F-18 grip, WARTHOG compatible

I'm sure he'll easily make them specifically for Lanky too!

This is not the case in stock warthog. Well, it is but the effect of extra force needed is minuscule due to design, not enough to prevent non intentional inputs, and not enough to prevent over-correcting. And the only thing that can further worsen these bad side effects, is sticktion. And what do you know, warthog has it :)

 

In a real aircraft, the combined force of 50% pitch, and 50% roll is always going to be bigger then each one of them alone. In any airplane, prop or jet, old or new. This is just basic physics and force vector addition. This "realism" that I'm trying to design into the stock warthog, will actually result in better, smoother and more precise "gaming" experience even in arcade flying shooters like War Thunder.

 

If you think stock warthog has "uniform" force requirements throughout it's range of motion, it doesn't. Even if you don't care for realism, or don't want realistic, this spring mod will be a better experience. Even if you fly arcade shooters. Because you'll be able to choose different setups on the same spring mod. The mod just makes it much smoother and precise. Then if you want more realism, you can put different springs, and different attachment points, and you can have 1: 1.5 : 2 ratio for roll : pitch up : pitch down. If not, you can have "uniform" forces all around for your arcade flying.

You are getting confused dude, you are reading things that are not being said. Here is what I actually said:

The force required to command an input on one axis should not be affected by the input of the other axis.

I want one with separate axis

Well, it is but the effect of extra force needed is minuscule due to design

It's more than enough that I can feel it, even with an extension.

I really can't wait to order your A-10C products as well as DCS F/A-18 when released

The force required to command an input on one axis should not be affected by the input of the other axis.

Is not affected - or little - in CH, VKB, BAUR style gimbals with two expansions springs.

Is big affected in Warthog, T.16kM, X-5x's, Suncom style gimbal with one compression spring.

A compressed spring by one axis movement don't need be compressed again by the second axis movement. :joystick: ;)

Two x one, expansion x compression. Apple and oranges.

Hegy, is it possible to have the first post updated to show all the products you have planned? With over 130 pages now, it's painful to find everything. Really keen on an ejection handle and also a separate landing gear handle module.

Is not affected - or little - in CH, VKB, BAUR style gimbals with two expansions springs.

 

Is big affected in Warthog, T.16kM, X-5x's, Suncom style gimbal with one compression spring.

 

A compressed spring by one axis movement don't need be compressed again by the second axis movement. :joystick: ;)

 

Two x one, expansion x compression. Apple and oranges.

T16k and Suncom do not suffer the axis bleeding Warthog does, both being pretty decent gimbals from a kinematic standpoint despite having a single spring.

In Warthog's case it's not only the single spring, it presses against a piston which limits it's contact force point to a single location on the circumference, which robs the spring tension from everywhere else unlike the 2 above examples. Makes the stick happy to draw circles, but unable to draw a straight line to save its own life, especially if it crosses the detente.

I prefer discretely sprung axes (cams are my favorite) as well and gimbals I'm designing/making utilize them, but proper implementation of a single spring such as Suncom actually works pretty well and does not deserve a bad rap because of Warthog's questionable engineering.

As beautiful as your renders are, We have yet to see a working ship-able example of your work. I love your enthusiasm and business model, it caters very well to our needs and desires as Flight sim enthusiasts. Obviously very popular considering the length this thread has grown to. May I suggest you focus on the Hornet Grips for now, and get an actual product out the door? I am less concerned on bringing the price down by mass producing a huge variety of products, if no products are ever made.

Get me a working plug and play Hornet grip for my Warthog base, for under $300 USD, and I will be a happy man. I'm not even worried about the throttles at all. I do however want the same quality of switches that Thrustmaster uses, otherwise you haven't done anything more than re-create the old Suncom stick (Of which I own 4).

I am afraid that this thread is starting to go the direction of "Vaporwear." I hate to say it (because it means I am losing hope :( ) but I am almost at the point of I'll believe it when I see it.

Respectfully, Preston "Woogey" Martin

Everyone is certainly in a high froth over everything, myself included. :lol:

All your renders are beautiful and I see more than a few I'd love to get my hands on, but I do agree that it would be great to see a finished product, even at a higher price point than your target.

Is not affected - or little - in CH, VKB, BAUR style gimbals with two expansions springs.

 

Is big affected in Warthog, T.16kM, X-5x's, Suncom style gimbal with one compression spring.

 

A compressed spring by one axis movement don't need be compressed again by the second axis movement. :joystick: ;)

 

Two x one, expansion x compression. Apple and oranges.

