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Thinking of buying a customer return TM Warthog


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I can get a TM Warthog stick and throttle for half price direct from TM with 6 months warranty. It's listed as used - customer return, so I guess it could just be an unwanted return that's been opened but not used, or it could have been faulty and they've fixed it so well that it's even more sturdy than ones that come off the production line, or the repair might have been bodged and it might fail again soon.

 

Much as I like the sound of the build quality of the Virpil controls I don't think they're available yet and even if they were, the throttle isn't ideal for western aircraft like the A-10C as it doesn't have all the right buttons, hats, etc. I don't have a throttle at all at the moment, just the slider on my Sidewinder FFB so I really need one to be able to fly the advanced aircraft. However I probably won't be able to use it much for a while, as I'm refurbishing my flat and will need to wait until I've finished that and built a new desk/pit to have room to put the controls, so they'll probably get put back in the box after I've tested them to make sure they're OK.

 

I guess if I knew how to check the TM stick and throttle over to look for problems when I get it then I'd feel more comfortable about getting it, so can anyone give me some tips about things to check or look for, common faults, etc? Or if you think it's a bad idea to buy it, then please say so.

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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Doesn't sound like a bad deal to me...

 

I have a Warthog hotas, but I just put them on my (normal size) desk for use and put them back in the cupboard afterwards, no need for a purpose built pit.

Although it would be cool obviously...

 

Weak point is (apparently) the gimbal. All internals are basically plastic, not metal. So if you are worried about that, I guess you could open them up for inspection (discoloration, small cracks etc). I'm not sure if that won't void the warranty though.

 

But I would recommend to keep using it thoroughly while you still have the six month warranty. There is no point to keep it in the box until the warranty expires...

Modules: Bf 109, C-101, CE-II, F-5, Gazelle, Huey, Ka-50, Mi-8, MiG-15, MiG-19, MiG-21, Albatros, Viggen, Mirage 2000, Hornet, Yak-52, FC3

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I used to support warthog and their quality.

However my setup failed one after another on the near end of 2nd years of their service.

 

It really depends on what kind of defect those pieces were.


Edited by Insonia
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Weak point is (apparently) the gimbal. All internals are basically plastic, not metal. So if you are worried about that, I guess you could open them up for inspection (discoloration, small cracks etc). I'm not sure if that won't void the warranty though.

 

The gimbal is poor even when new/not worn/not damaged.

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Re Virpil Throttle vs warthog.

 

I'd not go as far and say that it's not suitable for western aircraft. The only button it's lacking is an analog slew control, (in context of A-10 and other aircraft you would use to slew target box around - you can do it with any 4-way hat button - analog control is not as "necessary" as people make it. It's probably more important for space sims.

 

On the other hand both VKB and Virpil are very unreliable and slow when it comes to orders fulfilment and they aren't necessarily fast when it comes to customer service (excluding PR on the social media where one is better than another) as as you noticed Virpil throttle is not available and has no reliable released date - they have pushed their "preorders" two weeks forward already, doesn't inspire much confidence. I'd wait until they actually release and people review it.

 

Having said that I own Virpil T-50 and Warthog and difference in gimbals is day and night. Grip, it's a matter of personal preference.

 

If you get your Warthog check if the gimbal is sticky.

 

p.s. on a side note Virpil setup is almost twice the price of Warthog.


Edited by mdee
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On the other hand both VKB and Virpil are very unreliable and slow when it comes to orders fulfilment and they aren't necessarily fast when it comes to customer service.

 

I disagree. I just bought myself T-50 base and it took 10 days to receive it (5 day order processing time, 5 days for shipping) so not bad at all. I don't know where OP lives but in EU its pretty fast and reliable at least if they have the products you order in stock.

 

So now im using TM WH throttle, MFG Crosswind, T-50 base with WH grip and 10cm extension and i totally recommend the T-50, it's so much better than TM WH stick. And if i were you i'd buy VPC throttle, just because my TM WH throttle has bricked once but i got a new one and now i'm always scared this one might brick too when i plug it in. And the slew button is not that good and i think i would do just fine with hat switch.

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The only button it's lacking is an analog slew control, (in context of A-10 and other aircraft you would use to slew target box around - you can do it with any 4-way hat button - analog control is not as "necessary" as people make it.

 

To not mention that (Warthog) "slew" is considered by many too imprecise at the point that some are paying £150.00 in an upgrade. :D

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I disagree. I just bought myself T-50 base and it took 10 days to receive it (5 day order processing time, 5 days for shipping) so not bad at all. I don't know where OP lives but in EU its pretty fast and reliable at least if they have the products you order in stock.

 

So now im using TM WH throttle, MFG Crosswind, T-50 base with WH grip and 10cm extension and i totally recommend the T-50, it's so much better than TM WH stick. And if i were you i'd buy VPC throttle, just because my TM WH throttle has bricked once but i got a new one and now i'm always scared this one might brick too when i plug it in. And the slew button is not that good and i think i would do just fine with hat switch.

 

Well, mileages may vary.

 

Just to be clear, I highly recommend Virpil sticks (and hopefully will be the same deal with throttle). My T-50 is irreplaceable. BTW, I have pretty much identical setup to yours, really happy with it


Edited by mdee
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I can get a TM Warthog stick and throttle for half price direct from TM with 6 months warranty. It's listed as used - customer return, so I guess it could just be an unwanted return that's been opened but not used, or it could have been faulty and they've fixed it so well that it's even more sturdy than ones that come off the production line, or the repair might have been bodged and it might fail again soon.

