Hornet A/A Radar not locking sometimes

Hi,

This is probably user error, but I am having some difficulty using the A/A radar to lock targets, particularly in the last mission of the mini campaign, where the goal is to destroy helicopters on the ramp. My wingman is utterly useless in this mission as he will not engage bandits, and he gets shot down by a SAM 90% of the time while attacking the airport.

This leaves me to deal with the fighters alone, and I can deal with some of them, but I have noticed a repeating pattern in this mission where my radar will not lock the targets, and it also loses track of them suddenly. I will have the targets on the display, I will place the brackets over a target, but when I press the TDC depress switch to lock the target, I do not get a lock indication, I just get the target singled out (ie I lose other targets from the display) and the azimuth scan reduced to about a 5-10 degree sweep over the target. If I hit the TDC depress switch again, the TDC returns to the top left corner of the display, and normal A/A radar function and sweep is resumed. I can lock targets, and I do in this mission, but why can't I lock them all the time if they are there to be locked?

Another issue I am having is that I will suddenly lose the same targets in the same place almost every time I fly the mission. I will have the targets at about 20 -30 NM on the display, clear as day, but I won't be able to lock them. I do not even get the above response when I try to lock them. Then the returns will start flashing for 5 -10 seconds, and then I will lose contact totally. I tend to think that this second issue is caused by the targets flying above or below the vertical range of the radar, but I'm not sure. I can never reaquire them just by increasing vertical range or by pointing my nose up or down.

Any advice to how I can overcome these issues would be appreciated.

Cheers

I started a thread on the same topic the other day. Seems to be a common problem.

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4038042&postcount=1

Heya, same here! I see the enemy in front of me and no AA RDR contact. AACQ locks a TGT 80 nm away

Hi,

 

This is probably user error, but I am having some difficulty using the A/A radar to lock targets, particularly in the last mission of the mini campaign, where the goal is to destroy helicopters on the ramp. My wingman is utterly useless in this mission as he will not enage bandits, and he gets shot down by a SAM 90% of the time while attacking the airport.

 

This leaves me to deal with the fighters alone, and I can deal with some of them, but I have noticed a repeating pattern in this mission where my radar will not lock the targets, and it also loses track of them suddenly. I will have the targets on the display, I will place the brackets over a target, but when I press the TDC depress switch to lock the target, I do not get a lock indication, I just get the target singled out (ie I lose other targets from the display) and the azimuth scan reduced to about a 5-10 degree sweep over the target. If I hit the TDC depress switch again, the TDC returns to the top left corner of the display, and normal A/A radar function and sweep is resumed. I can lock targets, and I do in this mission, but why can't I lock them all the time if they are there to be locked?

 

Another issue I am having is that I will suddenly lose the same targets in the same place almost every time I fly the mission. I will have the targets at about 20 -30 NM on the display, clear as day, but I won't be able to lock them. I do not even get the above response when I try to lock them. Then the returns will start flashing for 5 -10 seconds, and then I will lose contact totally. I tend to think that this second issue is caused by the targets flying above or below the vertical range of the radar, but I'm not sure. I can never reaquire them just by increasing vertical range or by pointing my nose up or down.

 

Any advice to how I can overcome these issues would be appreciated.

 

Cheers

+1

I can never reaquire them just by increasing vertical range or by pointing my nose up or down.

I had started a topic on this a while ago, it appears the the FA-18C radar is mounted on a gyroscope gimbal, bore sight will point, but short range only.

Present FA-18c loses look way too easy and acquires lock way too hard, that is for sure and this is a problem, and I severely doubt R/L FA-18C acts the same way,

for, that would make for a horrible platform, which apparently it is not, for R/L pilots do not complain, on the contrary, do they now.

Which makes this an issue for the coders how to tweak the parameters so things 'work'.

I have noticed that the radar will get into a non-default PRI setting sometimes. I have seen it jump to PDI which is used with the AIM-7 when I don't have AIM-7s. I have also seen it change to MED PRI without any inputs from me. I assume at least one of these things is a bug.

The radar appears to work best in interlaced mode. Click the OSB in the lower left side column of buttons until it says HI INTL or MED INTL the most important part is INTL. If the text next to the button says "PDI", select AIM-7s and then deselect them unless you are shooting AIM-7s.

If you keep the radar in INTL and most definitely out of PDI you should have better results. The good news is that this appears to be reproducible so hopefully this will solve most of the problems you're having.

Did you mean we see a real radar configuration, that the same we know real ECM, but it can better program controlled, i know a sim AA RAD works better!

I'm just offering a tip that might help folks cope with the sim a little bit better. No subtext intended or implied.

Heya, DCS is a very good SIM, but what is the Hornet with AA RAD in this SIM? hmm..., nothing vs DCS SIM !

The radar appears to work best in interlaced mode.

In my experience (based on only one test, so with a grain of salt), HI PRF gets better results generally than MED in typical air combat cases (finding a fighter sized target quickly at practical ranges).