...............................................I know.

In Warthog's case it's not only the single spring, it presses against a piston which limits it's contact force point to a single location on the circumference, which robs the spring tension from everywhere else unlike the 2 above examples. Makes the stick happy to draw circles, but unable to draw a straight line to save its own life, especially if it crosses the detente.

Oh yes. Not only that, but the piston doesn't even run on linear bearings, so the torsion creates friction when it moves up and down against the 4 posts. With my stick, the posts weren't straight either, so the piston would bind on them at the extremes of movement. I think (for me at least) this was the primary cause of the 'sticktion' that people so often report. Absolutely awful design.

BTW, those B17 boxes, I see some holes on the side. Are they meant to be connected together?

There will be mounting holes all over the boxes. I will provide all the desktop mounts so you can mount wherever and in whatever combination you want, be it generic style in front of the monitor, or full blown desktop mounted simpit with left, right and front modules.

I can't see a B17 cockpit selling in anywhere near the same numbers as, say, a DCS compatible P51, A10C, Ka50 etc... panel.

Although one is a personal favorite, it's also a different simulator and will be used as a FSX/P3d test-bed. Also, a 4 engine bomber has every kind of button/switch/lever/knob you can think of. And it will be a great practice to learn these military aviation markings. I will copy all of these amazingly cool looking details onto my "generic" button box, but I have to learn them first by copying real military aviation panels with as many different markings and switches as possible, B-17 has the most of them.

Hegy, is it possible to have the first post updated to show all the products you have planned? With over 130 pages now, it's painful to find everything. Really keen on an ejection handle and also a separate landing gear handle module.

Yeah I know, I've turned this thread into chit-chat. I'll update the first post.

As beautiful as your renders are, We have yet to see a working ship-able example of your work.

 

I am afraid that this thread is starting to go the direction of "Vaporwear." I hate to say it (because it means I am losing hope :( ) but I am almost at the point of I'll believe it when I see it.

Functional prototypes are starting to materialize. Soon I will start prototyping grips again too. But the grips manufacturing will require my full attention, unlike these panels and other simpler stuff, so these have to take priority. A few of these products first, then I can bring in the grips alongside.

Attached below is the almost finished prototype for the B-17 front switch box, which will be used as a test-bed for fsx/P3d platform, and also to copy the marking style onto my "generic" button box. It's still missing a bunch of screws and some of the coolest details like the magneto toggle connector, flaps switch guard and gear switch safety cover. Photographed alongside a Warthog throttle, for size comparison. Excuse the poor state of the throttle, it's used for reverse engineering, and for "what not to do".

More spring mod pictures when the custom springs arrive.

As beautiful as your renders are, We have yet to see a working ship-able example of your work.

<snip>

 

I am afraid that this thread is starting to go the direction of "Vaporwear." I hate to say it (because it means I am losing hope :( ) but I am almost at the point of I'll believe it when I see it.

I think I am pretty much there as well.

I wish hegykc the very best on his ventures here, I was fairly excited about the new grip that has been talked about for some time now, and then what I thought was going to be a new gimbal for the Warthog. Based on what I have seen I think the extension I already have for mine will serve fine for now.

Great Work,Looking forward to your product line

That's a really nice looking B17 unit Hegy, The concept of what you are doing is great and if you pull this off with all you have shown so far then it can only be good for all of us.

Don't be too cheap with the price, ensure it's finished well and charge appropriately as you have been putting a great deal of time and effort into this. As an idea, do you have plans for high end products with top quality finishes, switches and knobs etc?

That's a really nice looking B17 unit Hegy, The concept of what you are doing is great and if you pull this off with all you have shown so far then it can only be good for all of us.

 

Don't be too cheap with the price, ensure it's finished well and charge appropriately as you have been putting a great deal of time and effort into this. As an idea, do you have plans for high end products with top quality finishes, switches and knobs etc?

IIRC they are already top quality!

IIRC they are already top quality!

I was thinking the knobs and switches being high end. Everything else looks top notch.

I think I am pretty much there as well.

I wish hegykc the very best on his ventures here, I was fairly excited about the new grip that has been talked about for some time now, and then what I thought was going to be a new gimbal for the Warthog. Based on what I have seen I think the extension I already have for mine will serve fine for now.

He did post pictures just above your post. :) Those weren't renders (granted they weren't the grips) but given that that box is a real piece of equipment in his possession now, it certainly doesn't look like vapourware.

