Thrustmaster Cougar intermittent stick button problem

Greetings everyone,

I use a Cougar with throttle, and the buttons on the stick handle are intermittent. All of the axes work fine, and the throttle's functions are all fine, but the stick handle buttons are a pain!

They usually work in Windows 7, but after a flying a mission or two, all of the stick buttons stop working altogether. The only one that works is the trigger, and it produces a wild array of glitchy outputs on all buttons from 1 to 6 or 7 in the Cougar test program.

Sometimes, re-flashing the stick firmware works for a short time, but not always. Removing the stick handle and plugging it back in again fixes it for a short time, as I've recently found. However, the 'flaky' stick buttons always return.

The electrical wiring in the stick handle is fine, the buttons either all work, or they don't.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

AD

Ground wire open and short with the mass somewhere. Check wires while moving the stick, not in static position.

Ground wire open and short with the mass somewhere. Check wires while moving the stick, not in static position.

Thanks, but all done. Loosened stick clamp ring and fiddled with stick; still glitchy. Only thing that works temporarily is either re-flashing firmware (sometimes works), or removing stick handle and holding trigger, then re-installing stick handle.

The stupid Cougar is a fiddly little bitch, I paid $200 for mine well-used and it was still too much. If I had paid $600 for it new, I'd have been royally pissed! Unfortunately, the reliable but affordable sticks (Logitech, CH Products etc.) are all cheap junk (and they all have problems too).

Still hacking at it... Wish I could just enjoy the stupid sim for what it is instead of dealing with crap.

AD

Buy the thrustmaster warthog hotas and use the cougar handle on that or just buy the warthog joystick on its own and if you want to use the cougar handle on it then you can.

Mind you, buying the warthog stick on its own isnt that much cheaper than buying the complete hotas set.

Buy the thrustmaster warthog hotas and use the cougar handle on that or just buy the warthog joystick on its own and if you want to use the cougar handle on it then you can.

 

Mind you, buying the warthog stick on its own isnt that much cheaper than buying the complete hotas set.

Great idea, only $600 for the Warthog here in Canada...

That's why I insist on trying to fix the Cougar, these infernal sticks are too expensive for what they are--nice looking, solid-feeling, cheap junk. The Warthog has plenty of problems, I want one stick I can use, not two that I can't :)

I restored my old used Cougar to top shape mechanically, and replaced the pots with Hall effect sensors, all that works great. But, the buttons on the stick handle are glitchy now. Started happening a few months ago.

Thanks anyway

AD

Maybe is the Shift Register PCB inside grip that became defective, is this circuit that translate button press in serial code for base controller.

Ask Tm for replacement - if available.

Maybe is the Shift Register PCB inside grip that became defective, is this circuit that translate button press in serial code for base controller.

 

Ask Tm for replacement - if available.

That's what I'm thinking... But, the Cougar hasn't been supported for years, they want to sell the Warthog now and probably can't be bothered with people nagging them about an old product. I suppose I could try calling them (long distance of course, and probably half an hour on hold) and see what they say.

Shift register eh? So you actually know how these little boogers work inside--very cool. My best guess is that it was to eliminate a huge pile of wires passing through the stick base, and also to make the handle conveniently removable. Nifty, but annoying to diagnose when it don't work!

The little circuit board in the handle also has a pile of resistors on the opposite side of the board from the ICs. I wonder if one of them is cooked, possibly related to holding the trigger in to erase the flash memory. Or, if replacing one of them with a different value would make the thing reliable.

They should have sorted this out themselves... maybe they did, and I just got a duff one.

Thanks for the thinkage :)

AD

Warthog grip use the same Shift Register mc used in Cougar - CD4021B.

Not sure if use the same connectors type for buttons/HAT wires.

Think the above picture is from Cougar.

Warthog grip use the same Shift Register mc used in Cougar - CD4021B.

Not sure if use the same connectors type for buttons/HAT wires.

 

Think the above picture is from Cougar.

It does look like the Cougar... I contacted tech support at TM, they say it's either the shift register circuit board, or the stick base main board, or the 5-pin connectors in the stick handle and base.

Since the board for the handle is $60 shipped, replacing all three components would cost a lot more than the stick is worth to me, and might not even fix it!! It very well could be a driver bug as well, not a hardware problem.

I have my Leo Bodnar USB circuit kicking around, which always worked perfectly... If push comes to shove, I'll probably just stuff that in, if I can find small enough fine-stranded wire to do it with. The stick handle would require 26 wires, not just 5.

Man, what a pain in the arse!

AD

You can try first replace the 5 pin (pS2) connector (if possible), is available in electronic stores/eBay.

The Shift Register you can make one for less than ~$20 - in Debolestis topic are the PCB for print in OSPark, compatible with Tm grips fixation holes.

If the above fail, rest replace the base circuit - a Arduino PRO micro (~$6) + MMJoy2 firmware is compatible with Tm Shift Register, what make things easy.

