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Old 07-12-2019, 08:37 PM   #41
etherbattx
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Originally Posted by Strong05 View Post
My understanding that the appearance of DCS using more then 2 cores is a windows thing, not a DCS change.
to be clear, a thread is a a list of instructions that get processed. each application has at least one thread, but most have many threads (DCS often uses 50+ threads).

A core is the physical hardware that works on the thread. It's the part that actually does the work.

The operating system will schedule a task (a thread) to a core to execute when it's ready. If more than one thread is ready to run, then both will each be assigned to a free core and they will run simultaneously (at the same time).

When you limit DCS to one core, you are asking the operating system to take all 50+ threads and run them one at a time, on that single core. It's no wonder you have sound stutter problems.

If you limit DCS to two cores, you are asking the operating system to take all 50+ threads and run them two at a time (one thread on each core). Obviously, this is much better.

But better still, is to allow DCS to schedule those 50+ threads onto any available cpu cores. maybe 2, maybe 3, maybe 8... it depends how many threads are ready to run, and how many free cpu cores you have.

The only time DCS uses "2 cores" is on the old Core-Duo chips from 2008... and that only happens to be true because there were only 2 cores in the whole cpu
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Old 07-13-2019, 06:42 AM   #42
Katj
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Originally Posted by etherbattx View Post
to be clear, a thread is a a list of instructions that get processed. each application has at least one thread, but most have many threads (DCS often uses 50+ threads).



A core is the physical hardware that works on the thread. It's the part that actually does the work.



The operating system will schedule a task (a thread) to a core to execute when it's ready. If more than one thread is ready to run, then both will each be assigned to a free core and they will run simultaneously (at the same time).



When you limit DCS to one core, you are asking the operating system to take all 50+ threads and run them one at a time, on that single core. It's no wonder you have sound stutter problems.



If you limit DCS to two cores, you are asking the operating system to take all 50+ threads and run them two at a time (one thread on each core). Obviously, this is much better.



But better still, is to allow DCS to schedule those 50+ threads onto any available cpu cores. maybe 2, maybe 3, maybe 8... it depends how many threads are ready to run, and how many free cpu cores you have.



The only time DCS uses "2 cores" is on the old Core-Duo chips from 2008... and that only happens to be true because there were only 2 cores in the whole cpu
Even though there may be many threads, most of the work can still be done on one thread. So at any given time you might not have more than one or two threads that are ready to run. In this situation having more than 2 cores will put you firmly in the lands of diminishing returns.

Writing a graphics engine that efficiently utilizes multiple cores is very difficult. Most games are still not very good at utilizing multi-core processors, even though they have been mainstream for 15 years or so. But it seems like we are finally starting to get somewhere.
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Old 07-13-2019, 07:06 AM   #43
BitMaster
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Even though there may be many threads, most of the work can still be done on one thread. So at any given time you might not have more than one or two threads that are ready to run. In this situation having more than 2 cores will put you firmly in the lands of diminishing returns.

Writing a graphics engine that efficiently utilizes multiple cores is very difficult. Most games are still not very good at utilizing multi-core processors, even though they have been mainstream for 15 years or so. But it seems like we are finally starting to get somewhere.

Simply not real world applicable.

You should not isolate DCS and forget the rest, it's ONE big soup ... and that soup loves cores


Take any modern CPU with more than 4 cores, limit it to 2 cores, turn off HT...and report back. I have done this too, out of curiosity, and switched right back to ALL cores and HT.

Installing and patching DCS as well loves cores. Done that with 2 cores and it takes forever ( in VMware )
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Old 07-13-2019, 11:43 AM   #44
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Simply not real world applicable.

You should not isolate DCS and forget the rest, it's ONE big soup ... and that soup loves cores


Take any modern CPU with more than 4 cores, limit it to 2 cores, turn off HT...and report back. I have done this too, out of curiosity, and switched right back to ALL cores and HT.

Installing and patching DCS as well loves cores. Done that with 2 cores and it takes forever ( in VMware )
Of course more cores are better, you can run some background processes on them and chances are that if you have 50 threads, every once in a while you will benefit from them in DCS. Maybe when you install the game, load resources, or you might simply get an extra frame per second.

I'm not saying there's nothing to be gained from having more than 2 cores. I'm saying that after that it will scale very badly for DCS as things stand today. 4 cores are still better than 2. And 8 cores are better than 6, but you might be hard pressed to be able to measure the difference. Especially if you don't have a very high-end graphics card, something OP doesn't.

I've never disabled cores. I don't see the point. I did however disable HT on my first i7.

So to summarize my opinion and advice to you guys: If you're not on a budget, get the best CPU. If on a budget, consider spending less on CPU (prioritizing single thread performance) and more on GPU.
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Old 07-13-2019, 12:29 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Katj View Post
Of course more cores are better, you can run some background processes on them and chances are that if you have 50 threads, every once in a while you will benefit from them in DCS. Maybe when you install the game, load resources, or you might simply get an extra frame per second.

I'm not saying there's nothing to be gained from having more than 2 cores. I'm saying that after that it will scale very badly for DCS as things stand today. 4 cores are still better than 2. And 8 cores are better than 6, but you might be hard pressed to be able to measure the difference. Especially if you don't have a very high-end graphics card, something OP doesn't.

I've never disabled cores. I don't see the point. I did however disable HT on my first i7.

So to summarize my opinion and advice to you guys: If you're not on a budget, get the best CPU. If on a budget, consider spending less on CPU (prioritizing single thread performance) and more on GPU.
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I would not listen to this guy Katj if I were you. Of course there are diminishing returns as you move up in cores. And of course higher clock speeds are better than low clock speeds. But DCS does scale fairly nicely with more cores and threads. I have a 6 core / 12 thread 4.8 GHz OC CPU and the CPU runs at very high overall utilisation with all cores contributing meaningfully to DCS. I'd just point out the blindingly obvious that a 48 core / 92 thread 2.4 GHz server CPU might not do you any favours in DCS.

You asked about the Ryzen 3000 build that you had proposed. There is plenty of excellent feedback here that addresses your questions. And the proposal to get a 3700X is an excellent choice. I hope you enjoy your new build: it should be awesome.
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