The test was to detect a single MiG-19 with head-on aspect at 20,000 ft, closure 800kts, 4 bar 80 degrees. Both aircraft moving straight and level.

MED detected MiG at 35nm and HI detected it at 55nm. Test repeated twice with similar results. Nowadays I just use HI and stuff seems to show up quicker.

--

edit: Tested again with M2000 as target. 10,000ft head-on, 800kts closure, 4 bar 80 degrees.

HI

49nm

47nm

48nm

MED

34nm

34nm

33nm

INTL

47nm

48nm

48nm

So INTL is the same as HI. But I still argue that, between 35 and 50nm, the MED INTL sweeps are not able detect the Mirage, so you are better off without them.

--

edit2: M2000 beaming, 10,000ft, 400kts closure.

HI

33nm

MED

33nm

If target is beaming, there is no difference in PRF detection range.

--

edit3: M2000 head-on, look down from 40,000ft to 10,000ft(B) over mountains, closure about 900kts.

HI

46nm

MED

46nm

M2000 head-on, player looking up from 10,000ft(B) to 40,000ft over mountains, closure about 900kts.

HI

45nm

MED

35nm

Looking down in this case did not affect detection range. For some reason, looking down, HI and MED were the same, but looking up, they are different. I can't explain this but I tried it multiple times. Maybe Mirage has higher RCS on top than bottom.

TLDR: HI PRF sometimes has a further detection range than MED for a Mirage target.

HI PRF yields better results against head-on or tail-on aspect due to the doppler shift.

HI PRF yields better results against head-on or tail-on aspect due to the doppler shift.

have you tested with cold targets? high PRF should be terrible for detecting them

I should've added that's it's better at close range (inside 20nm or so). Most of the time I have better success with high PRF against a cold target if it's extending to avoid a merge, not necessarily for long-range detection, then I use medium.

I should've added that's it's better at close range (inside 20nm or so). Most of the time I have better success with high PRF against a cold target if it's extending to avoid a merge, not necessarily for long-range detection, then I use medium.

That is like... all backwards. Might be bugged, so it probably deserves some editor tests. High PRF = easier to detect hot targets at higher ranges (above ~30nm), poor detection of flanking or cold targets. Medium PRF = better all aspect detection, but less range (so best below 30).

True, but I don't know why it works though, the low doppler on a cold target should compete with the sidelobe clutter. Only reason I can think of is if the negative closure rate is great enough to not be ambiguous. I can do some tests with cold targets at different speeds to see if it makes a difference.

When using the Aim-7 is it correct behaviour if I can only choose between Interlaced or PDI? I could not choose medium or high manually.

Finally finished the last mission of the mini campaign, with my wingman intact, but in the end I still had no luck with the AA radar using Aim-7s. I ended up having to go boresight as I could not lock the enemy up at all at range. I used the contrails and missile trails to locate the enemy, and of course had to avoid missiles, but I locked up and destroyed two with Aim-7s using boresight, and the third was purely BFM using guns after both Aim-9s hit flares. Not sure who downed the fourth guy. I noticed my wingman will eventually engage bandits after he has dropped his bombs on the primary (and survives).

Any good tutorials out there on Aim-7 use with radar? I have a lot to learn it seems.

I don't even know if the MED or HI refers to PRF or PRI.

Because they are opposites.

Right this minute I find the biggest problem locking a/a targets is phantom returns, the hafu makes it look like you have radar contact but you don't. Hover over the target in ltws, if you get altitude info it'll lock right up. If you don't, I don't care what the hafu says, he's not on radar

Right this minute I find the biggest problem locking a/a targets is phantom returns, the hafu makes it look like you have radar contact but you don't. Hover over the target in ltws, if you get altitude info it'll lock right up. If you don't, I don't care what the hafu says, he's not on radar

It's not a phantom, it's a hostile SURV HAFU, which looks similar to onboard+offboard hostiel HAFU. I recommend watching wags video on link16 for clarification.

Right this minute I find the biggest problem locking a/a targets is phantom returns, the hafu makes it look like you have radar contact but you don't. Hover over the target in ltws, if you get altitude info it'll lock right up. If you don't, I don't care what the hafu says, he's not on radar

You are failing to put the radar antenna elevation into the range it will detect the datalinked contact.

You can always get a datalinked contact altitude from the SA Page (either moving the SA cursor over the desired contact and hitting STEP, or hitting STEP and cycling through all contacts).

Once you see its altitude, move the radar elevation until it encloses it.

I have noticed that the radar will get into a non-default PRI setting sometimes. I have seen it jump to PDI which is used with the AIM-7 when I don't have AIM-7s. I have also seen it change to MED PRI without any inputs from me. I assume at least one of these things is a bug.

I've submitted a bug report similar to this in https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=235930.

You are failing to put the radar antenna elevation into the range it will detect the datalinked contact

 

Once you see its altitude, move the radar elevation until it encloses it.

 

Exactly.

Thanks Santi that does clarify things. But, point being, what Jackbauer said. My experience is, if the contact is really detected by your radar it locks right up no sweat. For me anyway.