 

Much as I like the sound of the build quality of the Virpil controls I don't think they're available yet and even if they were, the throttle isn't ideal for western aircraft like the A-10C as it doesn't have all the right buttons, hats, etc. I don't have a throttle at all at the moment, just the slider on my Sidewinder FFB so I really need one to be able to fly the advanced aircraft. However I probably won't be able to use it much for a while, as I'm refurbishing my flat and will need to wait until I've finished that and built a new desk/pit to have room to put the controls, so they'll probably get put back in the box after I've tested them to make sure they're OK.

 

I guess if I knew how to check the TM stick and throttle over to look for problems when I get it then I'd feel more comfortable about getting it, so can anyone give me some tips about things to check or look for, common faults, etc? Or if you think it's a bad idea to buy it, then please say so.

 

IMHO if you are just going to test them for function, then put them back in the box, then you are wasting the warranty and you might as well wait.

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Well almost £600 for the Virpil setup is a bit steep for me so I decided to get the WH for now. I think I'd be annoyed if I waited and missed the opportunity to get one for half price, although they seem to have plenty in stock if anyone else wants one http://shop.thrustmaster.com/en_gb/deals-73/used-products.html

 

I wouldn't be too gutted if the WH stick gimbals fail out of warranty, as I'll still have the throttle and the grip, which I can re-use on the Virpil base if I get one in future. I'll probably use my FFB2 stick (with TM FLCS grip mod when I get round to it) for helos and the WH stick for planes but if the WH gimbals fail I'll be able to make do with the FFB2 stick.

 

I've got a little side table to put the throttle on so that's quite ergonomic. The stick will have to sit on my desk for now, so it won't get much use until I can sort out something better as I'll sprain my wrist but at least I can test it and use it occasionally rather than putting it in storage.

 

I'm rather enjoying flicking these chunky metal switches on the throttle base :)

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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If you get your Warthog check if the gimbal is sticky.

 

There is some stickyness. It probably won't matter for planes but I imagine it would make it unsuitable for helos, as there's too much resistance to be able to make small adjustments without pushing through and oversteering.

 

The stick also rotates slightly (maybe 1-2 degrees) to the left. It's not that I haven't tightened the grip properly, as if I remove the grip I can still rotate the stem it plugs into. Currently the stick is to my right and on the desk, so if the stick was directly in front of me I guess I'd be less likely to accidentally rotate it but even so I still doubt it should be doing this.

 

Is there anything I can do to fix either of these issues myself, other than buying an alternative base that is?

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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There is some stickyness. It probably won't matter for planes but I imagine it would make it unsuitable for helos, as there's too much resistance to be able to make small adjustments without pushing through and oversteering.

 

The stick also rotates slightly (maybe 1-2 degrees) to the left. It's not that I haven't tightened the grip properly, as if I remove the grip I can still rotate the stem it plugs into. Currently the stick is to my right and on the desk, so if the stick was directly in front of me I guess I'd be less likely to accidentally rotate it but even so I still doubt it should be doing this.

 

Is there anything I can do to fix either of these issues myself, other than buying an alternative base that is?

 

Yeah my Warthog stick did the very same thing. It didn't do it from the beginning if i remember correctly. And like you said it's not the grip, it's the gimbal that is moving. I don't know how to fix it. It's slightly annoying.

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Yeah my Warthog stick did the very same thing. It didn't do it from the beginning if i remember correctly. And like you said it's not the grip, it's the gimbal that is moving. I don't know how to fix it. It's slightly annoying.

 

Well I feel a bit better knowing it's not just my one that does it!

 

What are people using the Incr-Decr slider axis for? I know in the real plane that's the throttle friction control, which the WH has a separate control for, but it seems a waste not to use it for something.

 

I enjoyed doing one of the training missions now that I have a proper set of controls., or at least I did until it told me to slew the HUD target pip into the box it drew but the box wasn't fixed in the HUD, so it moved around depending on what angle I looked at it from and I couldn't get the mission to continue. Did anyone else encounter that problem?

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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Well I feel a bit better knowing it's not just my one that does it!

 

What are people using the Incr-Decr slider axis for? I know in the real plane that's the throttle friction control, which the WH has a separate control for, but it seems a waste not to use it for something.

 

I enjoyed doing one of the training missions now that I have a proper set of controls., or at least I did until it told me to slew the HUD target pip into the box it drew but the box wasn't fixed in the HUD, so it moved around depending on what angle I looked at it from and I couldn't get the mission to continue. Did anyone else encounter that problem?

 

I use the slider for zoom. What training mission are you talking about?

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  • 2 weeks later...
I use the slider for zoom. What training mission are you talking about?

 

That's a good idea using the slider for zoom as I find I need to use that quite a bit. I don't think my headtracker is really setup properly yet as I'm finding it quite difficult to get a good view of the HUD but I'm sure I just need to tweak the settings.

 

The mission is the HOTAS fundamentals training mission and it's the bit where it tells you to slew the pipper on the HUD and designate the SPI with TMS Up. It actually worked today when I tried it but I'm sure it must have been fluke, as the box it tells you to put the pipper in isn't fixed on the HUD, so for example if I'm looking straight on it will be over land but if the pilot's head is to the right a bit the box is over the sea.

 

Anyway, it's only an issue when training 'cos there won't be any such boxes normally. It's just frustrating when you run into these bugs during training and can't complete the mission, especially as you can't save it so you have to start from scratch to retry it.

Main rig: i5-4670k @4.4Ghz, Asus Z97-A, Scythe Kotetsu HSF, 32GB Kingston Savage 2400Mhz DDR3, 1070ti, Win 10 x64, Samsung Evo 256GB SSD (OS & Data), OCZ 480GB SSD (Games), WD 2TB and WD 3TB HDDs, 1920x1200 Dell U2412M, 1920x1080 Dell P2314T touchscreen

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