Which Tornado do you want? - Page 21 - ED Forums
 


Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-15-2020, 09:14 AM   #201
QuiGon
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Germany
Posts: 15,085
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mig Fulcrum View Post
I would say not less than 5 years

I'm not joking, i'm serious
Probably true.
__________________
Intel i7-4790K @ 4x4GHz + 16 GB DDR3 + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

QuiGon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 09:49 AM   #202
QuiGon
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Germany
Posts: 15,085
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bananabrai View Post
What really stands out for me personally is ALARM, which to my knowledge was scrapped with the introduction of the GR.4.
This ARM is pretty versatile (more than other ARMs) and could be loaded to complement other loads. (On the stubs for example)
For me it is kind of a must-have. A 2-ship flight could cover itself with 4-8 ALARMS in Loiter-Mode and still perform a good strike.
British philosophy was not to have a dedicated SEAD asset, but that the flights could cover themselves and all birds should have the capability.
Hmm, the ALARM wasn't very well recieved by this article: https://hushkit.net/2020/08/04/the-t...t-for-the-raf/
Quote:
Suppression/Destruction of Enemy Defences



The Tornado was used in the defence suppression role in the 1999 Kosovo campaign. As Wing Commander Gordon Niven (retd) noted in ‘Tornado Boys’, the ALARM missile and Tornado combination was not very effective for the role, “Neither the missiles nor the Tornado was configured in any way remotely close to the capability of the USAF F-16 SEAD units.” The ALARM was used by RAF Tornados from 1990 until 2013, a short service life for a guided anti-radar weapon; the US equivalent, the AGM-88 HARM series, has been in service since 1985 with no planned retirement date. Today an RAF ALARM from the Kosovo campaign is displayed in the Belgrade air museum, it failed to self destruct or destroy a target and instead gently delivered itself by parachute into curious (and Russian-friendly) Yugoslav hands.
But it's a pretty one-sided article anyways...
__________________
Intel i7-4790K @ 4x4GHz + 16 GB DDR3 + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

QuiGon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 10:47 AM   #203
TLTeo
Senior Member
 
TLTeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,288
Default

I vaguely remember reading that the reason the ALARM was phased out is simply that they shot most (or all) of them. I don't have a source though.


edit: and yeah that article doesn't seem particularly objective. I agree with some bits (e.g. the political influence, the fact that the ADV made no sense when you could just upgrade Phantoms like Germany did), but other parts are purely anecdotal and don't really present anything useful.

Last edited by TLTeo; 09-15-2020 at 10:56 AM.
TLTeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 12:35 PM   #204
QuiGon
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Germany
Posts: 15,085
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TLTeo View Post
edit: and yeah that article doesn't seem particularly objective. I agree with some bits (e.g. the political influence, the fact that the ADV made no sense when you could just upgrade Phantoms like Germany did), but other parts are purely anecdotal and don't really present anything useful.
Yeah, it was linked in another Tornado thread and I came to the same conclusion as you: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php...7&postcount=49
__________________
Intel i7-4790K @ 4x4GHz + 16 GB DDR3 + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

QuiGon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 01:27 PM   #205
Spurts
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 100
Default

Are those Brimstone TERs?
Spurts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 03:02 PM   #206
TLTeo
Senior Member
 
TLTeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,288
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurts View Post
Are those Brimstone TERs?

Yep, that's pretty easy. Brimstones are basically the size of a Hellfire iirc.
TLTeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 03:06 PM   #207
Spurts
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 100
Default

I've just never seen a Tornado loaded like that
Spurts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 03:09 PM   #208
TLTeo
Senior Member
 
TLTeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,288
Default

I mean it was pretty rare because drag (I imagine), but even when they carried a single one, you could see the triple rack:





But yeah, it had some hilarious tank plinking capability:


https://youtu.be/oo6M1ZQcsh0?t=74
TLTeo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2020, 06:26 PM   #209
QuiGon
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Germany
Posts: 15,085
Default

I never understood why Germany didn't adopt the Brimstone. Well, maybe some day...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spurts View Post
I've just never seen a Tornado loaded like that
They can carry quiet a bit if needed: https://youtu.be/ubotyWqmPf4?t=135
That's 2x A-A missiles, 3x A-G missiles, 2x LGBs and 5x pods (2x fuel, 2x CM, 1x TGP) on a single aircraft.
__________________
Intel i7-4790K @ 4x4GHz + 16 GB DDR3 + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!


Last edited by QuiGon; 09-15-2020 at 06:31 PM.
QuiGon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2020, 07:59 AM   #210
Bananabrai
Member
 
Bananabrai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: ETSM
Posts: 328
Default

Well, I was wrong about the ALARM phase out then.

I see the critic of the pilot there.
HARMs self destruct simply by the velocity they have, If they hit nothing. Very useful.

In my opinion it's true that the ALARM is not such a good SEAD weapon for dedicated SEAD missions.
It is however a good SEAD self protection as a ride-along weapon for other missons.
An example would be a flight of GR.1As doing reconnaissance, covering their photo-run, etc.

We are starting to get good dedicated SEAD platforms in DCS, the F-18 is okay, JF-17 is good and the F-16C B50 is a true SEAD bird.

But the ALARM can be seen as a way better SideARM.
__________________
Wish list: late DCS: GR.1 (with GR.1B) Tornado, Improved Combined Arms (like OFP/ArmA I/ArmA II), Improved Logistics
Build: Ryzen 3800X on X570, GTX 980 Ti, 32GB DDR4-3200 | Virpil T-50CM Stick & Throttle, MFG Crosswind Pedals, TrackIR 5
Bananabrai is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hl³ confirmed

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT. The time now is 12:39 AM. vBulletin Skin by ForumMonkeys. Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.