As beautiful as your renders are, We have yet to see a working ship-able example of your work.

He did post some pictures of his P-51 parts here as well. Actual pictures of the actual part in reality, not renders:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=170737

Yes, July and August pictures are real physical prototypes. And all further pics else will be real. Unless just to show what's coming here and there. These are even functional "customer-ready" units. The grip photo was a mockup non-functional unit, so I guess you can still call that one vaporware, but not for long.

All the toggle switches are the same as Warthog throttle ones, so a heavy industrial click. All the rotary selectors also. Only "problem" are the simple push-buttons, they have no "click" feedback nor a heavy spring so they're the only thing that feels "cheap" for now. Oh and the off-the-shelf stand-in knobs one might say, but I really like them for WWII stuff. Replica knobs will be 3d printed later on. Also I'll be doing my own push buttons, but that requires custom pcb's, custom mounting casings, and custom springs. But there are only a few push buttons on every 100 toggle/rotary inputs, so very few. I think there's 1 push button in the B-17 cockpit, and maybe 3 in P-51. I'm talking about the classic round buttons. Off-the-shelf buttons for CDU and MFCD are different kind and are ok. Right now the panels are 99%. The custom, industrial grade push buttons would bring it to 100%, but that 1% increase is going to cost more then all the panel prototyping put together. So for now, it'll stay at 99% and it'll still be the best, biggest, most badass thing you ever put on your desktop. All the profits will go to closing that gap and making it perfect asap.

Yes, July and August pictures are real physical prototypes. And all further pics else will be real. Unless just to show what's coming here and there. These are even functional "customer-ready" units. The grip photo was a mockup non-functional unit, so I guess you can still call that one vaporware, but not for long.

 

All the toggle switches are the same as Warthog throttle ones, so a heavy industrial click. All the rotary selectors also. Only "problem" are the simple push-buttons, they have no "click" feedback nor a heavy spring so they're the only thing that feels "cheap" for now. Oh and the off-the-shelf stand-in knobs one might say, but I really like them for WWII stuff. Replica knobs will be 3d printed later on. Also I'll be doing my own push buttons, but that requires custom pcb's, custom mounting casings, and custom springs. But there are only a few push buttons on every 100 toggle/rotary inputs, so very few. I think there's 1 push button in the B-17 cockpit, and maybe 3 in P-51. I'm talking about the classic round buttons. Off-the-shelf buttons for CDU and MFCD are different kind and are ok. Right now the panels are 99%. The custom, industrial grade push buttons would bring it to 100%, but that 1% increase is going to cost more then all the panel prototyping put together. So for now, it'll stay at 99% and it'll still be the best, biggest, most badass thing you ever put on your desktop. All the profits will go to closing that gap and making it perfect asap.

No pics of the headtracker yet... Isn't it strange?

Sent from my A210 using Tapatalk

I wish that people would stop slinging mud, complain or in general just make negative outbursts in here, and just jump off the thread if they don't like it.

It's just plain annoying having to read or have to skip post from people that has lost faith or similar.

Hegy has some plans to produce some nice stuff, but whatever becomes of those plans only time will tell.

So far nobody has lost any money and nobody is hurt. (Maybe except for Hegy).

Sorry for this, but I think it had to be said!

 

Sorry for this, but I think it had to be said!

Correct.

Today's prototype: B-17 autopilot panel. Wrong size knobs plus a few details missing.

I wish that people would stop slinging mud, complain or in general just make negative outbursts in here, and just jump off the thread if they don't like it.

It's just plain annoying having to read or have to skip post from people that has ''lost faith'' or similar.

Hegy has some plans to produce some nice stuff, but whatever becomes of those plans only time will tell.

So far nobody has lost any money and nobody is hurt. (Maybe except for Hegy).

 

Sorry for this, but I think it had to be said!

If people discussing things on a public forum is too much for you to bear, the Internet may not be for you. I think that it's important and a source of feedback for Hegy to know the sentiments of his potential market. For a while it felt like his product line was the "Star Citizen" of peripherals. However, he seems to have made some big steps as of late. Nobody hates him or wants him to fail. Fwiw, it's annoying to have to read you trying to silence the opinion of anyone who isn't purely a cheerleader.

Sent while I should be working instead.

I would agree, except that most of the negative comments have been rather sarcastic. Some of them read like a taunt. It's too often done very childishly rather than as adults discussing and giving feedback.

I look forward to wading through 200 pages of naysayers to quote all of them in one giant post.:)