Suggestion: Readme / Welcome guide please

Hi,

I've just picked this up at the ED shop.

I would like to suggest that you consider adding an up-to-date intro document / readme.txt / "getting started" introductory guide to get people going in the right direction.

It appears to me that new users are supposed to just click the campaign in game and go from there.

For example, I see that there are documents ..\DCS World\Mods\campaigns\A-10C AAT\Doc, ..\DCS World\Mods\campaigns\A-10C - Basic Flight Training Qualification\Doc

...but this isn't mentioned anywhere. I don't think that people should just be expected to know this.

Again, e.g., I see that there's a nice checklist in there, and would assume that I'm supposed to use that for the missions; but how am I expected to know about it in the first place?

So I go to the forums and I find threads with hundreds of posts (no, I'm not going to read them all), mentions of practice missions (what's that about?), and I am ready to give up before I start.

Sorry if I've missed something somewhere, or if I'm just being a bit thick. Please don't take this as a ranting complaint, just a suggestion.

Anyhow, I'm sure the campaign will be excellent, thank you for putting it together.

This is a reasonable suggestion. Most people play the campaign through the campaigns menu but you can also play the missions individually through the mission menu.

The campaign is structured so you do a practice mission first which introduces you to the Performance Check. If successful then you progress to the Qualification mission.

We will consider adding some briefing text to the first mission (Arrival) that will indicate where the docs folder is located so users can find the reference material easier.

If you know the A-10C well you can complete the campaign without the documentation but the documentation does help new users better understand the aircraft and procedures.

I'm not sure I've made my point very well. The docs folder location was an example I was making of information I think should be included in a separate, comprehensive, readme file (or a web page). I think that putting that sort of thing in the campaign intro will kill the realism vibe I suspect you're trying to go with in there.

More information that would be useful for someone just picking this up could also include:

- hints and tips like, well, these two:

"Most people play the campaign through the campaigns menu but you can also play the missions individually through the mission menu"

"The campaign is structured so you do a practice mission first which introduces you to the Performance Check. If successful then you progress to the Qualification mission."

(Thanks for those btw).

- known issues / bugs

- latest changes and updates

- there are forum threads about your campaign running to 100s of pages - I imagine there must be common issues and questions in there which crop up over and again. If only someone could pick them out and present them in an easily accessible document... ;)

Anyway, I'll leave you alone now; thanks for taking the time to respond.

Ok how about if we put the additional info into the first forum post about the campaign.

We can continue to update that post with any changes, hints, tips, etc.

Ok how about if we put the additional info into the first forum post about the campaign.

 

We can continue to update that post with any changes, hints, tips, etc.

I think that would be very helpful... but only if you think so too ... I'm beginning to feel like I've bullied you into it.

I'd better go fly this campaign now.

It's no problem. All feedback is appreciated and it helps to make the experience better for all users. :thumbup:

We are going to replicate your suggestion across all our campaign intro posts.

Great, thanks for replying, and for creating these campaigns.

Suggestions following mission "Arrival"

Provide an unambiguous message at mission end to let the user know that the mission has finished and that he can now exit by pressing ESC. (like you get in most of the training missions).

I pressed ESC after being told to go to the office, and I'm 95% sure that's that. But it might not be...

I believe that this mission has to be played through to completion or you can't proceed to the next one. This is fine for the first time you play the campaign, but a bit of a drag if you to have to sit through it every time you restart the campaign.

Maybe there's a way to give the user the option to skip through.

I realise that I could just load the missions individually, but (and I know it's silly), I like the feeling of continuity you get from doing the campaign.

Just wanted to add the following:

I can see just from the first mission the amount of work you must've put into the campaign. Speaking for myself, I'm more than happy that I've got my money's worth. So please don't think I'm complaining; and feel free to ignore my questions and suggestions (which I'll post on here in case they're useful to others).

I guess you're now expected to support and keep these campaigns updated - what have you let yourself in for? ;)

Suggestions for mission BFT01 Ground Handling Practice Mission

(preflight checks part)

- Explain to user that you have provided a pdf checklist, which he should use.

- I found it hard to keep up at times, especially on the longer items (like making a radio call, waiting for INS alignment, etc). Perhaps a "press space to continue once complete" message every so often; otherwise one slip or delay and the whole mission can be screwed (or maybe that's the intention? ;)).

-Explain to the user that sometimes it's necessary to hold button for 1 second if the game is to correctly recognise keypresses. I found the "Press and hold for 1 second count." message confusing in that there is no context to it.

-After not doing it right I see "We will end our flight here. You did poorly cadet..your rating is an unqualified...you need to spend more time training". I'm a bit confused, I thought this was a practice. Will I have to keep repeating this mission? I feel this practice / qual needs to be more clearly explained. Is the qual a later mission or part of the same mission?

