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Multiple laser-rockets on the same target


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Can we lauch multiple M-151 or M-282 rockets at the same target in a single pass?

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FYI, M-151 and M-282 are the warheads, so you have basically asked whether you can fire more than one normal rocket. But going by the title I assume you mean APKWS.

 

I don't see a reason why not, they are just normal rockets with another bit slotted in, so the plane will surely just see them as normal rockets.

 

IDK whether it would be safe or sensible, though.

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What would be pretty cool is firing two rockets at two nearby targets with a few seconds of delay between them, and then snapping the laser to the other target once the first rocket hits to change the course of the second rocket. It should work in theory as long as you don't move the laser too fast and the rocket still has energy.

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A better question would probably be if they can be fired again multiple targets — i.e. if the laser code is handled like a launcher/pylon ground setting or if they will keep on doing this rather silly in-cockpit reprogramming of weapons that you see with, for instance, laser-guided bombs.

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What would be pretty cool is firing two rockets at two nearby targets with a few seconds of delay between them, and then snapping the laser to the other target once the first rocket hits to change the course of the second rocket. It should work in theory as long as you don't move the laser too fast and the rocket still has energy.

 

You gotta remember what these rockets are being used for in real life...

 

Instead of dropping a 500lb JDAM on a building bad guys are shooting from they can shoot a 10lb bomb in the window of the room the bad guys are shooting from. This has many advantages.

 

- Reduces the chance of colateral damage / unwanted casaualties.

- Greatly increases the loiter time of CAS Assets.

 

500lb JDAMs on Station 3 & 9 = 2 targets.

Rocket pod on Station 3 & 9 = 14 Targets and less drag and weight on the aircraft.

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Each rocket can be given own laser code, but you wouldn't know what rocket you are firing, why all rockets in same pod has a same code, or the pairs of pods has same code.

 

Code is set physically only, no digital connection at all. You set it by dialing in a code number in the guidance section with a flathead screwdriver.

 

The pods are set to single fire, so you don't do a ripple fire (whole pod at once) as it would be just wasteful, but technically possible so shouldn't be limited from doing so.

 

If you know now how to fire rockets on hornet, or any vehicle, you know how to fire APKWS. There is no difference in the process than you want to have a laser designating target at firing moment or soon after firing.

Rockets are LOAL.

 

As quickly you can switch laser designator between rockets explosions, you can hit multiple targets in one pass, but you are limited to rocket flight dynamics performance by speed, range and lift capability to have enough rate change to turn at new laser spot position.

 

Example if you start at altitude from 9-10 km distance, fire rocket every 5 seconds for targets that are nearby, you have few seconds difference only. With 7-10 seconds you have a better change to have time for rocket to turn depending distance of separation.

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it's an A-10C simulator guys not MACROSS!

That's kind of the point: the A-10C has never properly simulated how laser settings really work and have instead had this nonsense MFD-driven in-flight, in-cockpit setup. Same goes for many other laser-guided weapons in ED modules — it should be noted that a few third party modules do it right, as ground settings that can't be changed while in the air.

 

A real A-10C would actually be able to macross it up, if supported by a small disco lightshow, but the ones in DCS can't because they're tied to the inaccurate laser setup (that is most likely there to work along side the equally inaccurate JTAC system). Now, it would obviously not be entirely reasonable to have 14 different spotters lasing different targets in any sensible or realistic scenario, but technically, that really should be possible.

 

Macross capabilities would be a more realistic A-10C simulator than what the current laser control setup allows for, ironically enough. :D

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Each rocket can be given own laser code

 

 

Looks like not an each rocket, but an each station, when rockets pod is installed.

 

But from other side, yes, each rocket...each launch - change laser code :megalol:

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Looks like not an each rocket, but an each station, when rockets pod is installed.

 

But from other side, yes, each rocket...each launch - change laser code :megalol:

 

You can, as the ED implementation for laser code change is 100% unrealistic. Player is allowed to change all weapons laser codes via MFD/UFC purely by gameplay reasons.

 

The technician will set laser codes for each rocket as I explained. And you can't do it from a plane, only on ground before installing rocket in pod.

 

So to make it realistic, player would need to land and rearm. In the rearming window there could be a button to enter laser codes for weapons that requires it to be done physically.

 

Each pod will have a own pattern how rockets motors are triggered, so you could make a pattern order for different codes so you would know that after firing X of Nth rocket, the next one will have different code.

 

But, for helicopters there are advantages in digital pods that you get a different grouping for rockets, so they can load pods with a different warheads. This way pilot/gunner can select in their weapons system the group that has wanted warhead and launch only those. I haven't asked are such things possible for a fixed wings, but there would be little sense for it. So you can only set pod setting to be a single fire or ripple fire for all, and that as well is done on the pod itself, instead digitally.

