEO of "who-knows-company", is not either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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