Questions:

What is the CCTVS/DV ADR Remote Control Panel?

Why is the UHF radio turned on at a different stage in the checklist to the others?

Working my way through the before takeoff checklist. I'd have liked to have had some backround information on it (why is it different from Eagle Dynamics procedure in the manual? how / why was it put together?); some items I think require further explanation.

Checklist questions

Before takeoff checklist

Left console

4. CCTVS / DVADR Remote control panel. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

Instrument Panel

3. Armament Control Panel - SET , should items 4 - 12 be subitems a) - h) instead?

Right Console

5. Oxygen system - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

Prior to Engine Start

14. CDU - Set for desired alignment. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

Starting Engines

10. Flight controls - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

11. AC generators - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

11. Instrument inverter - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

Before Taxiing

16. Trim - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

19. Slat operation, peak performance, etc... Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

21. CDU data - VERIFY / ENTER. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

AFTER EGI INS ALIGNMENT IS COMPLETE. 22. CDU Align page

The thing is I don't see a message that alignment has completed. I see IFFCC NOT RDY. Should turning on the IFFCC come before this step?

Suggestions following mission "Arrival"

 

Provide an unambiguous message at mission end to let the user know that the mission has finished and that he can now exit by pressing ESC. (like you get in most of the training missions).

 

I pressed ESC after being told to go to the office, and I'm 95% sure that's that. But it might not be...

 

I believe that this mission has to be played through to completion or you can't proceed to the next one. This is fine for the first time you play the campaign, but a bit of a drag if you to have to sit through it every time you restart the campaign.

 

Maybe there's a way to give the user the option to skip through.

 

I realise that I could just load the missions individually, but (and I know it's silly), I like the feeling of continuity you get from doing the campaign.

We did indicate "Mission Success" at the end of the mission but will add some text to indicate the user should press ESC to quit.

The mission isn't very long and using the speed up functions you can get through it in a few seconds so if you restart the campaign we don't think it's that big of an issue. Unfortunately there is no way to provide a user interaction since you are not in any cockpit yet.

Suggestions for mission BFT01 Ground Handling Practice Mission

 

(preflight checks part)

 

- Explain to user that you have provided a pdf checklist, which he should use.

 

- I found it hard to keep up at times, especially on the longer items (like making a radio call, waiting for INS alignment, etc). Perhaps a "press space to continue once complete" message every so often; otherwise one slip or delay and the whole mission can be screwed (or maybe that's the intention? ;)).

 

-Explain to the user that sometimes it's necessary to hold button for 1 second if the game is to correctly recognise keypresses. I found the "Press and hold for 1 second count." message confusing in that there is no context to it.

 

-After not doing it right I see "We will end our flight here. You did poorly cadet..your rating is an unqualified...you need to spend more time training". I'm a bit confused, I thought this was a practice. Will I have to keep repeating this mission? I feel this practice / qual needs to be more clearly explained. Is the qual a later mission or part of the same mission?

 

Questions:

 

What is the CCTVS/DV ADR Remote Control Panel?

Why is the UHF radio turned on at a different stage in the checklist to the others?

We modeled our checklist as closely to the real world checklists that we could so some items are done differently than what ED has in their manual.

We didn't want to replicate the in-game provided training and focused more on the actual qualification (testing your knowledge). Hence no breaks.

Once you fail a few times you will learn very quickly and remember the items that caused you grief (I can't recall how many times we failed on the Pitot Heat test.) :(

That said, we do recommend users use the Interactive Start-Up and Shutdown missions to get familiar with switch locations and the checklist we provided. You should also have completed the in-game training missions before trying for qualification. The more prepared you are the easier this is.

The practice missions were provided to help prepare for the qualification missions. The campaign is setup this way but in a future update we plan to change it so only the qualification missions are in the campaign. The practice missions will remain as individual missions so you can use them as refreshers or as pre-exam type training.

We can add some text to the briefing to explain the one second button press requirement.

The CCTVS/DV ADR panel is the one above the seat raise/lower switch.

The UHF radio setting was done as per the real world checklists we consulted but I can't explain why it's done at that point in the checklist and not with the other radio items.

Checklist questions

 

Before takeoff checklist

 

Left console

 

4. CCTVS / DVADR Remote control panel. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

Instrument Panel

 

3. Armament Control Panel - SET , should items 4 - 12 be subitems a) - h) instead?

 

Right Console

 

5. Oxygen system - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

Prior to Engine Start

 

14. CDU - Set for desired alignment. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

Starting Engines

 

10. Flight controls - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

11. AC generators - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

11. Instrument inverter - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

Before Taxiing

 

16. Trim - CHECK. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

19. Slat operation, peak performance, etc... Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

21. CDU data - VERIFY / ENTER. Don't understand what I'm supposed to do.

 

AFTER EGI INS ALIGNMENT IS COMPLETE. 22. CDU Align page

 

The thing is I don't see a message that alignment has completed. I see IFFCC NOT RDY. Should turning on the IFFCC come before this step?