 

With the APKWS you can fire as many rockets you want on single target, it doesn't matter. All rockets would see the same laser spot and fly there.

Practically you could set one aircraft carry two pods, both having rockets with different laser codes (two kinds) and then have a wingman designate a another target same time as you fire both pods with own designation. The other rockets would fly to wingman designation and other to yours. This way only one would need to carry rockets for simultaneous engagements.

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. Now, it would obviously not be entirely reasonable to have 14 different spotters lasing different targets in any sensible or realistic scenario, but technically, that really should be possible.

 

 

Exactly. That would be so crazy to have a each rocket with different code and each rocket paired with a laser designator. And then one hornet fly and ripple fire a two pods and each rocket seeks to own target, for instantaneous multi-target impacts. All 14 targets hit at once.

 

Of course same thing for GBU-12 and so on, if these things would be realistic in DCS.

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You can, as the ED implementation for laser code change is 100% unrealistic. Player is allowed to change all weapons laser codes via MFD/UFC purely by gameplay reasons.

 

The technician will set laser codes for each rocket as I explained. And you can't do it from a plane, only on ground before installing rocket in pod.

 

So to make it realistic, player would need to land and rearm. In the rearming window there could be a button to enter laser codes for weapons that requires it to be done physically.

 

Each pod will have a own pattern how rockets motors are triggered, so you could make a pattern order for different codes so you would know that after firing X of Nth rocket, the next one will have different code.

 

But, for helicopters there are advantages in digital pods that you get a different grouping for rockets, so they can load pods with a different warheads. This way pilot/gunner can select in their weapons system the group that has wanted warhead and launch only those. I haven't asked are such things possible for a fixed wings, but there would be little sense for it. So you can only set pod setting to be a single fire or ripple fire for all, and that as well is done on the pod itself, instead digitally.

 

With the APKWS you can fire as many rockets you want on single target, it doesn't matter. All rockets would see the same laser spot and fly there.

Practically you could set one aircraft carry two pods, both having rockets with different laser codes (two kinds) and then have a wingman designate a another target same time as you fire both pods with own designation. The other rockets would fly to wingman designation and other to yours. This way only one would need to carry rockets for simultaneous engagements.

 

what an explanations...excellent :smilewink:

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The technician will set laser codes for each rocket as I explained. And you can't do it from a plane, only on ground before installing rocket in pod.

 

So to make it realistic, player would need to land and rearm. In the rearming window there could be a button to enter laser codes for weapons that requires it to be done physically.

That and a proper universal (or at least common and shared API for) DTC system would be such a boon to… oh… almost all modules. The way it has been squeezed in by various third parties in umpteen different ways will just become uglier and messier over time — doubly so now that ED are making modules that heavily rely on that kind of system, but where last they said anything on the topic, they too would add bespoke solutions for each module rather than add a macro-level method to rule them all.

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A better question would probably be if they can be fired again multiple targets — i.e. if the laser code is handled like a launcher/pylon ground setting or if they will keep on doing this rather silly in-cockpit reprogramming of weapons that you see with, for instance, laser-guided bombs.

 

Well, technically this would be possible. Have 7 different laser codes set up in a pod and 7 lasers with those codes at the same time in the target area, pointing at different targets. Maybe possible with some scripting if we could have different codes for each rocket. A setup with these options would be enough to get there:

 

- same code for all, 1xyz

- incrementing code for the pod, starting at 1xyz

 

Looks like not an each rocket, but an each station, when rockets pod is installed.

 

For the real thing it's done

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Edited by Eldur

dcsdashie-hb-ed.jpg

 

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In real life, would an impacting rocket and the resulting smoke and debris scatter the laser spot such that follow on rockets could have accuracy issues?

 

Thanks! That was the reason of my question in post #1 of the thread. :)

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In real life, would an impacting rocket and the resulting smoke and debris scatter the laser spot such that follow on rockets could have accuracy issues?

 

Yes. Just like the ground vehicles would use their smoke greens that scatters your laser spot, on the moment you start firing laser at them. They do have a LWS that gives direction to the source.

 

They would pop the smoke and drive to cover.

 

But, APKWS is a LOAL and it doesn't care if laser spot is lost, as then it will fly straight. So if you fire few rockets, they are heading at your target that gets smoked or so, the rocket keeps flying straight until it spots laser spot again to make new corrections.

 

So if you would fire couple rockets, the following ones are already so close the first one (because extra range you gave at launch) that they would impact same position. Only against moving target you should start seeing problems if launch separation is long enough.

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