Hummingbird Posted December 18, 2017 Author Share Posted December 18, 2017 (edited) Based on everything that I've seen, we do have to keep in mind that RAZBAM hasn't really confirmed they'll make the II+ (though it's fairly likely). Knowing RAZBAM and their update cycle, combined with that of ED's (we still need proper ground radar), I'd wager we could be waiting up to two or so years for a II+ to come out. I mean, I don't think the II+ is as similar to the N/A as people expect. It hasn't even got the same flight performance. And so I wait with excitement, but not the expectation that it'll be coming soon. Aside from being abit heavier I don't see any reason that the aircraft wouldn't behave the same flight wise. The real are of work would be programming all the systems connected with the radar. As such I suspect RAZBAM could model the II+ rather quickly once ED release their ground mapping radar code, as most of the ground work is already done with the AV-8B. And by quickly I mean ~6 months. Edited December 18, 2017 by Hummingbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSp33dy123 Posted December 18, 2017 Share Posted December 18, 2017 (edited) I agree with you on how long it would take. That said, what will RAZBAM's priorities be? I'm not 100% in the loop on this, but it's my understanding that the M-2000C wasn't even properly finished until very recently. Before they attempt at modelling the II+, they'll probably release another module (or at least do them concurrently, which would slow both of course). I mentioned the flight performance as it was probably the simplest issue, illustrating just how far the differences go. Re-tuning of the flight model, extensive cockpit logic updates... at least they won't have to touch the DMT, hah. This is my question: does the effort of modelling the II+ compensate for the perhaps reduced reward? Why shouldn't RAZBAM just make new bespoke modules? Personally I really want them to make the II+, but will it be cost-effective for them to give it to N/A owners for free, or if they charge a large amount for it, will people buy it? I guess I'm just being pessimistically skeptical here. Perhaps the argument could be made that just out of sheer love for the Harrier and the DCS community RAZBAM will make it, and I guess I can't argue with that. Edited December 18, 2017 by MrSp33dy123 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 18, 2017 Author Share Posted December 18, 2017 IMO if they make it they should charge customers in accordance with how time consuming it was to make, which would automatically mean it would be significantly cheaper than the released AV-8B NA, retailing at perhaps 20-25 dollars. Which seems fair enough to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fargo007 Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 I don't mind paying a fair price for a good product, and don't care either way. If they make it, I'll be flying it. For me it's that simple. Have fun. Don't suck. Kill bad guys. https://discord.gg/blacksharkden/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudikoff Posted December 19, 2017 Share Posted December 19, 2017 IMO if they make it they should charge customers in accordance with how time consuming it was to make, which would automatically mean it would be significantly cheaper than the released AV-8B NA, retailing at perhaps 20-25 dollars. Which seems fair enough to me. That would make sense, but only for the owners of the other module. i386DX40@42 MHz w/i387 CP, 4 MB RAM (8*512 kB), Trident 8900C 1 MB w/16-bit RAMDAC ISA, Quantum 340 MB UDMA33, SB 16, DOS 6.22 w/QEMM + Win3.11CE, Quickshot 1btn 2axis, Numpad as hat. 2 FPH on a good day, 1 FPH avg. DISCLAIMER: My posts are still absolutely useless. Just finding excuses not to learn the F-14 (HB's Swansong?). Annoyed by my posts? Please consider donating. Once the target sum is reached, I'll be off to somewhere nice I promise not to post from. I'd buy that for a dollar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge55 Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 That would make sense, but only for the owners of the other module. I agree, if you already have the AV-8B N/A you can pick up the + version for 50% off otherwise it would be full price. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] i7 10700K OC 5.1GHZ / 500GB SSD & 1TB M:2 & 4TB HDD / MSI Gaming MB / GTX 1080 / 32GB RAM / Win 10 / TrackIR 4 Pro / CH Pedals / TM Warthog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 (edited) That would make sense, but only for the owners of the other module. It should ofcourse only be the price for the people who already own the AV-8B NA, for those who don't own the first one and want both the 20-25 dollars should be added on top to pay for the combined development time. Edited December 20, 2017 by Hummingbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 Why should a module be cheaper for those that own another module? How does this make sense? Has anyone ever bought a car that was cheaper because they already owned a similar model of that car? ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 (edited) Why should a module be cheaper for those that own another module? How does this make sense? Because if its the same basic aircraft that they already bought, just with some added equipment, then it would be rather unfair to charge the same price once again for some extra content that took much less time to make. In short these should be the purchase options IMO: AV-8B N/A = 60 dollars AV-8B+ for N/A owners = 20 dollars Combined pack: AV-8B N/A & AV-8B+ = 80 dollars (60 + 20) Edited December 20, 2017 by Hummingbird Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krupi Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 It entirely depends on how much time and effort is required to use the ground radar DCS is developing, if it is simply plug and play with little change then yes it should be what €10-€15 a bit more work, increase the price perhaps... I would be monumentally pissed off if it was ever released as a new aircraft. Windows 10 Pro | ASUS RANGER VIII | i5 6600K @ 4.6GHz| MSI RTX 2060 SUPER | 32GB RAM | Corsair H100i | Corsair Carbide 540 | HP Reverb G2 | MFG crosswind Pedals | Custom Spitfire Cockpit Project IX Cockpit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tackle Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 Did the Marines get a discount because McDonnell Douglas sold them the N/A already? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 Did the Marines get a discount because McDonnell Douglas sold them the N/A already? Pretty illogical comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hummingbird Posted December 20, 2017 Author Share Posted December 20, 2017 It entirely depends on how much time and effort is required to use the ground radar DCS is developing, if it is simply plug and play with little change then yes it should be what €10-€15 a bit more work, increase the price perhaps... I would be monumentally pissed off if it was ever released as a new aircraft. ED might be the ones who develop how the radars detect and map stuff (i.e. how radar waves are modeled etc), but it will still be the third party devs task to model the actual systems used to operate the radars of their own aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge55 Posted December 20, 2017 Share Posted December 20, 2017 Why should a module be cheaper for those that own another module? How does this make sense? Has anyone ever bought a car that was cheaper because they already owned a similar model of that car? Look at it like a DLC for game you already own, perhaps that helps it make more sense. :thumbup: [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] i7 10700K OC 5.1GHZ / 500GB SSD & 1TB M:2 & 4TB HDD / MSI Gaming MB / GTX 1080 / 32GB RAM / Win 10 / TrackIR 4 Pro / CH Pedals / TM Warthog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miasma Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Has there been any more word on us getting the Plus version? I would love a sea harrier FA2 but doubt we will ever get one, best chance of getting something similar is the AV8B Plus then I will just make an FA2 Skin Royal Navy Tomcat skin now live: https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/?CREATED_BY=miasma&set_filter=Y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harlikwin Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 There was some mention on the Discord, that maybe once ED gets the hornet radar figured out they might do it since its the same radar. I'd be curious how code portable some of the various parts of the code like the TPOD are. It would make some sense for them to be, and maybe the radar is the same sort of thing. New hotness: I7 9700k 4.8ghz, 32gb ddr4, 2080ti, :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, HP Reverb (formermly CV1) Old-N-busted: i7 4720HQ ~3.5GHZ, +32GB DDR3 + Nvidia GTX980m (4GB VRAM) :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, Rift CV1 (yes really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadogPL Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 Yes, harrier with radar would be nice... Also waiting for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harlikwin Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I mean I'm not sure how much the avionics differ beyond the obvious no DMT and radar instead and the attendant A/A stuff, and removal of A/G stuff. The FM is likely a bit different due to weight/aerodynamics changes. At a guess it would its own module. But yes several countries like Italy and Spain operated the +, so it might be cool to offer it as module with its own ski-jump carrier(s) at some point. New hotness: I7 9700k 4.8ghz, 32gb ddr4, 2080ti, :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, HP Reverb (formermly CV1) Old-N-busted: i7 4720HQ ~3.5GHZ, +32GB DDR3 + Nvidia GTX980m (4GB VRAM) :joystick: TM Warthog. TrackIR, Rift CV1 (yes really). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunctator Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 I will welcome the AV-8b+, but I am not holding my breath. Most likely very far away. Both the Sea Harrier FRS.1 and the especially the F-15E can keep their current team occupied for years and seems much higher on their list. Until they can do the Plus the current Harrier will be in need for a full overhaul to fully utilize the new DCS 3.0/Vulcan engine anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sephyrius Posted January 24, 2020 Share Posted January 24, 2020 Eagerly awaiting the Plus version as well, reckon it would be a big selling point as it's currently 90% A2G only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizard_03 Posted February 2, 2020 Share Posted February 2, 2020 In the harrier plus, you can use the radar antenna elevation wheel control on the throttle to zoom in and out with the TPOD in HTS mode just like the hornet.. Seriously would buy the plus from RAZBAM for that capability alone, never mind the radar, never mind AMRAAMs. :) DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swift. Posted February 2, 2020 Share Posted February 2, 2020 In the harrier plus, you can use the radar antenna elevation wheel control on the throttle to zoom in and out with the TPOD in HTS mode just like the hornet.. You can also use the A/A button on the throttle to toggle the laser. 476th Discord | 476th Website | Swift Youtube Ryzen 5800x, RTX 4070ti, 64GB, Quest 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konovalov Posted February 2, 2020 Share Posted February 2, 2020 Eagerly awaiting the Plus version as well, reckon it would be a big selling point as it's currently 90% A2G only. I'm going to go against the grain on this one. My view is that part of the beauty of the AV-8B II N/A is that it really has a specific ground attack role being CAS, CSAR, BAI, and AFAC. There are plenty of other high fidelity modules in DCS that can do it all such as the Hornet and Viper. Do we really need another jack of all trades aircraft to come into an already crowded type of module field? I don't think so. Besides given Razbam already have a long list of other modules to follow after completing the existing three I doubt those wishing for a Plus variant of the Harrier will see it any time soon if at all. Intel i7-8700K | Asus Maximus X Formula | Corsair Vengeance 32GB DDR4 3200MHz | Gainward Phoenix GTX1070 GLH | Samsung 960 EVO NVMe 1 x 250GB OS & 1 x 500GB Games | Corsair RM750x 750W | Corsair Carbide Air 540| Win10 | Dell 27" 1440p 60Hz | Custom water loop: CPU EK-Supremacy EVO, GPU EK-GTX JetStream - Acetal+Nickel & Backplate, Radiator EK-Coolstream PE 360, Pump & Res EK-XRES 140 Revo D5, Fans 3 x EK-Vardar 120mm & 2 x Corsair ML140 140mm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizard_03 Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 I'm going to go against the grain on this one. My view is that part of the beauty of the AV-8B II N/A is that it really has a specific ground attack role being CAS, CSAR, BAI, and AFAC. There are plenty of other high fidelity modules in DCS that can do it all such as the Hornet and Viper. Do we really need another jack of all trades aircraft to come into an already crowded type of module field? I don't think so. Besides given Razbam already have a long list of other modules to follow after completing the existing three I doubt those wishing for a Plus variant of the Harrier will see it any time soon if at all. I think we’ll probably see the FRS1 first in any case, but that’s a very USMC attitude. They treat aviation like flying artillery. Other operators see the harrier as much more of a multi role aircraft. It’s true strength is it’s VSTOL basing, and while its very well suited to those mission sets you mentioned, it’s no slouch as a dogfighter either. I’ve seen hornet drivers get spanked by it on several occasions. I think having a jack of all trades that can do VSTOL as well would be very welcome but that’s me. DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Orso Posted February 3, 2020 Share Posted February 3, 2020 8< Do we really need another jack of all trades aircraft to come into an already crowded type of module field? 8< I think this is a big misunderstanding, and maybe ED's fault. Let me explain. The idea that you might go to a catalog of every piece of equipment the US, or any nation for that matter, puts into the field, to plan a mission is absurd, but the standard in DCS. It does not take into account in any way the cost of any piece of equipment or that each side must work with a budget. So every mission has an $8 bil. super-carrier and a slew of F/A-18C's instead of a $200 mil. LHA with Harriers and helos. Why? Because why not; it's only imaginary money. Oh, and put the super-carrier in visible range of the coast so that it's constantly in danger of attack by small craft. If equipment got used the way it is in the real world, then "another jack of all trades" would actually be another special Lego brick for building the building you want. It depends on what you want. When you hit the wrong button on take-off System Specs. Spoiler System board: MSI X670E ACE Memory: 64GB DDR5-6000 G.Skill Ripjaw System disk: Crucial P5 M.2 2TB CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D PSU: Corsair HX1200 PSU Monitor: ASUS MG279Q, 27" CPU cooling: Noctua NH-D15S Graphics card: MSI RTX 3090Ti SuprimX VR: Oculus Rift CV1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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