As per the checklist:

4. Ensure the CCTVS / DVADR Remote control panel switch is OFF.

3. Yes those items are part of the AHCP setup. We can set them as sub-items - minor documentation change.

5. Oxygen System - CHECK - The warning message below this CHECK indicates if you can inhale with the regulator switch off then it may not be safe for flight.

14. CDU alignment - You get to set the desired alignment depending on mission requirements. You have a choice of GROUND or IN-FLIGHT alignment. The default is GROUND so you don't have any specific action to take here in the sim.

10. Flight Controls - CHECK - work your flight controls to ensure they work as expected (ailerons move, etc).

11. AC Generators - CHECK - confirm the AC Generators are operating and the switches are still enabled.

12. Instrument Inverter - CHECK - confirm the Inverter switch is still enabled.

16. TRIM - CHECK - Nothing you can do in the sim but in real world you would check the operation of the pitch, roll and yaw trim functions with the crew chief.

19. Slat operation, peak performance, etc. - Nothing you can do in the sim but in real world you would check the slat operations with the crew chief.

21. CDU data - VERIFY / ENTER - Verify the CDU data and change it if it's not reading as expected. You shouldn't have to do anything in the sim.

22. CDU Align page - It should be flashing 4.0.0.8 at that point depress the NAV LSK button. IFFCC switch setting comes later in the checklist.

Quick question for you Sabre. Any word on if you are going to make your Tactical campaign a DLC? I bought it through your website and never finished it. I would love having it available via DLC so that way I wouldn't have to keep all the installers and it'll update naturally.

It's in the works!

We are in final campaign testing (it's taking a little longer than expected as we have made some changes I know everyone will appreciate).

Plus all new professional voice overs that sound great. :thumbup:

Hopefully we will be wrapping it up soon.

Watch our blog for updates.

Working my way through the before takeoff checklist. I'd have liked to have had some backround information on it (why is it different from Eagle Dynamics procedure in the manual? how / why was it put together?); some items I think require further explanation.

I think before you start this campaign you need to have some understanding of the way the a10 works. The training that comes with the a10 is a must. I tried this campaign so many times with lots of failures so I decided to go away and learn the aircraft first. Now I've gone back to the campaign and completed with very little problem. I understand why there isn't any further explanations as this is a set of exams really. So all the knowledge should be there first. Overall a very good campaign and I'm now looking forward to starting the advanced qualification.

"The training that comes with the a10 is a must."

Yes, I get that, and that I must RTFM (both of which I have done). But a checklist has been provided that is different from the one in the DCS manual. The startup procedure in the checklist has differences from the one in the training mission.

The point I was trying to make was that it would have been nice (just out of interest) to have been provided with a bit of background as to where the checklist came from, and why it was decided to use it instead of the checklists that come with the DCS manual. Where there are items that are different to / not in the DCS manual checklist, then an explanation would have been welcome.

I've spent hours just investigating the Ground Handling Practice Mission, it's inspired me to look into all those obscure switches I've never bothered with, and to take a much deeper look into the checklist and systems. So, all good really.

The checklist is based on unclassified real world examples.

We try to make our missions as close to SOP as possible but we have to use unclassified sources so they may not be 100% accurate but they are as close as we can get.

Hi,

 

I've just picked this up at the ED shop.

 

I would like to suggest that you consider adding an up-to-date intro document / readme.txt / "getting started" introductory guide to get people going in the right direction.

 

It appears to me that new users are supposed to just click the campaign in game and go from there.

 

For example, I see that there are documents ..\DCS World\Mods\campaigns\A-10C AAT\Doc, ..\DCS World\Mods\campaigns\A-10C - Basic Flight Training Qualification\Doc

 

...but this isn't mentioned anywhere. I don't think that people should just be expected to know this.

 

Again, e.g., I see that there's a nice checklist in there, and would assume that I'm supposed to use that for the missions; but how am I expected to know about it in the first place?

 

So I go to the forums and I find threads with hundreds of posts (no, I'm not going to read them all), mentions of practice missions (what's that about?), and I am ready to give up before I start.

 

Sorry if I've missed something somewhere, or if I'm just being a bit thick. Please don't take this as a ranting complaint, just a suggestion.

 

Anyhow, I'm sure the campaign will be excellent, thank you for putting it together.

Nice suggestion.:thumbup: