R-27ER Experiment & Findings

couple patches ago I did a test with a flanker launching at me and I still got missile warnings when the ER was defeated and past me and the bandit had turned cold :D ...go figure

There is a 4 second delay with the RWR memory.

... I read somewhere that the R-27ER has some type of midcourse link (radio?) with the launch platform.

This is not modeled in FC, right?

There is a 4 second delay with the RWR memory.

Pretty sure that's 7 seconds unless they changed it recently :)

Yes, it is. The M-link is there to guide the missile into a range where the seeker can pick it up.

This is superior to say, AIM-7M which had to be able to lock onto the reflection of the target right after it was launched - this also means that its range is limited by the target's RCS in come cases.

This is not modeled in FC, right?

Yes, it is. The M-link is there to guide the missile into a range where the seeker can pick it up.

 

This is superior to say, AIM-7M which had to be able to lock onto the reflection of the target right after it was launched - this also means that its range is limited by the target's RCS in come cases.

So how come ER/R sometimes go ballistic when the opponent releases chaff and the radar lock is maintained through out?

Chaff should influence it only after SARH's own seeker gets activated and not during the "M-link" phase, right?

Please correct me if I am wrong.

At that point chaff would influence the guiding radar. Which is not modeled in DCS - the CM rejection model is very simple :)

Consider that the DSR cue for a sparrow is 20nm more or less vs fighters though, so your ER is probably tracking with its own seeker within 40km of the target.

So how come ER/R sometimes go ballistic when the opponent releases chaff and the radar lock is maintained through out?

 

Chaff should influence it only after SARH's own seeker gets activated and not during the "M-link" phase, right?

 

Please correct me if I am wrong.

At that point chaff would influence the guiding radar. Which is not modeled in DCS - the CM rejection model is very simple :)

 

Consider that the DSR cue for a sparrow is 20nm more or less vs fighters though, so your ER is probably tracking with its own seeker within 40km of the target.

Please don't get me wrong, but how is the "M-link" modeled then if the R-27 starts picking up reflections with it's own seeker at 40km out?

Is it like the "M-link" goes until 40km or it's like there are chances that it will either follow the link instructions or start tracking on it's own?

It's probably a bug of some sort right, I mean missile locking on to chaff right off the rail is there probably to compensate for the simple CM model.

Reason why I am asking this question is that AIM-120 seems to follow this "first link guidance, then self home in" principle quite nicely. Is there a possibility of AIM-120 fired in STT mode, to experience same "lock-on" to chaff at 40km behavior? Then again I am guessing that it doesn't start tracking any returns until it's own radar kicks in.

Please don't get me wrong, but how is the "M-link" modeled then if the R-27 starts picking up reflections with it's own seeker at 40km out?

 

Is it like the "M-link" goes until 40km or it's like there are chances that it will either follow the link instructions or start tracking on it's own?

The m-link has a maximum range, yes, but the point of it is to guide the missile until it picks up the target with it's own seeker.

It's probably a bug of some sort right, I mean missile locking on to chaff right off the rail is there probably to compensate for the simple CM model.

I'd consider it a bug beyond certain ranges. In any case, there are known issues, as mentioned in this thread and others.

Reason why I am asking this question is that AIM-120 seems to follow this "first link guidance, then self home in" principle quite nicely. Is there a possibility of AIM-120 fired in STT mode, to experience same "lock-on" to chaff at 40km behavior? Then again I am guessing that it doesn't start tracking any returns until it's own radar kicks in.

There is a possibility, but it's rather low. ARH missiles definitely have an on/off state for their seeker, I don't know if SARH do.

Count failed missiles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b16tEPfuvU=13m20s