BU0836 is not compatible with Shift Register, use 6x6 Diode Matrix, this will require make a new PCB with diode matrix for grip. GVL224 sell this PCB (TmW/Cougar compatible) - with diodes, ready to use ($5).

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=887

You can try first replace the 5 pin (pS2) connector (if possible), is available in electronic stores/eBay.

 

The Shift Register you can make one for less than ~$20 - in Debolestis topic are the PCB for print in OSPark, compatible with Tm grips fixation holes.

 

If the above fail, rest replace the base circuit - a Arduino PRO micro (~$6) + MMJoy2 firmware is compatible with Tm Shift Register, what make things easy.

 

BU0836 is not compatible with Shift Register, use 6x6 Diode Matrix, this will require make a new PCB with diode matrix for grip. GVL224 sell this PCB (TmW/Cougar compatible) - with diodes, ready to use ($5).

 

http://avia-sim.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=887

Wow, thanks! If I use my BU0836A I'd probably just run a huge bundle of small wires, that way the circuitry stays simple--just Leo's PCB itself.

A recent email I got from Thrustmaster states that it's probably the main stick circuit board itself... Which is strange, since the rest of the system works well, only the stick handle is acting up.

At this stage in the game I'd rather just fly the stupid sim rather than jerk around with nonsense, but that's just the way it goes. Oh well. Maybe I should find something else to do with my time other than this...

If I use my BU0836A I'd probably just run a huge bundle of small wires, that way the circuitry stays simple--just Leo's PCB itself.

Is doable wire without diode matrix PCB, just add one diode for wire or pin in each button/HAT.

Which will "complicate" is the need to replace the handle PS2 5 pin connector due the amount of wires need in matrix - the grip has 22 buttons:

POV HAT = 4

HAT 4 way x 3 = 12

Press buttons (include trigger/paddle) = 6

This mean use 6 'Columns' and 4 'Rows' of BU0836 matrix = 10 wires, what need a 10 pin replacement for the actual PS2 5 pins connector.

Mini-DIM 10 pin connector is available.

I have a spare joystick if you are interested.

Warthog joystick, the bottom half needs reflashed in manual mode to work or needs to be sent back to TM to do it.

However the actual stick/handle part works perfectly and may fit on your stick ? as they are supposed to be interchangable.

You could buy that from me if interested.

If so pm me.

I have a spare joystick if you are interested.

 

Warthog joystick, the bottom half needs reflashed in manual mode to work or needs to be sent back to TM to do it.

 

However the actual stick/handle part works perfectly and may fit on your stick ? as they are supposed to be interchangable.

 

You could buy that from me if interested.

 

If so pm me.

Thanks, but if the problem is in the main PCB in the stick base, replacing the handle won't help any. I appreciate the offer.

I'm giving it a bit of a rest for now, it would be nice if 2.5 came out so I could go back to it... If I really want to fix this thing I'll probably have to graft Leo Bodnar's controller into the stick. Ten wires from the handle to the base, and I'll probably just run wires directly, no plugs. Why remove the handle anyway...

Thanks all

AD

Stick buttons don´t work

Hi,

I buy a used Cougar a 2 days ago, in a box. perfect, all original.

but in instalation, no buttons work in stick, only on trottle.

I try to update the firmware but the cougar update says that I did not press the trigger long enough. I'm suspecting the buttons do not work and the trigger does not respond to update.

the ccp does not enter because the firmware is outdated.

Can someone help me.

Since all the buttons are not working, there are two probable causes:

The plug connector on the base of the stick's handle is broken, or the wiring connector is not plugged onto the joysticks pcb.

First unscrew the handle and take a look at both connectors there to see if its damaged. Second, open up the base, there are only 4 screws hidden under the rubber feets, these have a very soft glue, and can be put back again later (i put mine in such a way that they dont hide the screws, for easy future access.

The pcb is inverted, you can check it by unscrewing the outside connector screws (4) and then unscrew the pcb and carefully turn it over and check it, there should be three cable connectors, one for each axis and one for the button wires.

Take photos and show us how they are.

Incredible that people sells things without telling its true state ... hope karma will strike them back.

Cougar buttons work again

Rudel,

The conditions it is excellent, in fact it is new

I open de joy to see the cabes from Mini Din,

and seemingly perfect.

except for the loose mini din cable. I undid the plate, the screws were even sealed. Plug the cable back into the card and mount it.

Everything worked normally.

I thank you for your attention Rudel!

... Everything worked normally.

¿? sorry, not sure If I'm understanding correctly ... you mean that after this checking now the buttons are working ok?

Yes, all working normaly

I'm glad that you could sort it out :)

Same problem from begin of subject

Now my problem is another, in throttle some buttons are pressed, dogfight uhf and microswitch. later they return to normal. I opened the throttle and saw no loose cables or grounding. It's very similar to the initial case here, but it's in throttle I suspect it's some diode. But I am not aware of electronics to state if something flashing is a damaged diode. Anybody know?